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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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BN cooling problems - Part II

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ffolkes

11-03-2004 18:14:02




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Hello-

Since this forum doesn't sort threads by time, I have to make another thread, otherwise no one will see my replies.

Thank you to everyone that replied.

What should I do?

Everything was working fine in July. At the beginning of August, I restored as much as I could, and painted everything. And just for the record, no, I didn't paint the radiator, so if you're thinking I clogged the fins with paint, you're wrong. ;)

As I've stated in my previous posts, I can get full flow through the block and the radiator with a garden hose. Some people have suggested a garden hose isn't the same as a 2" hose, but I tend to think with the quantity of flow I'm seeing, that the intake should be at least warm. But as it is, the intake is as cold as the ambient temperature, and the outlet is too hot to touch, with steam everywhere.

I don't know what to do - there appears to be enough flow to prevent the block from getting to be burning-hot, especially when the ambient temperature is only 45F, but it just isn't circulating.

I really don’t know what more to do…should I get a water pump?

Thanks.

ffolkes

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Bob from IL.

11-04-2004 19:24:00




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to ffolkes, 11-03-2004 18:14:02  
Had an over heating problem with my f-30. Iknew it was A flow problem through the radiator. So went to Ace Hardware baught 2 gal of limeaway. Dumped it in filled the rest with water let it run A couple of hours (while I drank some beer) drained it re filled with water. Absolutely no more problem. Might ad radiator in good shape before I decided to try this.Sure put the cure to mine.



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Paul Shuler

11-04-2004 16:27:04




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to ffolkes, 11-03-2004 18:14:02  
This may be way out there. If you started overheating after you had the head off, is there a chance your gasket may be flipped and not all the holes lined up? Not sure if this would cause what your having but it might block off some of the flow of the coolant. Just a thought.



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lee

11-04-2004 18:20:24




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to Paul Shuler, 11-04-2004 16:27:04  
Someone posted there may be different head gaskets although I don't have first hand knowledge of that. It's quite possible to flip it and cause problems, just not 100% certain. Been a while since I did a C113 or similar. Most engines I've worked with you really need to pay attention to get the correct head gasket on there correctly. It's not a job you want to re-do. I would not discount anything knowing now the head has been off. But he is on the right track to flush it real good as taking it apart tends to disturb a lot of rust and debris. Maybe run a cooling system flush kit in there too for a few hrs and then another good flushing. I mention the flush kit but don't expect it will work a miracle. The radiator appears to have not been cleaned for many many years so a professional cleaning couldn't hurt. If none of this fixes it, it's time to pull the head back off.

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ffolkes

11-05-2004 10:29:07




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to lee, 11-04-2004 18:20:24  
I put some "Prestone Super Cleaner" in there and ran it for awhile doing some grass cutting. I'm going to wait a few days, then drop it and put some Prestone/water in it.

As I said in my other post, it seems to be working fine now.

Thanks for everyone's help.

ffolkes



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ffolkes

11-04-2004 12:53:19




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 To whom it may concern in reply to ffolkes, 11-03-2004 18:14:02  
Thanks for everyone's advice.

Before I resigned myself to taking the radiator to a repair shop, I wanted to try flushing it again.

I took the radiator out yet again, plugged up the block intake, filled the block with water, and let it all gush out. I repeated this process about 10 times. Then I did the same for the radiator. Put it all back together, and it seems to be working fine... Nothing noticeable came out during the flushes besides rusty water though.

I'm going to keep an eye on it from now on, and if it starts to steam/boil again, I’ll have the radiator professionally cleaned.

Thanks again for all the replies.

ffolkes

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Paul A.

11-04-2004 04:22:49




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to ffolkes, 11-03-2004 18:14:02  
I put a water pump on a BN that I have, I am planning to put a belly mower on it. The only problem I encountered is the fan needed to be notched to clear the water pump pulley. It should probably be balanced after that, too -- and I think a lawn mower blade balancer would be okay for that. After you install the water pump (it just fits right on the tractor after the lower fitting is removed), start it up and look in the radiator to make sure you have water flowing through it. The other posts are correct though - if you have the proper head gasket, and the block and radiator are not clogged, the cooling system should work very well.

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gene b

11-03-2004 21:42:46




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to ffolkes, 11-03-2004 18:14:02  
It is easy to add a water pump cause all you have to add is a longer fan belt as the pump bolts on where the lower outlet is. Lots of them running around this way no need for a pressure cap and so forth just add the pump and belt. With the pump the engine usally wont get any warmer than maybe 150 on a hot day mowing yard. My two Bs without pumps get only 165 mowing as the blocks have been cleaned. go for it

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ffolkes

11-03-2004 21:46:16




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to gene b, 11-03-2004 21:42:46  
Pressure cap?

Is there supposed to be one on a passive cooling system like this? What would be the point? There's an overflow tube, so there could never be pressure...

Am I doing something wrong?

Thanks.

ffolkes



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GENE B

11-04-2004 04:40:55




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to ffolkes, 11-03-2004 21:46:16  
There are those who will rell you that you have to have a pressure cap to run a water pump. Around here there are several ones with pumps. I have put some on even on a C that mows a lot. Look at it this way for 92.00 for a rebuilt one with pulley as the new ones dont have a pulley and a new belt problem solved. Do you need the source where to get one? Send e-mail so we dont get in trouble with posting source.

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ffolkes

11-03-2004 21:26:53




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to ffolkes, 11-03-2004 18:14:02  
I'm going to take everyone's advice and get it professionally cleaned.

After about 10 minutes, the top tank will start to boil, and the top 1/4 of the radiator will be hot. The bottom 3/4 is ice cold.

Will an automotive radiator speciality shop be able to deal with this type of radiator? I know automotive radiators are usually under pressure, unlike this, which is passive.

Thanks.

ffolkes

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lee

11-04-2004 06:23:20




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to ffolkes, 11-03-2004 21:26:53  
You tend to ask a lot of questions but also tend not to answer questions posed by those who try to help you. Questions are asked in an attempt to narrow the field of possible problems. Any reputable radiator shop that has a cleaning tank and re-core capability can do the work. I am not saying you need a re-core, you might, but the shop should have the capability to remove/replace the tanks for rodding out and cleaning. Be sure to get an estimate. If a re-core is required the cost can be quite high. Bottom line is you need a good radiator, the cost is what it is, if it doesn't fix your immediate problem you chalk it up to the process of elimination. This is all the help one can give because you don't offer further information to help yourself.

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ffolkes

11-04-2004 14:38:22




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to lee, 11-04-2004 06:23:20  
I apologize for not replying to your posts. I greatly appreciate the help you and several other "regulars" contribute to this forum. Day after day, month after month, you guys are here helping those with problems and questions.

When I read posts in this forum, my decision to reply is based on one thing - avoiding excess posts, for the sake of others. When I read your other post in this thread, I mentally answered your questions, and I felt the results didn't warrant cluttering the forum with a reply just yet.

To answer your questions, just for the sake of answering them:

1. Yes I did install a new head gasket
2. The tractor has been in my family since it was bought new, around 1947.
3. It definitely didn't overheat like this.
4. Nothing was changed with the cooling system since 1991, so for those 13 or so years, it worked fine under any load, at any ambient temperature.

Since none of this information would have changed your recommended course of action, I figured I'd investigate further on my own before I nagged the forum with another post.

I highly value your opinion and input, since I consider you to be among the group of “Farmall Geniuses” on this forum. I would never intentionally ignore anything you say, in fact, it’s quite the opposite. When I see a reply from you, I get excited because I know it will contain useful information related to what my original post was about.

So please don’t take any offence at this reply.

Thank you very much for always answering my posts, and volunteering to help. The world really would be a much better place if more people were as eager to help as you!

ffolkes

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lee

11-03-2004 20:29:59




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to ffolkes, 11-03-2004 18:14:02  
Have you had the cylinder head off this engine or the radiator off the tractor as part of your restoration? Something has changed since it ran flawless in July and over heats now. How long have you owned this tractor? Do you have a long history with it to say for sure it never overheated under load before but now it does? You worked it hard and long enough in July to know it did not have an overheat problem?
Your garden hose debug method is not going to tell you much. If you've had the cylinder head off you could have a problem there. Sometimes these types of problems are a process of elimination (and money spent). Get the radiator cleaned professionally. Back flush the block.
Remove the cylinder head. Flush the block with the cylinder head off. Check the head gasket. Get the head hot tanked clean. Check the head and deck surface for flatness. Install a new and correct head gasket. Hope you've fixed it.

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CNKS

11-03-2004 19:04:14




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to ffolkes, 11-03-2004 18:14:02  
As posted by several in your original post, you have a clogged radiator and/or a clogged block. There's nothing left, unless you happen to have a cracked block or head that is causing problems. If you replaced the head gasket, you could have the wrong one. If it's as bad as you say, a water pump won't do you much good.



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cliff

11-03-2004 18:59:52




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 Re: BN cooling problems - Part II in reply to ffolkes, 11-03-2004 18:14:02  
sounds like a water pump would be the best option. but dont forget that the water pump requares a diferant head gasket.



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