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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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Help me understand

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Mr. Mayor

02-02-2008 06:32:00




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I see a thread from time to time where the topic is IH dealer prices. The most popular opinion seems to be that we should all bow down in thanks to the dealers for continuing to offer parts for our old iron. Granted, there is a cost associated with everything including keeping parts available for which there is a limited demand but somewhere lies the line between a fair price and shameless gouging. It is to the dealer's advantage to know how high to go since beyond that line I will do anything in my power to find an alternative to being raped. With the internet, I am not limited to local IH dealers and I have found a vast difference in pricing for the same part. I won't name names but I will never again deal with my local IH store that wanted $30 for a snap ring that I eventually found for $3.50 from another IH dealer. I understand supply and demand, what I don't understand is why a dealer would chase away a guy that spend hundreds of dollars a year to try to make a few extra bucks out of greed.

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BOBM25

02-03-2008 12:26:57




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 Re: Help me understand in reply to Mr. Mayor, 02-02-2008 06:32:00  
It's not just the small guy. Some parts are just plain $$$$ coming from the dealer. The exhaust stack fell off our 7130 last spring. The elblow at the bottom rusted out. Didn't notice it getting weak till it just plain fell off. Went to local Case dealer for a replacement. The new elbow and new stack pipe-over 500 bucks! We farm 800 acres, use IH equip, and go to this dealer for everything we need. The tractor is a 1991 model, its not brand new, but its new enough. The stack is just a 5 ft end of thin wall tubing with a heat shield tack welded to it. I don't think the dealer was putting it to us or anything, the part was just that expensive from Case. He probably didn't have a choice. He's gotta make a few bucks on it, as I expect him to.

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Randy-IA

02-02-2008 10:15:24




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 Re: Help me understand in reply to Mr. Mayor, 02-02-2008 06:32:00  
Seems to me that all the replies here are from business operators or owners of some sort . I'm fairly new to working on tractors but not to working on motorcycles , cars or pickups . I don't see the difference between the four types . Parts are parts . If it's the first time rebuilder so what ? The dealer may work with million dollar custumers . That , in my opinion , doesn't make them special -only arrogant . Everybody deserves equal time at a parts counter . How does that parts guy know how much you are going to spend in the long run ? It may be a three dollar part today that takes two hours to find for an antique tractor but if he's nice and helpful tomorrow it might be a $15,000 electronically controlled transmission for a newer machine purchased elswhere . I worked a parts counter at a motorcycle shop for years as a teen and sometimes the most unlikely person spent the most money . I don't hesitate to ask questions at the parts counter . If there are more than a couple of people waiting I let the others go first if all I need is answers . I'm so glad the dealers around here don't have the attitude I hear on here all the time . Not everyone farms 2000 acres and has money falling out of their wallets like is implied on these forums all the time , some of us have to be frugal . If it takes two hours to locate a part that should cost twenty dollars and they want $120 for it I have no problem at all saying thank you for looking , if I don't find it somewhere else cheaper then I'll be back . The dealers I work with also work on their own antiques and fully understand . Some of them will tell me where to get a aftermarket of equal or better quality too . ...Randy

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MN Rick

02-02-2008 10:32:03




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 Re: Help me understand in reply to Randy-IA, 02-02-2008 10:15:24  
Randy, you are to be commended for letting other go first if its only information you are after. I suspect there isnt a one of us who at one time or another has simply went in for info. That being said, to compare a motorcycle parts counter to an Ag dealership parts counter simply isnt a fair comparison. A motorcycle dealership's customer base is many times wider than the Ag dealership. While possible, I can't imagine anyone spending thousands or tens of thousands of dollars for years on end at the parts counter of a motorcycle dealership. Over in the accessory department, yes, its VERY easy to imagine. In life, the old 80-20 (80% of your sales come from 20% of your customers, 80% of your headaches come from a different 20% of your customers) rule seams to apply, but it seams to apply even more at Ag dealerships. If it werent for the big guys buying there, they would'nt be here for us small guys.

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Randy-IA

02-02-2008 15:46:38




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 Re: Help me understand in reply to MN Rick, 02-02-2008 10:32:03  
That's just the way I am Rick . I'm a big guy ( 265+lbs ) and I don't like to get in the way ;) . I don't understand the comment of a wider customer base . Back then at least there weren't many people riding Harley's just like there's not many people that actually farm by percentage of the population . By the way it wasn't a dealer but a custom shop . It may not be a fair comparison monetarily but why does that matter ? The cost's involved with running a business are the same percentage wise . Ag dealer part costs more because it's a larger part or less common . It's true that a ag dealer is more time sensitive than other types of dealers . The five dealerships I trade with are all open on Saturday till noon . That's when I have time to go get what I need . I seldom see farmers in there on Saturday ordering parts . I have a friend that works at a agco dealer . He said the big spenders give him more trouble and headaches than the ones just looking for obsolete parts . Maybe if the big spender wasn't there the parts would just be less expensive . Take care ! ...Randy

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MN Rick

02-02-2008 09:10:53




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 Re: Help me understand in reply to Mr. Mayor, 02-02-2008 06:32:00  
Cant get this topic off my mind. I want to make it clear that while I'm glad they support the older stuff, I'm by no means advocating "bowing down" to them. Given the growing distance between IH dealers, I can only ask myself how much gas, time or postage was invested in your snap ring search. I fully agree that 30.00 is terribly high for a snap ring. I also agree with the comment below that there is likely a mistake. The possibility also exists that based upon experience, they were encouraging you to buy parts elsewhere and you will both be happier for it. I'm reminded of a time I was standing at the dealer having a cup of coffee after I had gotten my parts and a fellow came in to get a part. It was quite a fiasco before it was over, with many questions asked and answered not even pertaining to the particular part. I wish I could remember what the part was, but I do remember hoping I never had to buy one because of the outrageous price. When the fellow left, a guy standing next to me commented about hoping to never having buy that particular part. Owner was walking by at that point and commented..."you guys dont pay the complicated buyer surcharge". I've got a particular pars guy that will steer me to the cheaper place when he knows IH is out of line on that part. I'm not suggesting that you are a "complicated buyer". But as you read these forums, it is easy to see that there could be some very time consuming parts buyers out there. In the age of information that we live in, it is not beyond belief that things like that could be tracked right to a part number and we all end up paying a price for the novices.

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gordy from Iowa

02-02-2008 15:58:13




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 Re: Help me understand in reply to MN Rick, 02-02-2008 09:10:53  
Was at a hardware store buying a $300+ chainsaw. When the guy wrote out the ticket, it was for $20 cheaper than he told me it would be. I pointed that out to him and he said, Yes, but you didn't take 45 minutes to make up your mind.



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mkirsch

02-02-2008 08:52:47




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 Re: Help me understand in reply to Randy in NE, 02-02-2008 06:32:00  
The key is "few hundred dollars." A few hundred dollars' in parts is a few dollars' profit to the dealer. These dealers generally have customers that spend a few hundred THOUSAND dollars a year on equipment, service, and parts. You're small potatoes, and they're not likely to miss your business at the end of the year when they close the books.



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JT

02-02-2008 08:21:45




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 Re: Help me understand-I Understand in reply to Mr. Mayor, 02-02-2008 06:32:00  
Did you ask your local dealer why it was so high? A lot of our suppliers are starting to go to 10 packs and are priced per 10. sounds as though your local dealer might have made an honest mistake and priced you for 10 instead of 1. Also keep in mind, their are lot of specialty parts being sold, and snap rings are one we run into a lot, you put a generic snap ring on and it could be a couple thousands of an inch narower, not the correct ID or OD by a few thousands of an inch, but will "fit" but for how long and at how much expense in the long run?

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agpilot

02-02-2008 06:47:35




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 Re: Help me understand in reply to Mr. Mayor, 02-02-2008 06:32:00  
Hello Mr Mayor: Your question:. "I understand supply and demand, what I don't understand is why a dealer would chase away a guy that spend hundreds of dollars a year to try to make a few extra bucks out of greed." My takes is that it is his right, within limits, to operate his busines as he see fit. I have turned away some fields to aerial spray because it was too risky. (..and it had to be VERY risky for me to do that) I would accept having to go under power lines on every pass and many other things but bottom line ended up being that I averaged turning away under 2 percent per year. Some of those got argry and other agreed with me. Win some... lose some. Just my view. agpilot.

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Mr. Mayor

02-02-2008 07:42:54




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 Re: Help me understand in reply to agpilot, 02-02-2008 06:47:35  
Of course it's his right, he can ask $100 for the snap ring but I doubt he would sell any. I would have paid $10 (still a rip) but he crossed the line with $30. That's his risk, no power lines, just a lost customer. Where's the logic?



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JT

02-02-2008 08:33:12




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 Re: Help me understand in reply to Mr. Mayor, 02-02-2008 07:42:54  
If you buy a "few hundred" dollars worth of parts a year, how many times do you go in, ask for information, and buy nothing? Are you willing to pay his shop labor rate for the time you asked questions??? Jim



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MN Rick

02-02-2008 08:09:56




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 Re: Help me understand in reply to Mr. Mayor, 02-02-2008 07:42:54  
This simply the free market at work. I have seen many occasions where the dealer has been at the exact same price as the aftermarket people and other occasions (like yours) where the dealer is in left field. In many cases, when it comes to old tractor parts, the fellow buying them is restoring the first tractor he ever owned and has no basic knowledge of the part he is looking for and will take up an hour of the parts man's time to buy a $10.00 part. Yes it's true, he may spend several hundred dollars in parts over the next few months, but if that money is made while a large customer that has been buying several times that amount for years and will be continuing to buy that amount for years to come is waiting in line, the dealer has lost his a$$ on the sale. Not only that, chances are that the large buyer has already looked in his own parts book and called the part numbers in ahead of time. Yes it's true, prices can vary widely. I've stood in line at the local dealer on a saturday morning and watched some fellow try to get the poor partsman to diagnose a problem on his garden tractor for him and leave without spending a dime while I was waiting to pickup an $800.00 overhaul kit. In fairness, Ive also recently walked up to the counter and simply ordered a side cover gasket and the new style bolts with O-rings that stop the perpetual leaking.Without asking the price (yes, foolish)I laid a $100.00 bill on the counter thinking I was getting between 70.00 and 75.00 back. Got 37.00 back. Yes I felt gouged that time. For the most part, I'm glad that the CNH and the dealers support these old tractors because I'm sure there are more times than not that it isn'r profitable.

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