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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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10 20?

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Milo Holroyd

01-17-2008 15:18:28




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I thought that I had a 10 20 in my Russell Grader.
But now I'm not sure. I have included a couple pictures for id.

I can't seem to find reference to the mag, nor the carb.

I want to order all of the manuals. But I want to be sure I order the correct ones.

Any help appreciated.

Peace
Milo

http://www.tractorshed.com/gallery/identify/id13496.jpg,http://www.tractorshed.com/gallery/identify/id13497.jpg

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LenNH

01-24-2008 09:36:08




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 Re: 10 20? in reply to Milo Holroyd, 01-17-2008 15:18:28  
Another note on the governor control. On the tractor, there is a quadrant attached to the steering column just below where the steering shaft enters the casting. On the front of the quadrant is the spark control, and on the back, closer to the driver is the governor control. All the way to the left, at 9 o'clock is slow (and off for the mag), and all the way up at 12 o'clock is fast (and full advance for the mag).
The linkage is two tubes. The outside tube stops above the mag, and has attached to it a short lever, which is connected to the mag (E-4A or others similar) by a heavy rod, bent to the proper shape, with L's on the end where the rod is attached at each end. Obviously, this later mag doesn't have any connection to a retard/off lever. The governor control on the tractor is a rod INSIDE the tube. This rod went to the front of the engine, where there was a bracket with a small bushing for the rod to turn in. At the front of this rod was a small lever, and from THIS, a rod, similar to the mag lever, but shaped to fit this area, went across to the
governor control, which is ANOTHER lever that goes into the tube leading back to the carb. Sounds incredibly complex, but it's easy to understand, esp. if you see it once. F-20 and F-30 are similar, but the rods go over the top of the hood instead of down inside the engine compartment. I have good photos of this setup in a very old IH repair book for the 10-20 and 15-30. I will gladly scan and send these to you via e-mail if you just drop me a note at the e-mail link. I "lived" on a 10-20 and an F-20 in my
misspent youth, and they are still very much alive in my mind even if I haven't used one of them in over 50 years. Amazing what trivia you can remember. Now where did I put my car keys?

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LenNH

01-18-2008 07:29:40




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 Re: 10 20? in reply to Milo Holroyd, 01-17-2008 15:18:28  
Just another little bit in the anthill of information. The engine clearly has the original IHC "throttling governor" (not variable, as on late 30s IHC tractors with this design of engine, as used on Farmall, F-20, F-30, 10-20, 15-30/22-36, W-30). The little "bulb" sticking out behind the governor can be turned to give a little bit of adjustment to the load speed of the engine. This brings me back to that carb, which is clearly not designed to be attached to this governor, which has a linkage going across the front of the engine to a crank which then goes back along the left side of the engine to the carburetor. As one of the others who wrote said, maybe the road grader just had an accelerator pedal, but then why is there a regular governor? Would it have been build in but left unattached? Would a road grader be a lot more flexible if it had a governor to maintain the full-load speed? I don't know, I'm just throwing out questions and maybe somebody else can answer them.

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Milo Holroyd

01-18-2008 15:15:24




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 Re: 10 20? in reply to LenNH, 01-18-2008 07:29:40  
Good info Len. No accelerator pedal. Throttle linkage is in the cab near the floor. (most likely the original location if on a tractor).
Clutch pedal is on the right. Shifter in the middle. Hand brake on the left.
As far as the carb goes, near as I can figure, after disassembling the the "control tube", I discovered that someone (hacks) had bent the butterfly out of the way in the original body. Apparently the external wires were working the butterfly in the carb. Whattta ya reckon my chances are of finding a usable correct carb?
Sorry this long. and Thanks for the good info.
I have tried to post a link to more pics
Milo

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Nebraska Cowman

01-18-2008 05:03:42




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 Re: 10 20? in reply to Milo Holroyd, 01-17-2008 15:18:28  
The ST5 was used on IHC trucks 1925 & 1926.
I belive they used the same engine as the 10-20
I can not tell you which carb the Industrial 20 engine used.
The Wico C would have been a replacement mag. The correct one would be the IHC E4



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Milo Holroyd

01-18-2008 05:29:53




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 Re: 10 20? in reply to Nebraska Cowman, 01-18-2008 05:03:42  
Thanks for that info. It helps alot. I'm finding out that I have more of a restoration than first thought. :-)

If I posted some pic's over in the "Help Identify" could you please confirm that the basic engine is a 10-20. According to my Russell book, the Motor Patrol #3 was only built with the 10-20.

As I posted at first, I want to get the mauals ordered.

Thanks for all of your help.

Milo

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steelfronts

01-17-2008 20:22:27




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 Re: 10 20? in reply to Milo Holroyd, 01-17-2008 15:18:28  
Milo' Most likely it an I20 industrial tractor under there. The mag is just a replacement Fairbanks Morse. The I20 often came with a different manifold and a Robin or other than the ag tractor carb. The I20 was the same as the 10 20 with small differences like a gas pedai, duals and no fenders..



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LenNH

01-17-2008 17:42:11




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 Re: 10 20? in reply to Milo Holroyd, 01-17-2008 15:18:28  
I'll have to defer to somebody else on the carb.
As far as I know, the agricultural 10-20 always had a side-draft carb, Ensign as I remember. There MAY have been other manifold installations for uses other than in farm tractors. This carb is clearly updraft, as you would see on F-20, F-30, W-30, BUT there is no way that I can see that this would work with the normal 10-20 governor. I suppose it would be possible to put on a carb and just use the throttle as you would on a car, without a governor. Was this carb actually ON the engine, or could it be among some stuff that came with the machine?
The mag is probably not IH, but I cannot swear to it. There were other mfrs. who made mags that would fit the flat base formerly occupied by E-4A and F-4 IHC magnetos. Fairbanks-Morse comes to mind, but that's all I can say. Sorry I can't be more help.

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Milo Holroyd

01-17-2008 18:05:50




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 Re: 10 20? in reply to LenNH, 01-17-2008 17:42:11  
link to the pic.
also the mag is a Wico series Chttp://www.tractorshed.com/gallery/identify/id13499.jpg



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Milo Holroyd

01-17-2008 15:52:03




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 Re: 10 20? in reply to Milo Holroyd, 01-17-2008 15:18:28  
Sorry, thought I had included this:
The carb is a Zenith ST 5. The mag is a Series C, 184C serial 419982. I beleive the engine is a circa 1928 McCormick-Deering 10-20.

Thanks
Milo



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