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Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel

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skyharborcowboy

01-30-2008 07:37:59

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How wide a disc can a one of these tractors handle? I was looking at the CaseIH website and their new disc say that they require about 8HP per Working Foot so I am assuming that I can use up to a 8 foot wide disc but how big a diameter can the discs be and how many discs can be in those 8 Ft? I also dont know if that is for a single row or a dual row.

Thanks,

Joe

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georgeky

02-01-2008 16:03:41

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

Anything over 9 or 10 foot will pull the guts out of your tactor in some conditions. I pull a 10 foot Burch dick behind my 666 the same as 656, and it works the the snot out of it the first time over plowed ground. After that when the ground has settled it will fly with the 10 footer. It will not handle these 11, 12 and 13 foot recommendations you have gotten here.

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BOBM25

01-30-2008 17:14:25

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

We have a 28' 490. You can hurt our MX170 (145 hp) with it if she sinks down. That is a big heavy disk. It will cut deeper than the blade hubs in loose soil if you let it. Now in the fall using it on soybean stubble, you don't know its back there. They deepest you can get it to cut is about 2 inches. I think a 10 footer would be good since you have sandy loose soil. Our MX is FWA so that helps. I don't think a 145hp 2wd tractor would do it sometimes.

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JoshuaGA

01-30-2008 17:06:37

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

I have a 12' Bush Hog harrow that will bring a 120 horse tractor to its knees in tough conditions, and have a Long 10' harrow that that same tractor could pull in road gear if need be. Generally the heavier the harrow, the larger the discs, the deeper it cuts, and the more horsepower it needs.
JoshuaGA

P.S. Has anyone ever seen or used a Lilliston Rolling Harrow? Heavy thing, uses spider wheels in place of discs. We have one.

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GordoSD

01-30-2008 14:39:36

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

There is more to discing than just hooking it up and driving up and down a field. With an offset you are tossing a lot of soil and residue one direction or the other. If you make a U turn now you are tossing soil back to the 'windrow again. You will wind up with a very uneven field.
With a tandem you need to insure the front and rear sections are working together. The fronts will pull the soil in to the center . the rears take it back out. If you are not level, or have the rears set to different angle than the front, then again your field will be totally wrecked. Best method for prepping seedbed is disc, then plow, then double disc. I'd recommend you search for the RIGHT implement, not the available or cheap one. A 12 to 14 tandem, 18 inch discs is the right one for you. Be sure and take your tape measure. Discs worn down more than an inch are useless.

Gordo

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Hugh MacKay

01-30-2008 16:10:02

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to GordoSD, 01-30-2008 14:39:36

Gordon: YTer's in general use a lot of useless disks. Visit my posting below. I've always been amazed at how much disk some of these guys can pull, you've got the answer.

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billde

01-30-2008 15:35:38

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to GordoSD, 01-30-2008 14:39:36

A regular tandem disc ie IH 470, 480, the front gang throws the dirt away from center. The rear gang pulls the dirt back to center.

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GordoSD

01-31-2008 07:53:17

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to billde, 01-30-2008 15:35:38

You're hooking it up backwards:) My green disc is what I referred to. Either way you get my drift.

Gordo

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Hugh MacKay

01-30-2008 13:43:59

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

skyharborcowboy: Lot depends on what your disking and how you use it. I had 22' disk, 10' of wings, 20" blades, basically 12' with the wings up and the 12' could stop my 656 if you let it drop in relatively loose soil. Before that disk, I owned a 12' with 18" blades, and under most plowed conditions it would make my 560 or 656 work damn hard.

Allan is showing you 14' disk, but what is he disking? Grain stubble, gives one ideal traction and the least amount of penetration. Put him on that stubble plowed, and a 656 would be pressed to find traction, unless his $900. disk is worn out and wont cut.

Since coming to YT, I've seen some horrendous claims about how much disk a particular tractor could pull. All I can think, is they're either skimming the surface or the damn disk is worn out and wont cut. I started off my farming days with an 8', 28 blade, 18" blade Oliver behind a Farmall 300, and yes it played with it under some conditions, but I've also seen it take the old 300 right to 2nd gear. I then bought a 12', 44 blade, 18" blade Oliver that did much the same with either 560 or 656 diesels. Then I moved to a 22', 88 blade, 20" blade Bush Hog and by gosh it did much the same with a 1066. In all cases they could play with those disks, but they could also work the blazes out of those tractors. You know what you want to achive, act accordingly.

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Up North Louie

01-30-2008 13:20:40

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

Yes, they represent that type of disk.
You will have to weight your disk down pretty hard if you're going to try to tear up sod. Then it's probably not the tool for the job.
I have torn up old hayfield/pasture with a spring tooth quack drag making repeated passes in all different directions. I do that because we have ungodly amounts of rock where I live. A mold board plow is pretty much an invitation to the blues. Then I go over it with a disk and seed with a Brillion cultipacker/drill combination. I guess I use the quack drag kind of like a chisel plow, just to a lesser degree of penetration.

I am told that disk plows would work up here with all the clay and rock, but I have never fooled with one and I wouldn't know.

I kind of doubt you'll get the kind of tillage you need with just a disk. Seems to me it would just roll along the top and make slits, unless you turn them to max angle and pile on a lot of weight.

Don

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skyharborcowboy

01-30-2008 12:21:57

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to gene bender, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

mkirsch said: (quoted from post at 15:16:36 01/30/08)
If all you're doing is "fitting," that is breaking up and smoothing freshly plowed land, the HP per foot requirement is much smaller. The disk for this purpose has the two rows of disks arranged in an X.

The photos above represent the X pattern used for Fitting purposes correct?

Joe

PS. Our planned use is to break up the soil get rid of the tumble weeds and be able to plant some bermuda pastures when we are done.

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mkirsch

01-30-2008 12:16:36

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to Bob, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

That 8HP per foot figure is for a an offset disk if I'm not mistaken. These disks are the ones with the two rows of disks set in a large V. You're actually digging up the packed-down earth with this type of disk.

If all you're doing is "fitting," that is breaking up and smoothing freshly plowed land, the HP per foot requirement is much smaller. The disk for this purpose has the two rows of disks arranged in an X.

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Up North Louie

01-30-2008 11:58:24

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

I pull a 12 foot tandem with a 560 gasser in third and I hardly notice that it's there. Until I want to turn it through a 14 foot gate. Then I notice pretty hard...

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South Texas

01-30-2008 10:32:38

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

I pull a 12 foot tandem in sandy loam soil with my 656D. It is a good match, if it were any bigger I think I would have to carry the disk (lower the wheels so that the disks don't cut in so deep).

When looking at a disk consider that an offset disk pulls heavier than a tandem (center cut) disk. I have pulled a 9foot offset disk that was too much for my 656. Spacing betweeen the actual disks makes a difference, too. The more space between disks the heavier the pull. Mine has 9" between disks.

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billde

01-30-2008 10:15:45

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

A 13 1/2 ft 470 would be an excellent match.

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Paul Simmer

01-30-2008 09:50:13

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

I pull a 9 1/2 foot with a DC case. I would think a 656 would play with something that small.

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skyharborcowboy

01-30-2008 08:35:10

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

We have Sandy Loam for soil where I am at. What are the advantages/disadvantages of smaller Vs. larger discs?

Joe

PS. I love this site. The education you get here is incredible!

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HENRY E NC

01-30-2008 09:56:04

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 08:35:10

I pulled a 12 foot disc with a 65 HP MF a few years ago in sandy loam in eastern SC and it was not a big load at all. It even went thru the bog holes in the field when the tractor would sink considerably without too much trouble. Henry

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Allan In NE

01-30-2008 08:48:21

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 08:35:10

The older smaller discs were designed for farming and tillage.

As near as I can tell, the newer larger ones are just like the new tractors in that they are designed solely to separate you from your money. :>)

Allan

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Nebraska Cowman

01-30-2008 08:21:52

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

Yeah, the older smaller disks don't pull near as hard as the big boys (don't run as deep) So yeah, Your 656 will handle 10 or 12 feet nicely. 3rd gear. 4th is way too fast.

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skyharborcowboy

01-30-2008 07:51:03

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

Thanks, that is good to know because one of my neighbors may have located a 10 footer for a good price (I dont know what that is yet). What is a good price for one anyway?

joe

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karl f

01-30-2008 18:43:11

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:51:03

price would be scrap on up, depending on condition. say for example that to put all new blades and bearings on the disk would be $1200. that would be about your max price if it has all new blades and bearings, but the frame looks worn. a good frame could add quite a bit to the price. the more worn things are, the faster the price goes lower. my dad bought a 14 ft case disk with 40 blades at 9" spacing about 10 yrs ago when we were in a bind for around $500. it had all the outside blades damaged, one of the adjusting screws was broken, and the frame showed signs of previous repairs. we got one season out of it, and a couple bearings and a few blades ended up biting the bullet. We decided to rebuild it this year. found out the blades were 2" worn! bearings and blades approached $1700. The up side to it is that it will be like a new disk once assembled, and shouldn't need much attention for a long time.

hope this helps you get an idea of what you might be getting into

karl f

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Allan In NE

01-30-2008 08:02:15

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:51:03

Boy, I dunno.

I gave $900 for this 14/15 foot 3 or 4 years ago.

Just don't think you're gonna be happy with a 10'. Just too darned small for that 656D.

Allan

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GordoSD

01-30-2008 16:10:05

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to Allan In NE, 01-30-2008 08:02:15

Allen, What do those discs measure out at? I picked up a 15 foot AW15 a few years ago for 550 up here. but its green! Discs measured out at 17 3/4. I use it for chopping up corn and milo food plots that have never been harvested. Run over them with a 7 foot Woods BrushBull first though. That was new at 2500.

Gordo

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Allan In NE

01-30-2008 17:39:35

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to GordoSD, 01-30-2008 16:10:05

I dunno.

I always measure the "actual cut". Think this one is at 14'7" cranked clear to the max if I remember right.

Would measure wider if it was straightened out I guess.

Allan

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Allan In NE

01-30-2008 07:44:50

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Re: Pulling a Disc with a 656 Diesel in reply to skyharborcowboy, 01-30-2008 07:37:59

A 656D will easily handle a 12 foot tandem in 3rd gear.

Allan

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