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Delco Remy 3-brush generator

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J. Klein Rot

10-25-2006 07:24:30

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Hi,
I have a Farmall cub with a Delco Remy 3-brush generator. The brush in the middle can be adjusted. What will happen when i turn this brush clockwise or counterclock wise.

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gene bender

10-25-2006 11:58:06

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to J. Klein Rot, 10-25-2006 07:24:30

Are you sure you have the correct regulator as there are two listed one is for the adjustable brush and the other is for the fixed brush. I have tractors with both some with cutouts and some with regulators.

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Elk Farmer

10-25-2006 09:23:05

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to J. Klein Rot, 10-25-2006 07:24:30

I have my generator's third brush within 2 commutator bars of the fixed brush but the generator still won't keep up with the lights on. Charges +10 amps with the lights off. I also found out at least on the generator I have you can not get the third brush any closer than 2 commutator bars because there is a stop limiting the travel of the third brush. Thanks
Carl from Michigan

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Bob M

10-25-2006 11:30:34

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to Elk Farmer, 10-25-2006 09:23:05

Carl - Low generatory output can be caused by several things:

1 - Slipping drive belt(s)

2 - A tired generator (worn brushes and/or commutator, failing internal connections, etc)

3 - Excessive resistance in the wiring harness between the generator A terminal and it's connection to the ungrounded battery post.

If you have a decent DC voltmeter place one lead on the generator A terminal and the other on the ungrounded battery post. With the generator running at full output the meter should indicate no more than a few tenths of a volt. Anything higher says there's high resistance somewhere in the harness - most often at or near a terminal.

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Bob M

10-25-2006 08:01:46

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to J. Klein Rot, 10-25-2006 07:24:30

The nearer the 3rd brush is positioned to the closest fixed brush the more amps the generator will produce.

However always leave a minimum of 2 commutator bars showing between the moveable and the fixed brushes. Otherwise you risk overheating the generator and perhaps burning it out!

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John T (Question for the

10-25-2006 08:53:27

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to Bob M, 10-25-2006 08:01:46

Bob, good info, I have like NOOOOO specs or data on those Gennys and the max current WITHOUT causing damage. When converting from a cutout relay on a 3 brush to a VR system I've always advised to set the 3rd brush for max charge. Ive never done it but wondered your (and the other Bob's) opinion if when a person converted to a VR on a 3 brush why couldnt he simply remove the third adjustable brush and rewire the leading field winding (that used to wire to 3rd brush) up to the incoming ARM post same as on a 2 brush genny????? ????

Think that would overcurrent the Fields????? ?

What you Bobs think????? ??

A curious John T

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Bus Driver

10-25-2006 09:33:45

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to John T (Question for the , 10-25-2006 08:53:27

I suspect that the regulators offered today are all for 25 amp current limits. Many of the third brush generators for IH tractors are designed for 1about 16 amps max current output and have no cooling fan or openings for air to pass through. The very last of the IH/Delco 6 volt units were 25 amp. My reasons for suspecting the 25 amp limit are that for on-highway 6 volt vehicles with Delco systems, the replacement regulator (aftermarket) now is just one part number. But the vehicles for which it is listed have generators which range from 25 to 45 amperes in rated output and originally had different regulators for each amperage rating. If equipped with 25 amp regulator, then that is the maximum they will deliver. No burnout, but less than maximum charging rate. But 25 amps very well could damage a 16 amp generator.

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Janicholson

10-25-2006 12:35:10

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to Bus Driver, 10-25-2006 09:33:45

With appropriate instruments and load cell for making the generator work, one could adjust the current regulator relay to a max of 16 amps, thus reducing the chance of failure from heat. Thus justifying eliminating the third brush (as posted above). Begging the question would be to use a later model generator, sense the regulator is not stock now. JimN

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Bob M

10-25-2006 09:09:02

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to John T (Question for the , 10-25-2006 08:53:27

Interesting question John T!

I suspect your idea would work. Presuming the regulator does it's job monitoring/limiting generator output (armature) current by modulating current flowing in field windings, there should be no risk of overheating the field windings.

OTOH if that were indeed the case, why did Delco continue with the 3 brush generators for several years after the transion from from manual charge control (cutout and combo charge control/headlight switch) to voltage regulators?

Gotta believe there's a valid engineering reason for this - what it is however eludes me! Your thoughts??? ...Bob M

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John T

10-25-2006 12:44:46

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to Bob M, 10-25-2006 09:09:02

Bob and Bob and bus driver, I even wondered maybe they had a ton of the old 3 brush units laying around so just used them with the VR for more precise n better (no worry where farmner had light switch set) regulation?? As best I can tell the gennys field current runs in the 2 amp range meaning around 6 ohms total for both field windings (at 12 volts) so I dont envision any problems in overcurrent if you tossed the 3rd brush and besides theres pulse width type of current modulation going on inside a VR besides plain old on off or low n high charge like the old relay systems. In agreement with bus drivers comments I dont think its even possible to set the 3rd brush too close due to the mounting set up as it dont allow the brushes to get side by side I dont think.....

John T

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Bus Driver

10-25-2006 09:17:42

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to Bob M, 10-25-2006 09:09:02

My inclination would be to leave the third brush as the current limiter even if a voltage regulator is added. Regulators can fail and generators have been damaged (burned out) by the failure of the regulator to limit the current. The third brush is more reliable than the regulator, in my opinion. Regulating the voltage prevents battery overcharging, something the cutout does not do.

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Bob

10-25-2006 08:59:28

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to John T (Question for the , 10-25-2006 08:53:27

Sorry, no help from me. I've thought about that, too, but never tried it.

Don't see why it wouldn't work, though.

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Bob

10-25-2006 08:20:08

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Re: Delco Remy 3-brush generator in reply to Bob M, 10-25-2006 08:01:46

That's REALLY good information about not setting the "third brush" too close to the output brush.

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