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Distributor advance - '47 H

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Dave in CT

07-05-2004 10:33:14




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I'm trying to determine why I get no advance at higher RPMs on my '47 H. Back again with more information. The distributor is an HC5-757925 - from the flange that the clamps clamp onto (other numbers on the dist. housing are 353989R1 and 52 but I think that's for the housing part). Disassembled down to the cam. On the side of the cam that faces the dist. shaft plate there's a cylindrical post that fits into a hole in the dist plate. With the cam dropped down over the dist. shaft and this post in the hole, the cam can only rotate about three or four degrees. This appears to be the wiggle room of the post in the hole. I would expect the cam to be able to rotate 20 degrees, as it's being levered by the weights spinning out. Any ideas on what the problem might be? All the parts are free of rust so it looks like it should be in proper working order.

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ChadS

07-05-2004 14:40:05




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 Re: Distributor advance - '47 H in reply to Dave in CT, 07-05-2004 10:33:14  
I belive I have a solution to your "advance" problem. I go through this every time I dyno tune a farmall. Here is what I do,, I have to tear it apart, give it a good cleaning, I find that 9 out of 10 farmalls that comes in, the mechanical advance is either stuck, or not functioning. First off, the advance springs are so hevy,, it takes darn near 5000 rpm to get them to respond for an advance curve, I say it was because they had to keep them all from falling apart internally, so rigind parts worked the best, but, not for any type of performance. After I reinstall the weights for the advance, I install a new set of springs from a chevrolet distributor advance curve kit for HEI ignition. The lightest set of springs,, is more "Tuned" for the low rpm advance needed to run a low rpm engine, very responcive after instalation. this will unlock your throttle reponse in the engine. it is an engine control in which will affect throttle resonse. it does not affect the amount od degrees of advance, just the speed in which it activates. Will make a night and day difference in the way it runs, and give it about 3 more HP, just because it works!!! Hope this helps,, ChadS from the pulling forum

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Dave in CT

07-05-2004 21:18:13




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 Re: Re: Distributor advance - '47 H in reply to ChadS, 07-05-2004 14:40:05  
Hey, that sounds pretty cool. I'm not too worried about how fast it gets to the advanced position, just that it gets there at all. From the posts below, I think I'll try a plate that allows for the greater number of degrees and once I get there, try the springs you mentioned.



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Dave W V

07-05-2004 12:04:29




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 Re: Distributor advance - '47 H in reply to Dave in CT, 07-05-2004 10:33:14  
Dave forgot to say if H was all fuel would of had 40
degree max advance, gas 30. Lot of dist. were changed to limit advance as more compression was
installed with rebuild kits.Also cam in Dist. changed with some power improvement packages.



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Dave W V

07-05-2004 11:49:01




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 Re: Distributor advance - '47 H in reply to Dave in CT, 07-05-2004 10:33:14  
Dave the size of hole in plate is what limits max. advance on dist. ,spring tension controls at what RPM advance takes place.Your plate with hole if original should have a number stamped on it,maybe a 22L or 30L which represents advance for that plate.The letter symbol is on base of dist. housing yours should have A or J instead of
H were HC5 is.H is for gas start diesel which only has 2.5 degrees advance.Also they turned in opposite direction,but housing and some other parts will interchange.You may have a mix of parts.Hope this is understandable.

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Dave in CT

07-05-2004 20:27:14




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 Re: Re: Distributor advance - '47 H in reply to Dave W V, 07-05-2004 11:49:01  
I think you're getting the closest to solving my problem. The hole in the plate allows for so little movement, 2.5 degrees sounds right (I was just guessing with my estimate). The distributor shaft plate (the plate just under the cam) has '8R' stamped into it and that's all.

The guy I bought the tractor from is local, deals in enough Hs he might be willing to correct this, even if the sale is a year old. I'd just like to get this engine running to specs.

I'll see what Wayne Swenson has on the issue and make sure to post what I find to be the solution. Thanks for your help.

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Bob

07-05-2004 12:20:10




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 Re: Re: Distributor advance - '47 H in reply to Dave W V, 07-05-2004 11:49:01  
That sure makes sense! I think you've solved it!



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Dave W V

07-05-2004 14:32:53




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 Re: Re: Re: Distributor advance - '47 H in reply to Bob, 07-05-2004 12:20:10  
Bob,messed up a little. 2.5 degrees was in distributor degrees.Rest refered to crankshaft
degrees.



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Bob

07-05-2004 11:18:08




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 Re: Distributor advance - '47 H in reply to Dave in CT, 07-05-2004 10:33:14  
I posted the parts view of this before. It's been a while since I've worked on one of these, and I'm still trying to figure out what you're dealing with.

First of all, since the distributor only turns 1/2 engine speed, it only has to advance 1/2 as many degrees as the desired spark advance, measured at the crankshaft.

It would seem that IH designed your distributor that way to limit advance movement... Maybe all the similar IH distributors are that way, or perhaps they made a model with limited advance, and that's what you have. I wonder if distributors designed for machines using tractor fuel had less centrifugal advance than distributors for gas burners? I know someone nearby that has 2 or 3 of these distributors lying around, and if I catch up with him in the next day or two, I'll look at them, and see how they're made.

I'm located in north central North Dakota, where are you? I have a distributor machine that allows you to check out the advance curve versus speed. It would be interesting to spin up your distributor and see what it does, and the slot could be elongated to achieve the degrees of advance your engine requires.

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Dave in CT

07-05-2004 11:33:20




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 Re: Re: Distributor advance - '47 H in reply to Bob, 07-05-2004 11:18:08  
I'm located in Connecticut (CT). Thanks for the offer of the spin test. I'm going to try to figure it out without shipping it away. It looks so clean, I'm thinking your idea of a distributor intended for a different fuel might be more likely. Perhaps someone with a gas burning H will see they have a different distributor number and let me know. Or someone with a parts book can look up the above number and see if it's designated for gas engines. At this point it's a bit frustrating because I'm not clear on how it's supposed to operate. I know a couple of guys around here who have gas Hs but I don't know how comfortable they'd be about pulling the distributor off their fine-running engines.

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Wayne Swenson

07-05-2004 15:40:56




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 Re: Re: Re: Distributor advance - '47 H in reply to Dave in CT, 07-05-2004 11:33:20  
I have some service manual info for you. Send me your E-mail address.



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