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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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starting problems

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Andrew D

02-06-2006 10:36:53




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I have a 1949 Farmall Super A , and its finally restored to my liking. I had taken it for a run , which it ran good , this was a few weeks ago. I just had taken it for a run again, and after 45 minutes, I shut it off and it didn't want to start back up again. So by cranking it with the steel arm, it would start up , but with a the 6 volt battery it would not start. So my question is , why does it start with the crank arm, and not the switch? it use too be perfect running order, It's got me confused. help please..:)

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Andrew D

02-06-2006 16:56:40




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 Re: starting problems in reply to Andrew D, 02-06-2006 10:36:53  
you all had good idea's, but what I think is to start by checking my timing like Janicholson suggested. I will start from there. Maybe its off a bit. I will let you know, from that point on if its only that. thanks to you all for the reply.



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Stan(PA)

02-06-2006 14:00:52




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 Re: starting problems in reply to Andrew D, 02-06-2006 10:36:53  
oops! Just read that it"s a MAGNITO ignition! Please disregard my post. I should read first, type later :)



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Stan(PA)

02-06-2006 13:58:18




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 Re: starting problems in reply to Andrew D, 02-06-2006 10:36:53  
The push-pull ignition switch can cause these exact symptoms, don"t ask how I know (it only took a whole summer for me to finally figure it out!). If she won"t start, try jumpering the ignition terminals together while cranking. These switches get "gummed up" inside, and the contacts are not 100%. Mine was hard starting (even with fresh tune up, new plugs, points, rotor, cap, condensor...) Got a new switch, and she starts easy everytime!

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Janicholson

02-06-2006 10:59:22




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 Re: starting problems in reply to Andrew D, 02-06-2006 10:36:53  
If the charging system is not providing enough voltage to refill the battery it will eventually stop starting (though it will hand crank start.
Purchase a automotive diagnostic book from the fifties. They do the generator thing very well.
The charging voltage (running at 1/2 throttle or more) should be 6.9 7.3 volts. if it is close to 6 to 6.4 volts it is not charging, and needs repair.
JimN

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El Toro

02-06-2006 10:51:14




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 Re: starting problems in reply to Andrew D, 02-06-2006 10:36:53  
Your starter may being drawing too much current
causing a voltage drop to your ignition if you have battery ignition. Your battery could be weak, you should check the elecrolyte in each cell and the readings should close to one another. The battery cables could be the problem
if they're too small. You should have 00 battery cables and clean all surfaces nice & shiny including where your ground cable is attached to the tractor. That includes the battery posts.

You can check your voltage at the coil while cranking with starter using a volt meter to see if there's a big drop in voltage. Hal

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Andrew D

02-06-2006 11:19:45




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 Re: starting problems in reply to El Toro, 02-06-2006 10:51:14  
thanks for the reply. I have all new battery cables, 00 that it. I also have a new battery with 645 cranking amps. I have a new starter, new distrubuter wires. my friend check to see if it was firing right he had a light meter, It wasn't giving a pulse to each wire, but only a direct current. Now is that normal for 6 volts to do. Usually the light would jump back and forth, but his light stayed on will he had it connected to each wire . It could be the magnito.! I have to check more about this delima..hmmm thanks for writting back so soon.:)

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Andrew D

02-06-2006 13:15:20




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 Re: starting problems in reply to Andrew D, 02-06-2006 11:19:45  
Ok I went out to start my tractor, for the first time today. It started very quickly, with out any problems. So this tells me that while its running for a long time , and the engine is warm ,this is when the problem occurs, and it won't start right up again. The confusing thing is if I leave it ,say tomorrow it will start, so the battery must be charging. But why then does it start when its cold ? I have someone coming to look at the volts to check it out. But I don't think that the battery is the problem.

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riverbend

02-06-2006 19:11:23




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 Re: starting problems in reply to Andrew D , 02-06-2006 13:15:20  
Does your tractor have spark when it is warm ?

Sometimes a coil will fail when it gets warm. See if the resistance across the terminals is very high or very low when it won't start, or substitute a known good coil. Measuring the resistance between either terminal and the case should show an open circuit.



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Janicholson

02-06-2006 13:44:10




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 Re: starting problems in reply to Andrew D , 02-06-2006 13:15:20  
Assuming: the voltage is correct, starter is new and good (there are bad new starters), New good battery and cables. If the engine timing is set too far advanced (even a few degrees) the engine will start cold, but not warmed up. (cold fuel/air has a slower flame travel time and can function with advanced timing better than warm fuel air. Timing light on #1 when running should be as indicated in manual at speed. If it is a mag, follow Magman's or Bob M's
Mag timing instructions for impulse couplings.
JimN

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El Toro

02-06-2006 12:13:27




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 Re: starting problems in reply to Andrew D, 02-06-2006 11:19:45  
Put a volt meter across the battery terminals as suggested by Jim. Then start the tractor and see what your charging voltage is at the battery.
A new battery could be low if the generator isn't charging. Check this and post back. Hal



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El Toro

02-06-2006 12:05:01




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 Re: starting problems in reply to Andrew D, 02-06-2006 11:19:45  
Is this a magneto or does it have a distributor?
Your battery is only used for cranking if you have a mag. A mag will generate its own current from the magnets passing by the coil.

A tractor with battery ignition will have a distributor, an external coil and has a wire from the ignition switch to the coil to provide
voltage. Need to find which you have. Hal



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Janicholson

02-06-2006 11:58:21




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 Re: starting problems in reply to Andrew D, 02-06-2006 11:19:45  
Get a book!!! (I'm A professor and I must say that).
Spark plug wires carry from 5 to 15 thousand volts. They will not be able to be used with anything but a timing light. It would flash if connected correctly though only #1 cylinder would show the timing marks.
The plug voltage is high frequency pulsed DC creating each spark. Each spark starts and ends once per end of compression and beginning of power stroke.
What is the charging voltage measured across the battery terminals while operating as in my other post.
YOur issue is a dead battery, not ignition problems. If you charge the battery it will work for a while, then do the same thing again.
Just my two cents,
JimN

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