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Super A year

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Flint

06-25-2003 16:59:57




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I have a super A with the serial no. 191181 :What year is it. The book starts sa with 250001 for 47 model. Is this and "A" with hydr. ,the no's started with 182964 for the 47 model
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Hugh MacKay

06-25-2003 19:04:43




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 Re: super A year in reply to Flint, 06-25-2003 16:59:57  
Flint: I hear what you are saying and yes the stats say the Super A started with 250001. There were some Super As built in 1947. Sometimes we must wonder just how right the stats are. Did you check the serial on the engine.

None of the Hs were suposed to have disc brakes, new type seat with coil spring under seat or front wheels with lugs rivited on rim. However my dad bought a new H in 1951 with all those items. I am not sure also but what that H didn't have the C-164 engine as we didn't notice a lot of difference in power 4 years later with a new 300. Truth of the matter is I wouldn't argue with anyone finding items from the next model at the end of a production run. You may well have an A with hydraulics. That will get the purests up in arms.

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CNKS

06-25-2003 19:49:05




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 Re: Re: super A year in reply to Hugh MacKay, 06-25-2003 19:04:43  
I think your dad's H had Lambert disk brakes, which were an option, and could be retro-fitted on tractors clear back to SN 501. The Super H type disk brakes supposedly appeared on the straight H at SN 391358, in 1953, the last H being 391730. The variable tread front wheels (lugs riveted to the rim) are listed in the parts book from 501 up, may have been a retrofit in the early years. My dad had a new 1947 H with these wheels. The tractor also had the "Monroe" seat, with the spring, and shock behind the seat. Many H's came with the optional IH spring seat with the shock under the seat. I doubt if your dads tractor had the C164 new in 1951, but if it was ever overhauled it could have been resleeved to 164 specs. Differences in "power" between the H/SH/300 are misleading, particularly in 3rd and 4th gears. We did most of our operations in 3rd, except for plowing. Third gear in a Super H is about the same as 4th in the H. I have made no direct comparisons, as we never had a Super H, but a Super H will probably pull no more than an H in third gear, it just pulls it faster. As to 4th, our H couldn't pull heavy tillage equipment in 4th anyway, doubt if the Super H/300 could either due to the higher speed. If your H had firecrater or thinner sleeves, the power would be quite close to the Super H/300, in fact it might pull more in 3rd because of the slower speed. Just my guess. I now have an H and Super H, and no land to try them out on.

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Hugh MacKay

06-25-2003 21:00:05




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 Re: Re: Re: super A year in reply to CNKS, 06-25-2003 19:49:05  
Charles: To start with the 1951 H my dad bought had IH disc brakes. I can remember the IHC stamp on the brake housing. Later after having 300 we did on ocasion exchange brake discs from one tractor to another, so they were the same. At the time whem the 300 was bought new the H was still as it came from factory as it was only 4 years old. I am aware on the faster speeds in SH and 300. We found not a lot of difference between H and 300 on items like plow, disk, cultivator and baler. We often said only difference was IPTO and TA and if you took those two away from 300 the H would give it a hard run. We never plowed, disked or baled in a certain gear, it was what was best suited for conditions. Our 8' Cockshutt wheel controlled disk would take either tractor to 2nd gear. And yes Cockshutt did have a wheel controlled disk in 1954.

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CNKS

06-26-2003 18:15:38




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: super A year in reply to Hugh MacKay, 06-25-2003 21:00:05  
We used a weighted 6 foot disk, a little small for the H, but my dad had it because smaller tractors would pull it. Rarely (very rarely) we used 4th. It had to be weighted with railroad irons, etc or it wouldn't go deep enough. We pulled a semi-mounted 3 disk "breaking plow" in second gear, same as a moldboard, but it had disks. The H had a good power to weight balance and it will pull more than most people think.

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Hugh MacKay

06-26-2003 19:13:24




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: super A year in reply to CNKS, 06-26-2003 18:15:38  
When I think about this a bit, that 51 H probably had the H engine. Today I have Super A with C-113 and 130 as well as 140 both with C-123. The Super A will give these tractors a hard run on work I do with them.

On the item of an H capability, when I was a young lad we used to have tractor pulls in my hometown and not the type of pull you see today. We pulled a flat bottom stone boat, which was nothing more than a piece of 1/2" steel 4' wide and 10' long turned up a bit on both ends so you could pull it both ways. We pulled with a 6' chain connecting tractor to stone boat or drag. We used 100 and 200 lb. boxes of sand for adding weight. Every tractor pulled in the same class. The winner being the tractor that could start away and move 4' with the highest percentage of own weight including operator. Three tractors were the hard ones to beat, Farmalls A and H or Supers and Cockshutt 30. If you separate the Farmalls, it is a toss up for first between A and H, M will place 3rd and C will come in 4th. On the hard track the C or Super C just have too much rubber on the ground for that little engine.

I remember one time, my dad's brother Wallace said that this pull was skill and not tractor, and to a large degree he was right. He said that since he was smart enough to farm a 100 acres with a Super A, He knew how to get the most out of a tractor. His tractor and farm were miles away. It was agreed by every one that my dad and Wallace would both pull dad's H. Wallace placed 1st, dad 2nd and the next week dad had to put a clutch in the H

We had guys roll in there with Ms, Cockshutt 40, Oliver 88, etc. loaded with enough weight to sink a ship, only to leave red faced. The A and H or Supers and Cockshutt 30 would always come very close to 3 times their own weight, and ocasionally over. You start adding big weight to the big tractors and they have to pull a lot. Of course this was managements thinking, get these tractors as they were working on the farm. If the big guys stayed home fine, that much less weight for men to handle. Lifting devices in those days were two hands.

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CNKS

06-25-2003 19:02:44




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 Re: super A year in reply to Flint, 06-25-2003 16:59:57  
What's the engine serial?-- should be close to the chassis serial, if the engine has not been replaced. It is possible that it is a late A that came with an engine that will accept a hydraulic pump that hydraulics were added, or the engine could have been changed. IH sometimes did some weird things to the existing models during the change-over process. However your tractor is 7000+ back from the official Super A, so I don't know.

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