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Re: 826 Hydro steering problem

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Allan in NE

10-15-2005 07:00:50

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Hi Dave,

I can't speak specifically to your tractor because I've never been within 15 miles of an 826 so really hope someone else more knowledable than I will jump in here and bail me out. But, in the meantime, I'm talkin' generalities. :>)

The breaks and remotes are gonna work okay. The breaks are a metered low pressure feed and the remotes are on a completely different pump altogether.

However, at 1200 psi, you've still got to move at least 6 gallon per minute or you've got a weak pump. Also, that figure still seems low to me. Shouldn't that pump be crowdin' 1600 to 1800 lbs?

It is the intermittent operation when warm that is bothering me. When things are seemingly working okay, does activating the brakes stop the steering? That would darned sure point at a weak flow, I would think.

Does the steering always work okay cold? Does the steering work okay with the weight of the loader dropped to the ground and off the tractor?

At 1200 lbs, then bleed off a few hundred for subsystem operation, you're down to around 800 lbs for steering on a tractor with a heavy loader on it. It still sounds like starvation to me.

Dunno, just tryin' to help,

Allan

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David Riedel

10-15-2005 08:27:16

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Re: 826 Hydro steering problem in reply to Allan in NE, 10-15-2005 07:00:50

Thanks for all the responses so far. The low oil light does not come on or flicker. I've kept the resevoir full to a little over full at all times. Also, I have the same problem with the loader off the tractor, as well as with the wheels off the ground. At first, warmed oil usually helped, but now, hot or cold the steering problem persists. I am intersted in the possiblity of a cracked tube, but was unfamilliar with its location. Could you be more specific on where it is found and how it can be inspected? Also, all filters have been replaced at least once. I'm not sure how to inspect that bypass valve in the filter above the MCV. Could it be stuck in a open(closed) position? Still wondering about an earlier post where I asked a question about the check valve in the controll valve. The breaks and loader work under all working conditions; hot, cold, while steering, raising lowering etc. I'll continure to check back regularlly for addtional posts.

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the tractor vet

10-15-2005 17:10:32

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Re: 826 Hydro steering problem in reply to David Riedel, 10-15-2005 08:27:16

It is why down in the rear housing and the only way to get to it is remove the whole top of the rear end , not a bad job if ya got a good cherry picker a few lines to remore on some models also ya should remoe the top link plate so you can see the draft sencening linkage look before ya remove that way ya know what side the arm must go on. Now one other thought that you may be money ahead if ya just took it in to a Case IH dealer and have the MCV flowrated and IF THEY HAVE THE NEW SERVICE TOOL to take the two reading on the pressure on the MCV . THe more i think about it it still comes back to either low pump flow or a sticking or weak flow divider spring.

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David Riedel

10-16-2005 11:41:01

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Re: 826 Hydro steering problem in reply to the tractor vet, 10-15-2005 17:10:32

Hello again. Went through the steering control valve again. Everything looks great, and slides well. I don't think it's the problem. I think the roll pin over the steel ball check valve, actually pushes in on it a little, not sure. I tried shimming the flow divider a little to stiffen the spring, with no results. I'm starting to fear that I'll never troubleshoot this problem. I'm starting to lean towards a pump problem too, except two things really bug me. First, the steering worked perfectly before I had it serviced (local IH dealer) to fix a problem with no power in the hydro (turned out to be the seal in the foot n inch valve). I'm surprised they let the tractor out of the shop with the problem, which they blamed me for for some reason, saying I let the fluid get too dirty. Secondly, just recently, I removed the MCV, cleaned around a little (didn't remove the pump from the MCV) reinstalled it and the steering worked perfectly for around six start ups. On the seventh startup, whamo, right back to the same problem. Keep the good ideas comming. Thanks Dave

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Weldon

10-16-2005 18:39:45

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Re: 826 Hydro steering problem in reply to David Riedel, 10-16-2005 11:41:01

David You sound rather knowledgeable of the steering system components. I am assuming that you are using some type of repair manual to guide you in finding the problem. If you are not , GET ONE!! I&T manual has a "trouble shooting" section for the steering system. First, I recommend that you do a pressure test EXACTLY as directed by manual, which states ; "Gauge should read approximately 1800-1900 psi. If pressure is not as specified, renew the saftey relief valve located on bottom side of the multiple control valve. Relief valve is available as a unit only." This test will tell you if safety relief valve is culprit or whether pump is faulty. Next, do all the operational test as directed by the manual. Do not get discouraged . I feel that it is something simple that has been overlooked or something that you are unaware of that needs testing.

Good luck and let us know what you find. Weldon

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David Riedel

10-17-2005 05:35:09

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Re: 826 Hydro steering problem in reply to Weldon, 10-16-2005 18:39:45

Thanks Weldon. If I recall correctly, I plumbed in a guage a while ago and it showed under 1200 psi. I never looked to see if that was correct, because it seemed more than enough to move the steering cyclinder. It must not be. I have the repair manual for the hydro drive, but it gives very little detail on the peripheral components. I did remove the pressure relief valve in the MCV and cleaned it up some, but wether it help any is anyone's guess. It looked good. I'm wondering if I start to look at this economically, if I would be better off, just buying a new MCV pump. Hauling the tractor to have it pressure and flow tested would probably cost more than the pump. It costs $100.00 just to have it picked up and returned. Also, are the pressure relief valves part of a matched set in the MCV? I'm guessing not, since it seals with an O-ring. I check at least twice each day this posting, and all the help I get is greatly appricated and taken to heart and considerd. Hope to get more input, thanks Dave.

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Weldon

10-17-2005 07:58:01

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Re: 826 Hydro steering problem in reply to David Riedel, 10-17-2005 05:35:09

David
On my previous post I was reading from a manual for the 06 and 56 series tractors. I now have the 826, 1026 and 66 series manual in front of me. The MCV on gear drive tractors are on the left of tractor. On Hydro tractors,they are on the right side. Their functions are the same.The pressures and flow rating of steering system are the same. They are of course, built differently and the locations of the safety relief valve are different. Your safety relief valve is located on the rear side of the MCV where the power steering return line tee is plumbed into the MCV body. Is this correct? On the under side of the MCV body is a hex head plug which removal of will allow Flow Divider valve to be removed. When you inspected the safety relief valve, you removed the return line tee, an o-ring and then the valve body. Did another o-ring and another part come out also? This part is the flow divider orifice. Manual states," Check orifice to see that it is open and clean as this orifice is the unit that actually meters the 3 gallons per minute used to operate the power steering ". " To check operation of flow divider and orifice, proceed as follows: Remove power steering return line from MCV and connect Flow- Rater or equivalent. Start engine and check flow which should be approximately 3 gpm at 1500 rpm. If fluid flow is not as specified, service flow divider as out lined in paragraph 57. Bleed power steering system after test is made ,if necessary." "Service of flow divider valve consists of renewing parts. Inspect spool and bore for scratches, grooves or nicks. Spool should fit bore snuggly, yet be free enough to slide easily in bore with both spool and bore lubricated Flow divider spring has free length of 4.08 inches and should test 33.50 pounds when compressed to a length of 2.50 inches".

It should be as simple as this: If the flow divider orifice is not open allowing oil to pass through, you will not have flow to the steering system. There are several other test you can make yourself before resorting to sending tractor to the shop. ( I like to save $$$ too ) E-mail me at weldon keiger@hotmail.com and we can communicate directly. I can send copies of pages from manual if you like.

Weldon

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