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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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Stupid idea for roading a 450 IHC

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Seifdoggy2

02-18-2004 20:13:03




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I had an idea a few years ago. I was having to road my 450 about 15 miles one way on level ground to another town.

While humming down the road, I thought of a idea. Why not put a car rearend onto the fast hitch. Then hook up a small drive shaft between the pto and the car rearend. On level ground, if the ratio was right you could maybe go the same speed or faster with less rpm. This would also save fuel.

I never worked out the details and ratios and such. Just sounded like something fun to try. I'm always building something to make people wonder why/or how did you .

Am I the only person who ever thought of such a stupid idea. Seif.

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Dave S

02-19-2004 16:34:46




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 Re: Stupid idea for roading a 450 IHC in reply to Seifdoggy2, 02-18-2004 20:13:03  

My father started farming with a F-12 and had 5 miles to drive to where he farmed. He built a frame on an old 40's ford axle of some kind and put some rocks in it for weight, it had a enclosed drive shaft with splines on it. He would hook it to the pto with a short power shaft take the transmission out of gear engage the pto and head for the field. Think it would do about 10 or 12 mph, much faster than 3rd gear.

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Seifdoggy2

02-19-2004 18:18:06




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 Re: Re: Stupid idea for roading a 450 IHC in reply to Dave S, 02-19-2004 16:34:46  
AH HA! At least I was not alone in this thought. I was just 60-70 years late. Just to set the record straight. I never thought too seriously about doing this, just in my mind.

Sometimes I just dream of gears and making things. I think they call us "gear heads" At least your dad and I thought some alike. Seif.



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Hugh MacKay

02-20-2004 06:15:28




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 Re: Re: Re: Stupid idea for roading a 450 IHC in reply to Seifdoggy2, 02-19-2004 18:18:06  
I was not trying to suggest these never existed, there is no question many devices were built for pre letter series tractors, as owners changed them from steel to rubber tires, only to realize they had no road gear. Probably a lot of those tractor had a top gear speed of 7 to 8 mph. And yes they gained up to 5 to 7 mph, giving them speeds of 12 to 14 mph. Your 450 however should already do about 16 to 18 mph in 5th gear. I was merely suggesting you would not gain much with the 450.

There were also some photos on here at YT back 2 to 3 years ago. My memory is a little rough on this, but he had a drive mechanism from the belt pulley to the right rear wheel. I've forgotten exactly how this worked, but it seems he had an idler that griped on face of rear tire. And again he was trying to compensate for a tractor without a road gear. Someone must remember this better than I. You might try typing a search in photo gallery, as I have a feeling photos of this are there. Try looking for F-20 or F-30, or W-20, W-30 or W-40. This is gradually coming to me and just may have been a W-30 or W-40. First one I would try is W-30. You might also have a look through Articles on the left of screen as it may be in there.

I saw another idea I wouldn't strongly recomend. I was coming out a side road one day, stopped at stop sign. I could have gone but was curious to have a better look at what I thought I could see coming down the highway. I waited, and yes, a Dodge mini wan with a 2 wheel tow dolly and the wide front of a MH 33 standard, straped in the cradles. I followed at a safe distance and he was making speeds of 60 mph. In the end I followed him 30 miles, didn't think it safe to pass, and heaven forbid that one would ever want to be in front of him and have to slow down quickly. Knowing the front end of those old MH were never the most solid item in the world, I was trying as I drove to decide which would happen first. Tractor separate from front end or transmission-rear end gears bust the castings wide open and be launched in space. He turned of highway at a little town, so I presume he made it safely. I asked later who he was, turns out he was a preacher, I guess the lord must have been travelling with him that day.

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Jim

02-22-2004 15:42:07




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Stupid idea for roading a 450 IHC in reply to Hugh MacKay, 02-20-2004 06:15:28  
During WWII, my dad was farming his place and those of his brothers-in-law (in the service) with one F-20. The main problem was the farms were about 20 miles apart. He had to haul his field equipment (before wheel discs and mounted equipment) so he built a trailer out of an old Ford 2 ton truck. He removed the front axle and engine and pulled the front of the frame together to make a hitch. He attached the tractor pto to the front of the truck transmission and let the trailer push him. The weight of the old truck with dual rear wheels and the equipment kept him from going very fast, but it let him get his equipment back and forth between farms a lot faster than he could have otherwise. The remains of the trailer are still on the farm.

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Hugh MacKay

02-19-2004 03:56:33




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 Re: Stupid idea for roading a 450 IHC in reply to Seifdoggy2, 02-18-2004 20:13:03  
Steven is right, it will not gain you a whole lot without spending some big bucks. Years ago in my hometown they used to build what they called power trailers, for the old transmission driven pto tractors. The average dual wheel 5 ton freight truck is what they used, complete with 5 speed transmission. Each time you shifted gears on tractor you also shifted the truck transmission. Of course they never got the ratio exactly on for each gear, but most were really only concerned with 1st and 2nd for getting through that tough spot. These trailers were quite heavy thus guys thought by using trailer rear end with tractor in neutral they would be great for roading. To the surprise of many they actually went slower, plus trailer would spin out even on the slightest hills. I can remember seeing Farmall Hs and Ms with 5 cords of wood they pulled from the bush, on bulldozed trails. Most of these trailers got demolished by 300s and 400s with live pto and guys just a bit too quick on the pto lever.

I remember pulling one of these with 300. Old guy had built it for his Deere MT. Had retired and sold his farm and tractor, but not the trailer. He wanted me to pull his trailer to bush for his firewood. I told him he better come along and operate this transmission, as I didn't want to bust it up on him. Ground was quite firm and I didn't think we even needed trailer in gear but he insisted. I started ahead and it pulled very hard for 8 to 10 feet. That was the end of that one as the old guy had put the trailer in reverse. I've forgotten whether we striped transmission or rear end on trailer.

The reason I tell you all of this is you could probably gain the speeds you want by using a pickup rear end, which have faster ratios than big trucks and with with 28 or 30 inch tractor wheels. Based on my experience I don't think the pickup rear end will take it. Torque at low RPM is the problem.

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42FarmallH

02-18-2004 20:31:49




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 Re: Stupid idea for roading a 450 IHC in reply to Seifdoggy2, 02-18-2004 20:13:03  
Well, lets work out some numbers here. My pickup has a 1:1 ratio in the transmission when in drive, and I have a 3.55:1 geared rearend. At about 22mph the engine is at around 1000 rpm, so turning the driveshaft at 540rpm would yield a little over half that speed which would be 12mph or so.

Of course, if you put larger tires on the rearend and/or a different gear ratio (such as 2.73:1 ratio) you could go faster.

Could it be done? Yes, but it would take some calculations, work, and $$. In the long run you would be better off to buy a trailer, at least in my opinion...

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dhermesc

02-19-2004 06:47:39




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 Re: Re: Stupid idea for roading a 450 IHC in reply to 42FarmallH, 02-18-2004 20:31:49  
The other thing to consider is that 15 miles = about 45-50 minutes of drive time on a 450. How long does it take to hitch trailer - load tractor - PROPERLY chain down - then unload? Is that 15 minute time saving worth spending about a thousand dollars on?



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jason

02-19-2004 12:17:24




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 Re: Re: Re: Stupid idea for roading a 450 IHC in reply to dhermesc, 02-19-2004 06:47:39  
Get a narrow front end , weld a pipe to a plate, drill two holes, mount on narrow front mounting holes, weld a hitch, hook to your pickup and pull at about 25 MPH.



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scotc

02-20-2004 20:22:40




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Stupid idea for roading a 450 IHC in reply to jason , 02-19-2004 12:17:24  
I used some scrap to build one of those things and used the SM to pull the H and hayrake to the pioneer show last summer, worked pretty slick.



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B Attinger

02-20-2004 05:38:51




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Stupid idea for roading a 450 IHC in reply to jason , 02-19-2004 12:17:24  
I know a man that uses a car dolly works real good and don't have to worry about DOT .



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