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Ford 9N, 2N & 8N Discussion Forum
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Leaded gas?

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Rob N VA

03-01-2005 18:52:24




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I understand that the N engine has hardened valve seats and dosen't need lead in the gas for lubrication. I am confused about the whole lead thing. I thought lead was originally introduced to gasoline in the early days of refinement to boost octane ratings, not to lubricate valves. It seems (to me) that any gasoline additive like that would foul up the spark plugs in a hurry. So whats the deal? Do some engines require lead as a lubricant? If so, how does that work?
Thanks!!---Rob

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Dean

03-02-2005 05:30:24




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 Re: Leaded gas? in reply to Rob N VA, 03-01-2005 18:52:24  
Indeed, tetraethyl lead was originally developed as a gasoline additive to increase the octane rating so as to allow higher compression ratio engine designs without damage caused by detonation. The erosion-reducing effect upon non hardened valve seats of the lead was an undexpected side effect. This effect resulted more from the cushioning effect of the additive than any lubricating effect.

Valve seat erosion resulting from the use of lead free gasoline in engines without hardened valve seats is usually insignificant unless the engine is operated at high output for extended periods of time. Engines designed for such use will no doubt have hardened valve seats as do most (all?) industrial/commercial engines including the N engines. The use of lead free gas in early farm tractors seems to be of little concern.

Dean

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Jimmy D

03-01-2005 19:10:44




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 Re: Leaded gas? in reply to Rob N VA, 03-01-2005 18:52:24  
The short answer is that leaded fuel is much ado bout nothing...I wouldn't worry about it. If you would like more detail, you can do a google search on leaded fuel and read the details, but it is a waste of your time...unless you like to watch paint dry.
Not meant to be smart...just funny



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gahorN

03-02-2005 13:09:23




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 Re: Leaded gas? in reply to Jimmy D, 03-01-2005 19:10:44  
I wish someone, someday, somewhere ...would find the article that talked about how the engine manufacturers had a problem with valve seat erosion and so the problem was solved by the miracle of lead being added to fuel. It's pure poppycock.
Lead was discovered and used for only ONE purpose...to raise apparent octane..and that's all. It's harmful to engines. It contaminates oil, it causes build-up on valve stems and increased wear of valve guides, stuck valves, and early failure of spark plugs. (Why do you suppose spark plugs now last over 100K in automobiles? Why do you suppose old cars used to be considered worn out at 75K miles, but now they commonly go well over 200K?) Lead substitutes are most commonly merely alcohol (or rarely alcohol and phosphorus) and is bad for the fuel system. There is absolutely NO BENEFICIAL attribute of common lead substitutes except to snake-oil salesmen's bank accounts. And on low compression engines like these tractors there is ABSOLUTELY NO BENEFIT TO LEADED FUEL...and lots of damaging reasons not to use the stuff. (Hold on a minute....let me put on my Nomex fire-suit and head for the bunker...I think I may hear incoming.....)

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Joe(NYC)

03-02-2005 21:46:02




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 Re: Leaded gas? in reply to gahorN, 03-02-2005 13:09:23  
I have a 1971 Continental Mark III. In 1982 with only 45,000 miles on it I took it off registration and up on blocks. Leaded gas was very difficult to find so I was using unleaded. The engine a 460 CI high compression called for 100 octane of leaded gas. Everything was fine while I was using leaded gas. When it was no longer available while on blocks I ran the engine for half an hour every two weeks in all gears. One day while sitting inside the car in neutral and idling I heard this tremendous loud banging from the engine. Shut it off. Waited a few minutes to calm myself down. I restarted it and the banging slowly dissipated but noticed that the car had a vibration now althought it idled smoothly. Then I noticed it started smoking some. I performed a compression test dry and wet. Found one cylinder was like 40 psi on both dry wet. Don't recall anymore which cylinder but believe the valves on it went south. It's been in the garage ever since and still on blocks. Never did anything more to it since. I am 60 now and still think (maybe dreeaming) of getting it back on the road some day. That is one unbelievable engine. When properly tuned I got 18.5 MPG on the highway with 4 people in with the AC running full blast. That's 365 HP pushing 4800 lbs plus passengers. According to the collectors price guide this car has a pretty high value (if restored).

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