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Which was a better tractor

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Idaho Ron

11-14-2007 19:43:40




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Farmall super C with fast hitch or a Ford 8N? I am talking about all around small farm tractor in lets say 1953.
Also what about a tractor for the hobby farm now?
Ron




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Zach Bouchard

11-17-2007 15:32:55




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
The Farmall Super C hands down. If it ain"t red, don"t ride it.



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LenNH

11-17-2007 10:46:58




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
Another 2 cents worth, devalued by inflation.
When talking about "lack of power" in one tractor or another, we need to go back to the times when the older tractors were made. When I was just becoming aware of tractors, around the age of 6 months in the early 30s, they were designed to pull their "rated load" at about 3 mph. This used to be called "plowing speed," probably because a tractor on steel wheels wastes enormous amounts of power just driving those lugs into the ground--the result is that 3 mph is about tops for working speed, AND, even if they would pull their rated load at a higher speed, the operator would have suffered enormously (on sod, not so bad; on gravel, awful, abominable, bone-shaking, hellish, horrible; been there). Even tractors of the H and M generation were designed to pull their rated loads in second gear (a bit over 3 mph).
Today, we see tractors zooming across the fields with enormous plows, doing between 4 and 5 mph, I'd guess, but these have rubber tires, four-wheel drive often enough, enormous power, and probably plows designed to require less effort at high speeds). My point is that a 9N, 2N, 8N would probably pull 2 14" plows at 3 mph (with the 3-point hitch; perhaps not with a standard drawbar and pull-behind plow), but if we pit them against later tractors, we are likely to be disappointed in the power. Incidentally, a very-early Ford sales brochure for the 9N (1939--in my so-called collection of this kind of stuff) shows the tractor pulling a 2-bottom plow. Obviously, in second gear, because third is road speed only. I think I said this in another letter in this column, but I'll have to say that for "utility" work (mowing in tight quarters, pulling a trailer around to bring in firewood, that sort of thing), the low-slung tractors are a delight.
I have probably climbed up on an F-20, F-12, H or Super M about 9,999,999 times, as my arthritic hips will testify. Loved 'em, love 'em, but for the light jobs requiring lots of ons and offs, the low-slung tractors are the nicest. I've only had one "real" Ford, a 2N that I bought VERY used in about 1985, but I had the impression that the quality of build was very good. I say real because the little Ford 1100 I recently bought for mowing and wood-hauling is Japanese (haven't had it long, but it, too, appears to be a high-quality product). I liked the 2N, and only sold it when I left my country place and didn't need it anymore. The 1100 is a lot more modern, and has much nicer placement of controls--brake pedals, shift levers, throttle, etc., and it, too is fun to drive--kinda like a low-slung sports car.

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wolfman

11-16-2007 17:45:33




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
Probably nothing ever built or to-be built is or will be more user friendly than a good Super C. Did I say maneuverable, ezzy steering, you sit up in a comfortable position. If it had the Ford's 3-pt, this discussion would be moot.



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Coggonhick

11-15-2007 17:24:36




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
I have to say the 8N is the right choose! They have the power to do every thing that you need to do and when I had the choice to get an 8N or C, i got an 8N so i can get modern emplaments with it. The 3point hitch is a lot better that the fast hitch, to. Pluse the 8N is a more comon tractor, so you can get parts for it easy. Also the implaments the Ford made are still sitting all around. I went to california and out east, and the people there had 8N's. The 8N is a better choice. I own a Super M and an 8N and i choice the 8N almost every day. The muffler isn't in your face, to.

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Coggonhick

11-15-2007 17:28:31




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Coggonhick, 11-15-2007 17:24:36  
Also, the NAA came out in 1953. The Last 8N was made in 1952, so you would be looking at a more advanced tractor. The 3pt hitch is a lot better and they have more horses under there tops.



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David Goode

11-15-2007 17:11:08




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
I own a 8N and have to say they are great little tractors for mowing, and "gardening" but suffer from a lack of power. The Super C is taller, and might have more problems mowing around and doing chore work but you have more horse power and a better platform for "farming" in the end it's up to you, you'll proboly have more luck finding an 8N there all over the place. I would like the Super C with Fast-Hitch, but it is probably hard to find and will cost more. Just my two cents.
Good luck. Both are good tractors. -David Goode Coggon, IA

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Idaho Ron

11-15-2007 12:54:09




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
This is a great thread. I am enjoying reading the ups and downs of the tractors from first hand operators. We had a 8N when I was a kid and the neighbor had a SC. My dad never liked the 8N much it didn't run very well, but we borrowed the SC many times. I think it was mostly because it had a starter, we had an "A" but it was hand crank. I used the SC to pull a pipe trailer. Dad sold the 8N and got a 530 Case diesel. this was his cultivating tractor, but it was a miserable set up. The thing would not track straight. Dad always blamed me because I disked or roller harrowed the same way as he planted.third party image

One thing I do remember about the 8N was ditching. I got it stuck many times (high centered). The neighbor with the SC gave it to his son, who still has it. I still have my dad's A but the other tractors are gone.

It is funny you guys talk about matching the tractor to the work. When I was a kid we used whatever would start.third party image

Ron

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Andy Motteberg

11-15-2007 12:23:35




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
The Farmall Super C is much better.



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LenNH

11-15-2007 08:19:21




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
Some good advice in the other letters here. I agree with others--it boils down to what you need. Some years ago, I found a Ford 2N, somewhat bedraggled, but useable after a valve-job, and I bought it to work a 3-point mower to cut a huge "lawn" (that's another word for a hayfield that you want to use to extend the lawn next to the house). I had spent all my years on the farm with an IHC 10-20 on steel, a couple of F-20s, a Regular" Farmall, an F-12 on rubber and one on steel, an A borrowed from a neighbor whenever I had the nerve to ask (delightful tractor to drive), an enormous and very clumsy 1930 Oliver Hart-Parr Row-Crop belonging to my grandfather, and finally a couple of Hs and a Super M. The Ford, as old as it was, was a revelation. Low (great under tree limbs), short and agile (great for zooming up to a fence and whipping around in a circle for the backswath), easy to get on and off of, and so on.
Didn't care much for the left brake pedal being outside the clutch--how do you use a brake pedal to make a tight turn somewhere when you also need to "inch" along with the clutch pedal? Engineers probably don't use some of the stuff they design, I guess. The 3-point hitch was my first experience with that wonder, too, as was the hydraulic system that allowed complete control in either direction, instead of just "up" or "down" as with most of the power lifts from the 30s that I'd had experience with.
Moved around, sold the Ford. Recently, needed something to mow a large "lawn" (there's that hayfield again) where I now live, and found a tiny Ford 1100 (ONLY 35 years old! And it's not RED), and am having the same delight with the compact design, low to the ground, agile, great lift system, 3-point hitch, etc., etc.
One of the things I had never experienced was having 10 (count 'em!) gears, which give you an incredible range of speeds for work requiring the PTO to be up to speed (mowing, bush-hogging, etc.). One of the drawbacks of the A, B, C series was that they had only 4 speeds, with just 1-2-3 available for work. A Cub is not only not very powerful, but has only THREE speeds. Usually 1st gear in any of these tractors is slow enough for mowing or bush-hogging, but not always. I've done a lot of bush-hogging with an H in meadows dotted with "hassocks," and I thought that even first gear was too fast when the going got rough. My "new" Ford will go slower than a person can walk comfortably, and still keep the engine/PTO speed up. I can't say this little compact is as exciting as one of those beautiful, sleek Farmalls--LOVED looking down the hood of that Super M and listening to the throaty roar of the exhaust--but for my purposes, it works. When I get more money, if ever, and I can convince my wife that I need more tractors, I'll get me an H, a Super M, an A, a Cub, a six-speed John Deere A, an Oliver 77, a Titan 10-20 (now there's a dinosaur), and..... let me think. Just kidding. Or am I?

I've spent a lot of time talking about the compact quality of the Fords. The tall tractors don't work very well under trees, and if they are of the larger variety, H and bigger, they can be clumsy in tight quarters. Of course, by sometime in the fifties, many manufacturers were making tractors similar to Ford, Ferguson, Massey-Ferguson. I don't remember much about IH efforts in this area, but I believe they eventually had something low and compact, with some form of "fast hitch," if not the 3-point. If you have ever attached equipment the old way (with numerous bolts used to attach cultivators or the false-drawbar that carried the IHC sickle-bar mowers of the 30s and 40s), you appreciate the wonderful 3-point hitch and hydraulic system that Harry Ferguson brought to Henry Ford.
Ah, some people really like to ramble, don't they? Well, you are very patient. My wife's eyes glaze over by the time I reach the second sentence when I am talking about tractors.

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HughB

11-15-2007 06:55:42




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
To add my two cents worth. I just this year sold my 52 8N. In this hard clay area of Al it just would not run slow enough to plow and disc. That combined with a lack of power for the job.



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Nat 2

11-15-2007 06:34:52




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Nat 2, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
One thing against the Super C, they're tough to find with Fast Hitch. You're far far more likely to find an 8N with a 3pt. Heck, is there such a thing as a "bareback" 8N? Even so, they sell the flippin' parts to add 3pt to an 8N at Tractor Supply!



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Hugh MacKay

11-15-2007 06:27:14




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
Ron: No such thing as a better tractor if your considering a tractor built by one of the 8-10 major manufacrurers of the 1950. There are tractors better suited for the job than others, but that is what they were designed for.

For example, I love my Super A, think it's the greatest thing since sliced bread. That said I wish I had an 8N or a fergie for my Woods belly mower. Farmall being high is just too hard on ornamental trees and tree limbs are just too hard on my old carcass. Now, you see if I had the 8N or fergie, then I could take my center mount cultivators from 140 and put them back on SA. The smaller and lower hood of SA give better view when cultivating than 140. I could buy a Cub 154 for that mower, but I'm betting I'll get better service from a Ford or Fergie.

It's all about matching the tractor to most of the work required. I farmed with a SA, 130, 300, 560, 656 and 1066. I didn't use the 1066 if going checking fences, and I didn't try to pull a 25' cultivator with the SA.

Same with your decission between SC and 8N, both good hobby farm tractors, but what type of hobbies. Hobby vegetables or hobby mowing or somewhere in between. Only you can make that decission.

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Idaho Ron

11-15-2007 06:10:16




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
What I can't seem to understand is why the ford and the Fergusons are so expensive around here. Everyone with a small acreage (under 5 acres) wants a little ford. It seems to me that the Super C would be just as good for 1/3 the money. Most of them have a blade, corrugator, and maybe a brush hog. It seems that the SC could do that just fine.
Ron



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the Unforgiven

11-15-2007 05:56:27




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
If the SC has a FastHitch there is really no comparison, it will move slower, pull harder, and is much easier to manuver, then and now. I have a pair of 8N's and a lot of implements for them. I threw a Super C together out of a couple dead ones two or three years ago and made a FH to 3pt. adapter for it, the only time I have used the Fords since was to pour cement, because the mixer won't fit on the Farmall.

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georgeky

11-14-2007 21:38:04




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
No question, The Super C on both accounts. 8N beat a horse, but SC is a Cadillac compared to the 8N. Super C will handle hills just fine. If it is to steep for SC it is to steep to be on.



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old

11-14-2007 21:35:04




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
Each one has its good and bad points. But you will never find a 1953 8N since the last year they where made is 1952. It also depends on what you call a hobby farm. That could be as little as 5 acres or as big as a few hundred acres and that does make a differrence as to what tractor or tractors you would want/need. My self I would be lost with out having at least 4 or 5 tractors

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Bob Kerr

11-14-2007 21:17:56




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
I would have to go with the C, I do like my Farmall H though, It has been trouble free since I got it fixed up right this summer. If I was going to get something like an 8N I would run past 10 8ns to get to a junk TO-30 Fergy. Those Fegusons are extremly well built and very reliable much more so that the fords of the day. At least the one we have used every summer since Dad rebuilt it the mid 70s is. The replaced parts since the 70s includes 2 mufflers, several batterys due to age, the sediment bowl knob, oil and filters,replaced the manifold due to cracking from a tree getting jambed in the muffler and an ignition switch. That is it! That one of ours has hauled hundreds if not thousands of tons of firewood on the 3 point forks over hill and dale, bushhoged acres and acres of 1-2" dia trees, flipped over junk cars to cut out frames and graded a 1/2 mile long driveway without so much as a hiccup. Still runs like a top and doesn"t use any oil or lose any fluids. Still 6v also.

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Scott Rukke

11-14-2007 20:59:19




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
In my opinion a very important aspect when comparing the two is their height and center of gravity. I would normally pick the C for most applications unless I was doing hillside or slope work in which case I would take the Ford which is more stable on the slopes.



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ScottyHOMEy

11-14-2007 20:20:27




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
Then and now, I'd have to say it depends on what kind of work you have for the tractor to do.

There's not many tractors any handier than a C or SuperC. But the Fords are quite versatile, too.

The SuperC is more of a row-crop type tractor with its higher clearance. In the narrow front, especially, it's mighty handy for maneuvering or turning around in tight spaces. With the right engine/pistons, it makes almost as much power as the original Hs with the distillate engines.

If it were still 1953 and I had to have an 8N, I'd have had an H or M for my second tractor instead of the SuperC. Given a choice, THEN, it would have been a tossup between the SuperC and the 8N for the smaller tractor.

Nowadays one could make a good argument for the 8N being handier if it were your only tractor. For trailing implememts and general tug duty, the two are probably about equal. Again, depending on what you want/need to do with it. 3-point equipment is a lot easier to come by than the Fast-Hitch stuff, but you can get after-market 3-point hitches for SuperCs, and I've seen a good many posts about 3-point arms to fit the fast hitch that only need an anchor point for the top link. Your choice might depend on whether yu're looking for something "off the shelf" (albeit an old shelf) or something readily adapted to your intended use.

If you've got creaky bones, the SuperC might be intimidating to climb up onto, but I'll say that my not so creaky bones sometime have a hard time sorting my feet out for a graceful dismount from a Ford.

As much as I love my SuperC (WFE though she be, lacking the tight turning radius, and I'll never give her up!) . . . If you're looking at exurban duty like bush-hogging, post-hole digging, and hauling stuff around, the 8N might be the handier choice. If you're thinking of maintaining a large garden that would mean a moldboard plow, discing, cultivating and still having something to pull stuff around with, a SuperC would be hard to beat.

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Paul Shuler

11-14-2007 19:54:26




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Idaho Ron, 11-14-2007 19:43:40  
I would have to go with the Super C hands down. They are a very handy tractor. Seems the few 8ns that I have ever been around are light on power and very light on traction. They are good to mow with but I think a Super C could do everything and 8n does and do it better. My 2 cents



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georgeky

11-14-2007 23:03:44




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 Re: Which was a better tractor in reply to Paul Shuler, 11-14-2007 19:54:26  
Paul, you are exactly right. We were plowing fescue sod years ago with a C and 8N. Both had 2 X12 inch plows on them. The ground was tough as it was a little late in the year for plowing sod. The 8N would spin and buck with the plow at 6 inches deep. The old C went right across the field plowing 10 inches deep in 2nd gear, and no spinning or bucking. That was the last time we ever tried plowing with the 8N.

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