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new project, unsticking a WD, how involved?

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karl f

02-29-2008 20:21:47




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flashback to about 1980: a WD is overhauled, and then probably not even 50 hours put on, and then sold at auction. it is bought and used for a yard tractor until about 1983 when someone does not cover the muffler, and subsequently the engine seizes. the muffler is covered and the tractor is towed out of the way. oil is put in the cylinders a few times in the 90s but the engine remains stuck.

how much will need to be done to this engine internally? should the head come off? the oil still looks clean. fuel system will need major attention at this point, 25 yr old gas is never good.
i unstuck another engine last summer that had only been sitting a year or two with a big prybar on a flywheel bolt (and monthly oil soaking starting within a week of the rainstorm that did it in ). hoping i might have same luck but 25 years is 5000% stronger rust bond. not as good of access to flywheel on a WD as the other make i did though :( the crank pins are in a weird spot (almost vertical), and likely not strong enough for good brute force anyhow. i bent an IH crank up just pullin hard on it one time.

the worse part is no shed, shop, shelter of any type so stuck workin wherever they sit.



karl f

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Robert cook

03-03-2008 21:14:16




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 Re: new project, unsticking a WD, how involved? in reply to karl f, 02-29-2008 20:21:47  
dear karl, I unstuck my granddads 1953 super m farmall. (one owner, now im restoreing it this summer) that sat for ten years, by useing seafoam brand lube and atf. it worked great after about two weeks i had it running perfect. try it , it might work for you good luck, Robert



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karl f

03-02-2008 10:27:00




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 Re: new project, unsticking a WD, how involved? in reply to Jeff Z., 02-29-2008 20:21:47  
thanks. now to get some motivation, warm weather, and finish my other projects.

karl f



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El Toro

03-03-2008 16:22:00




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 Re: new project, unsticking a WD, how involved? in reply to karl f, 03-02-2008 10:27:00  
I used ATF on a Farmall that was stuck and I don't think it was ever sheltered. The head and pan was already off when I bought the tractor. I poured ATF on top of the pistons and let it soak while I unbolted the steering and engine. I pulled the engine and used a piece of 2X2 oak and a hammer to tap on the rods after removing the cap. Some of the sleeves came out with the pistons and I needed the rods so I heated the old sleeves. I tore the engine completely down and steam cleaned the block since it was sludged up.

I had to replace the tires, rims, steering wheel,
wiring and fenders. New sleeve kit, valves, guides, clutch relined, crank polished and new bearings and it ran like new. Hal

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mlpankey

03-01-2008 18:41:42




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 Re: new project, unsticking a WD, how involved? in reply to karl f, 02-29-2008 20:21:47  
havent came across one yet that a eight pound sledge and a 2inch pipe on each piston wouldnt free up .and still have yet to bust apiston marked the tops with the pipe alittle usually they clean up . i would like to know how much force it takes to bust a piston . cause my 6ft2 260 frame cant. my 300 plus pound dad just laughs every time i try cause he knows its defeat cause they always turn before they bust.

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JMS/.MN

03-01-2008 12:22:53




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 Re: new project, unsticking a WD, how involved? in reply to karl f, 02-29-2008 20:21:47  
There is no "book" answer for that- one cylinder can be stuck, or all of them and to varying degrees. ATF is probably the best to loosen stuck rings or pistons. Also loosens rings, tightens them, increases compression without any disassembly. Kroil might be second best. WD-40 is as effective as skunk urine. Diesel fuel or oil is nothing.... just keeps them wet and lubed. Taking off the oil pan and beating upward with a hammer and drift? Too easy to miss, plus difficult to do. Take off the pan, take off the rod caps, marking each one with location, set up a bottle jack on blocking, reach from the jack to the wrist pin with a drift, and jack everything up. If it doesn"t come loose with the tractor off the floor, whack the front end of the tractor with a post maul. Worst case I had, "37 WC, skidloader bucket pushing down on the front end. Didn"t loosen while pushing with the jack. Filled the bucket with sand- 1300 lbs. Started pushing out the sleeve. Bolted a bar across the top- jacked it up, and the piston was free. Put new rings in- runs fine now.

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luke baxter

03-01-2008 12:17:52




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 Re: new project, unsticking a WD, how involved? in reply to karl f, 02-29-2008 20:21:47  
My experience says pull the head and pan and free it manually. Caution should be taken when hammering, impacting, cranking, dragging or anything of to sort so as to not bend a rod. Having said that I have freed motors soakin with PB Blaster and TAPPING the pistons with a hardwood dowel through the cylinder head.



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Jayw

03-01-2008 05:11:14




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 Re: new project, unsticking a WD, how involved? in reply to karl f, 02-29-2008 20:21:47  
Carl
I am currently finishing up a 51 WD that was stuck, Turned out it wasnt to bad I took head off soaked cylinders with kroil and Took a old hand crank cut it off welded it to a 1 inch socket. after a couple days of setting I took the crank and used a electric impact and just bumped it 2 of 3 times a day and on the 4th day she broke free. Jay



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bh58

02-29-2008 23:33:11




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 Re: new project, unsticking a WD, how involved? in reply to christian h, 02-29-2008 20:21:47  
Karl:

Do a search on the Allis forum, typing in "motor froze" which offers some ideas. The problem depends on what exhaust valve was open during that time. The pistons are aluminum and the rings are what freezes up on the sleeve. If it was already rebuilt, the sleeves are probably already 4-1/8" overbore. I did mine "in-frame" which was a PIA with a loader in the way. You always learn by doing and I swear next time I will take the engine out and do it on a bench. I don't think you will get this unstuck without taking off the head and pan. If you put too much torque on the flywheel, you may crack the crank. Depending on how many sleeves are affected, you may get away with just buying one sleeve matched up to the same size as the other three. A new sleeve kit runs about $365 and up. Add another 60 to $80- for the headgasket set and pan gasket.
No shed - no problem. Set up a stand (barrels or carpenter horses with heavy plywood) next to the tractor so that you can work from it to hold all the tools and all the parts. In - frame, I spent a lot of time laying on my back with a hammer driving the sleeves up (using an oak drift pin ) and a large hammer. I eventually went to using a 24" x 3/4" steel pin out of frustration since I knew I was replacing the sleeves and psitos anyway. Drive the pin on the piston body next to the wrist pin so you don't damage the connecting rod. You may want to get a manual for reassembly since the wrist pin and connecting rod have to be staggered off center on the no 2 and 3 pistons. If you need help I can get the book out. Otherwise the wrist pin will rub the sleeve and cause wear and scoring on the sleeve.
Good luck. Plan to spend many hours if you rebuild. If the tractor sat that long, you will want to dress (lap) the valves a bit to get a good seal. You may as well buy the points and condensor and it should run like a champ once you get r started and carb adjusted.
This Allis Forum is a wealth of knowledge - just do a search on just about anything.

Good luck.

Bob

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old

02-29-2008 21:02:20




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 Re: new project, unsticking a WD, how involved? in reply to karl f, 02-29-2008 20:21:47  
May not be to bad or it maybe big trouble. I have a 1935 JD-B that was stuck for 15 plus years. When I found it was stuck I filled the cylinders with oil. It then sat for at least 10 years that way. I blew/wicked the oil out and filled with ATF, and let it sit a few weeks and it runs like a top now. All depends on how bad it is and you never know



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