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12 volt delco alt.

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B. Jones

03-06-2007 19:25:26

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I put a 12 volt delco alternator on a diesel tractor that has no ignition switch. The only switch is run by oil pressure and it turns on the fuel gauge. I decided to use a diode and hook it to the starter terminal that is only hot when you press the starter switch. It seemed to work fine with the diode. If I hook it in with the fuel gauge it stays energized until the oil pressure goes down to zero then it turns off. That takes 8- 10 seconds when the oil is cold. I know this is the Ford site and this is a 180 MF diesel but this is where I always find the best electrical guys hanging out. Both hook ups seemed to work at least in 40 degree weather. Hooked to the pressure switch it would go off and on about 3 times before it would finally quit. Thanks for any help on this.

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B. Jones

03-07-2007 11:40:42

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Re: 12 volt delco alt. in reply to B. Jones, 03-06-2007 19:25:26

Thanks a lot guys. I was really hopeing you guys would reply back and you did. Bob it only bounces when I shut the motor off. I watch the oil pressure drop from about 40 of course to zero. With the motor off the fuel gauge is still working and the ammeter is showing about 5 amps of discharge through my diode. When the oil pressure finally hits zero everything shuts off, fuel gauge goes to empty, ammeter to 0 and everything is fine except it turns right back on and off at least 5 or 6 times in just a very few seconds. Fuel gauge on off, ammeter 0 to minus 5 on off all real quick until it is fully off. In other words the switch is bouncing on and off several times before it reaches fully off. The bounce thing lasts about 3 to 4 seconds, not really very long. The old 25 amp generator was not able to pull the electrical load on our pull type sprayer with foam marker. The alternator works great other than the bounce thing on shut down and if that doesn't hurt anything I may just leave it alone. Sound Guy, your solution was just a little bit over my head but I might be able to figure it out. Don't worry I will not use a 1 wire alternator, I like the 3 wire set up much better. Again thank you guys very much for all your help on this. I wasn't getting many replys on the Massey Board, and since I own a 1947 2-n I felt at home here on the Ford Board.

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Bob

03-06-2007 20:19:24

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Re: 12 volt delco alt. in reply to B. Jones, 03-06-2007 19:25:26

There's nothing wrong with using the current from the oil pressure switch that powers the gauges to "excite" the alternator and the diode is a GOOD idea to protect the alternator's internal regulator from "backfeeding" current out the #1 "switched excite" terminal. I would PREFER that method as the regulator would be exposed to a Big voltage surge each time the solenoid is disengaged using the other method.

There is NO HARM to the alternator from the oil pressure switch remaining closed for a few seconds at shutdown.

The only part of your post I don't understand is "Hooked to the pressure switch it would go off and on about 3 times before it would finally quit".

Are you saying you also have a "idiot light" in the circuit which goes off and on a couple of times as the engine coasts to a stop? THAT I don't understand!

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souNdguy

03-07-2007 04:54:36

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Re: 12 volt delco alt. in reply to Bob, 03-06-2007 20:19:24

Hey bob, I'll bet he could build a real quick comp circuit. Use an "L" filter in the #1 line, have a say.. 1000-2000uf cap across the switched hot terminal and then a suitable inductor in line with the #1 terminal. At the same time he could parallel a diode and a NE lamp and place them across the switched hot terminal, of course with the diode oriented so that it only conducted Reverse EMF..( cathode to + of 'coil'.. etc.. ) etc. I pretty much try to diode compensate any relays i find on my tractors or equipment that contains computers.. etc..

The cap, inductor, ne buld and diode I mentioned could be bought for less than 5$ at a rat schack.. etc..

Soundguy

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Bob

03-07-2007 07:38:03

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Re: 12 volt delco alt. in reply to souNdguy, 03-07-2007 04:54:36

GREAT idea Soundguy but PROBABLY too much deviation from the kiss principle!

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souNdguy

03-07-2007 07:45:06

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Re: 12 volt delco alt. in reply to Bob, 03-07-2007 07:38:03

Seems like the guy deviated from the Kiss principle when he went to a 12v alternator from what was probably a 12v generator that did what he needed 'automagically'.

My next advice then would be for him to simply run a 194 lamp off the run side of an ignition switch.. probably the easiest thing i guess..

Soundguy

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Bob

03-07-2007 08:40:48

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Re: 12 volt delco alt. in reply to souNdguy, 03-07-2007 07:45:06

He stated he has no ignition switch on his diesel.

The oil pressure switch that is already there to power the gauges should work to "excite" the alternator, too.

He is just a little unclear when he says "Hooked to the pressure switch it would go off and on about 3 times before it would finally quit".

He apparently has an "idiot light" already. I just don't "get" the part about "it would go off and on about 3 times before it would finally quit".

I really can't see the oil pressure switch slowly "bouncing" at shut down!

In any case, as long as the alternator is exciting and charging, it will probably work just fine the way it is.

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souNdguy

03-07-2007 11:02:20

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Re: 12 volt delco alt. in reply to Bob, 03-07-2007 08:40:48

Now I see what you mean.. no ignition switch.

Hmm.. odd about the on / off. maybee the alternator power backfeed from #1 was keeping the gas gauge bouncing on / off as the engine died down to around 300/400 rpme range?????

Dunno??

Soundguy

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Dell (WA)

03-06-2007 20:02:50

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Re: 12 volt delco alt. in reply to B. Jones, 03-06-2007 19:25:26

Jonesie..... ..Ya gotta understand, the "diode trick" is for turning off sparkies, and you have a DIESEL? that needs sparkles?

Ya also gotta understand, the typical 3-wire Delco 10-SI with built-in voltage regulator only needs a kick in the "excite" to start charging. So a quick-tickle from the starter motor is plenty adequate. Yeah, keep the diode, won't hurt 'nuttin'.

Me? I'd stay away from that oilpressure operated voltage and away from the fuelgauge volts too.

And DEFINITELY stay away from that deceptively desirable 1-wire alternator conversion crap. It don't start charging until yer cold diesel engine is rappin' 1800rpms.

Me? Iff'n yer having chargin' problems, take'er into autoparts store for a "free" check-out ..... .Dell

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