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cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!!

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Josh in Maine

12-05-2003 10:56:27

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My 1944 "A" & my 1949 "C" both give me trouble when trying to start them in bitter cold weather...both are 6V systems, both start fine when weather is above freezing, both have magneto ignition & 113 motors...is this just inherent to this motor?? I have a 47' Massey (also 6V which starts right up & I have a 40-something 9N w/ 12V that starts with no trouble)...today, I had to move them all in anticipation of a big storm this weekend & I had to pop-start both the A & C after killing the batteries trying to start them. Once it warms up to above freezing, they seem to start fine, does anyone have any tricks to start these old Farmalls in cold climates? I live on the coast of Maine, it's cold 7 months of the year.

Thanks for any help.
Josh

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deano

12-05-2003 18:49:04

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Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Josh in Maine, 12-05-2003 10:56:27

i grew up and live where its very cold in the winter. we depended on the tractor/machinery to make a living. most of the time block heaters etc. would work. but in frigid cold, often we pull started our tractors. Especially our jd a which didnt even have battery in it. sometimes, we used a salamander heater (from safe distance). old timers did more dangerous things. doing these things may not be safe, but like i said our livelihood and sometimes lives depended on tractors running.

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MPJ

12-05-2003 18:15:08

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Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Josh in Maine, 12-05-2003 10:56:27

Add some dry gas to your tank. As a tractor sits the condesation in the fuel system will collect in the lowest point (the carb) and the smallest amount of ice will keep it from starting.

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John Vetter

12-05-2003 18:11:24

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Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Josh in Maine, 12-05-2003 10:56:27

Ign timing is important,if you have it a hair to early they don't start as well.You good spark plugs set at.025-.030 1 gauge batt cables or fatter. All connects must be clean!!! Starter must have center bushing support,some do not.Set throttle so carb butter fly is barely off the idle screw.This should help if engines are in fair shape with good valve jobs. John

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terry

12-05-2003 16:47:23

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Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Josh in Maine, 12-05-2003 10:56:27

If everything is like its spose to be, it will start down to well below zero.

Often the starter starts pulling lots of amps which draws away for the spark getting to the spark plugs.

In a pinch, use a 12 volt battery as a jump. Get the jumper wires hooked up to the 6 volt battery, have the 12 volt situated so you hook up the other end of the jumper cables to the 12 volt battery after you start cranking engine on the 6 volts. If it don't start then, trade it off.

As the hair replacement commercial says, "it works for me".

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mbnok

12-05-2003 15:25:07

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Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Josh in Maine, 12-05-2003 10:56:27

Set throttle 1/4 to 1/3, choke full, lift twice, choke to half, ____switch on, goood yank on crank or hit the starter it will go. Ignition must have blue spark and needle valve not letting engine flood. Most times I had trouble I got the engine flooded. then you have to set the throttle lower, choke off, to clear the flood. this works on all (B C H 674) my 400 is diferent. Now keep in mind it doesn't get to -40 in my part of Okla. I hope.

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Rich

12-05-2003 15:37:41

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Re: Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to mbnok , 12-05-2003 15:25:07

I worked on an A a year ago with the same problem. It had a mag on it. As soon as I would blow some heat on the mag for a while then it would start. Just a fair weather tractor.

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Rich

12-05-2003 15:34:42

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Re: Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to mbnok , 12-05-2003 15:25:07

I woked on an A a year ago with the same problem. It had a mag on it. As soon as I would blow some heat on the mag for a while then it would start. Just a fair weather tractor.

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Nebraska Cowman

12-05-2003 15:16:31

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Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Josh in Maine, 12-05-2003 10:56:27

I'd guess you have weak spark due to the damp coastal climate. Just keep them in a heated building or move. I just hear on the radio how Ney York area is going to get a major snowstorm. I guess everybody has to live somewhere.

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Hugh MacKay

12-05-2003 13:25:38

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Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Josh in Maine, 12-05-2003 10:56:27

Josh: Follow what these guys have said, partcularly with the cables and connections. I was raised just a couple hundred miles to the Northeast of you in Nova Scotia. I have started 6 volt farmalls unassisted by any devices at -40. Yes it makes you wish they didn't start. Another item I find improves the C-113 and C-123 engines is a new type starter drive my IH partsman calls a clutch drive. They are much smoother than the old bendix.

These tractors have seen a lot of years now and just maybe carb kits are in order.

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riverbend

12-05-2003 16:33:56

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Re: Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Hugh MacKay, 12-05-2003 13:25:38

Hugh,

Does the new drive look completely different than the Bendix ? I bought a new drive for my H and figured it was the wrong part. It looks like the old one was staked in rather than use a circlip.

Thanks

Greg

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Hugh MacKay

12-05-2003 18:26:26

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Re: Re: Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HEL in reply to riverbend, 12-05-2003 16:33:56

Greg: The new type that I have been using and recomended by CaseIH partsman has some resemblance of the clutch drive on a chain saw. I'm not just sure how new this is. I became aquainted with it about 5 years ago when I had the starters on my Super A and 130 rebuilt by a rebuilder. They came back one with new type and one with bendix. The new clutch type worked much better on either tractor. I called the rebuilder voicing my concern on this and it turns out he only had one bendix in stock and had to get the other newer type from CaseIH dealer. I went to CaseIH dealer and got a second one, and partsman indicated they had been selling only the new type for some time. Just how long some time was,I'm not sure as it had probably been 10 to 15 years since I bought a starter drive for one of my gas Farmalls. And it could even be 25 years, as 300 was the only other gas Farmall I don't ever remember having starter off it since tractor had complete rebuild at dealers.

I will say this having moved some 1200 miles complete with Super A and 130. I am now starting to realize just how good this IH parts guy was and still is. I had dealt with him since both of us were very young men. I've have had to consult with him on more than one ocasion since moving. Problem is most of the guys like him are starting to retire. I have since found a younger guy at a CaseIH dealer that values this old iron part of their business. He has an H and one other of his own.

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Duner Wi

12-05-2003 11:48:11

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Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Josh in Maine, 12-05-2003 10:56:27

Try setting the throttle exactly where you want it when you shut it off then leave it be when you start it again. Sounds crazy but I have one tractor that starts much faster if I set the throttle correctly when I shut it off.

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riverbend

12-05-2003 11:24:46

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Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Josh in Maine, 12-05-2003 10:56:27

Josh,

This works for me in Minnesota. I buy fresh regular unleaded gas, try to keep the points clean and the timing set spot on. The night before I'm going to have to plow snow, I stick one of those magnetic oil pan heaters on the manifold and put the charger on the battery. And hold your mouth just so. Usually does it.

Looks like you are going to get some weather here shortly.

Good luck

Greg

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Red Dave

12-05-2003 11:14:16

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Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Josh in Maine, 12-05-2003 10:56:27

Try what gene b says below and also make sure every connection is clean, tight & bright. Including the ground side too. Also make sure the engines are tuned up good too.
My '40 B pops right off in any weather year-round with the same set up you have (magneto & 6 volt starter), but I know I don't see as much cold as you do in Maine.

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gene b

12-05-2003 11:07:25

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Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to Josh in Maine, 12-05-2003 10:56:27

try 5w30 oil have 1ga cables on battery and make sure the starter is in good shape mite need new brushes.

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Jonathan Mirgon

12-05-2003 18:47:09

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Re: Re: cold weather starting...tricks?? HELP!! in reply to gene b, 12-05-2003 11:07:25

I have a 1940 (a) that I have rebuilt. The head has been planed,new valves springs,hardened seats installed, new liners, pistons, rings, rod and main bearings.Mine is distributor ignition.I am in Ohio and so far mine has popped off at 20 degrees with no problem on 6 volts. Good compression, ignition timing, carberator, and good tight electrical connections are the key to starting these old beasts in cold weather on 6volts. If your tractors have never been overhauled things are probably hampered enough to cause them to start hard in cold weather. maybe a 12 volt conversion would work good for you.

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