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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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New Clutch / same old problem

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wood-haulin-cubber

02-22-2008 13:28:48




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Just installed a new clutch in our 51' Cub. New disc/ new pressure plate/ new throw-out-bearing...all brand new...all went good, no problems (this time). Just took the tractor for a ride & it's got the same symptoms as old clutch...when 1st shifting into any gear, I step on the clutch, idle down & go to shift...the problem is that the shaft must still be spinning in the tranny because it causes a grinding sound...it sounds like I'm going to chip gears? Any ideas? We've had this tractor for years & just developed these symptoms over past year or so....I thought for sure the new clutch would solve it...I double checked the pressureplate before installing & I tried adjusting the clutch pedal, it seems as though no matter how far I depress the clutch , it doesn't stop the input shaft from spinning? Thanks for ideas.

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Gary North of Spokan

02-23-2008 09:58:29




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to wood-haulin-cubber, 02-22-2008 13:28:48  
I had the same problem on my John Deere M. We split it three times before considering the pilot bearing which in this case is a bushing. Replaced the bushing and all went well. Actually, that was all that was wrong with it; the new parts were unnecessary.



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jim ll

02-23-2008 04:10:13




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to wood-haulin-cubber, 02-22-2008 13:28:48  
the farmall cub is almost the only clutch that comes without the three fingers on the pressure plate pre adjusted. Once you install i ton the flywheel according to the manual your supposed to adjust the fingers to a certain height and they alll have to match. And from experience it DOES matter. If one is far out it won"t fully release that third of the clutch. And read the book close because if you are off the wrong way when you push the clutch down the throwout bearing hits the clutch and knocks. It is possibl eto adjust them thru the bottom hole although diffacult. Go to farmall cubs-com and put the question to them and you"ll get plenty of good answers jim

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Janicholson

02-22-2008 16:55:08




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to wood-haulin-cubber, 02-22-2008 13:28:48  
Here is the test of tests.
Put the tractor in neutral, start it with the clutch pushed all the way downwhile it is all the way down, and has not been let out one biddy bit, try to put it in first. if it goes right in you are looking at no problem at all. The change in fluid and servicing may have freed it to the point that it acts like any other straight cut gear, non-syncro transmission.and has inertia causing the gr=ears to continue to rotate. If it grinds the same as when you had the clutch out (before) then put it in gear, it may be a bent pilot dry bad pilot, or warped disk. JimN

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wood-haulin-cubber

02-23-2008 06:33:58




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to Janicholson, 02-22-2008 16:55:08  
Good morning! Just went out & tried your suggestion. Cub went right into gear w/ no grinding...than & shifted from 1st to reverse w/ no grinding....all the way up & down, no grinding. Than I shut it off. Started it again in Nuetral w/o having my foot on the clutch (this is the way I normally start it because I generally let it warm up for a few minutes before I get on & start working it)....pressed the clutch & shifted into 1st....same as before, slow grind....so, I engaged the rear PTO & watched it....it takes about 20 seconds for the shaft to come to a complete stop ....if I start it w/ my foot on the clutch, it never starts rotation..... so, I guess I'll keep what I got & learn to use it a "new" way. thanks for the help, glad I don't have to split it again.

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Janicholson

02-23-2008 07:29:10




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to wood-haulin-cubber, 02-23-2008 06:33:58  
You are welcome. The most difficult thing to realize is that these tractors are routinely raked into gear with a bit of grind. I have been involved since 3 yrs old being on them and learning to get things done. We have tractors that were new when I started on the (Im 59) the transmissions have never given any trouble. the worst case is to try to grind forceably into high gear. this in most cases provides the tooth wear on splines that cause jumping out, and gear failure. Gentile application of finger pressure is no problem, and a standard procedure. JimN

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Bigdog

02-22-2008 14:28:40




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to wood-haulin-cubber, 02-22-2008 13:28:48  
Either the pilot bushing is shot or the input shaft has a slight bend in it causing enough drag at the pilot bushing to keep the shaft turning. It's real easy to bend that long shaft without realizing it.



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gene bender

02-22-2008 13:54:13




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to wood-haulin-cubber, 02-22-2008 13:28:48  
Did you install a new pilot bearing in the crankshaft when it was apart?



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wood-haulin-cubber

02-22-2008 14:03:39




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to gene bender, 02-22-2008 13:54:13  
I didn't know the crank shaft had a pilot bearing...I put a little grease on the end of the shaft before re-installing....I really don't want to split it again...ut-oh...



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495man

02-22-2008 13:43:00




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to Nebraska Kirk, 02-22-2008 13:28:48  
Did the flywheel need planed? Sometimes they warp and the old clutch likes it, especially if slipped a lot from being worn out (or like a loader tractor) the new clutch doesn't mate correctly and won't release all the way..hence you can't get tractor in gear..or stop it.....



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wood-haulin'-cubber

02-22-2008 14:04:55




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to 495man, 02-22-2008 13:43:00  
I didn't...I looked at it...put a steel rule on it & it looked flat....ut-oh....



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glennster

02-22-2008 13:41:50




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to wood-haulin-cubber, 02-22-2008 13:28:48  
with the tractor in gear does the clutch disengage ok ? what oil are you running in the rear end? if the clutch isnt hanging up anywhere, no burrs on shaft ect, maybe try some 140 wt in the rear end. too light of oil will let the shaft coast and not come to a stop causing the grinding.



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wood-haulin-cubber

02-22-2008 14:06:25




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to glennster, 02-22-2008 13:41:50  
it does diss-engage...I like the heavier lube option as opposed to splitting it again, thanks



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old

02-22-2008 13:38:53




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to wood-haulin-cubber, 02-22-2008 13:28:48  
I know this might sound funny but have you checked the transmission fluid lever and #1 made sure it has no water in it and #2 is as full as it should be. If it has water or the fluid is low or even the wrong type that can be your problem



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wood-haulin-cubber

02-22-2008 13:44:50




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to old, 02-22-2008 13:38:53  
thanks for fast response...I just put new fluid in the trans, I use 80-90W...I use NAPPA brand...should I be using something else? ...maybe I don't have enough in? I pull the plug on the top of the trans & remove little plug on lower left side of case, I fill until fluid drips out (maybe 3qrt)....sound right?



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old

02-22-2008 14:14:52




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to wood-haulin-cubber, 02-22-2008 13:44:50  
Sounds about right and also the right fluid. Another thing it could be is a bad pilot bearing if you didn't replace it that could be the problem also



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wood-haulin-cubber

02-22-2008 14:29:34




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to old, 02-22-2008 14:14:52  
what is a pilot bearing? is it behind the flyweel, pressed into the crankshaft?



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old

02-22-2008 14:56:42




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to wood-haulin-cubber, 02-22-2008 14:29:34  
Not really behind the flywheel but more like in the center of it. Some are ball bearing types and others are just a brass bushing. I don't remember for sure on a cub since its been about 5 years since I last did a clutch job on one



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billde

02-22-2008 13:37:02




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to wood-haulin-cubber, 02-22-2008 13:28:48  
Did you replace the throw out bearing? Sounds like the clutch is not releasing. How much free travel do you have at the pedal?



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wood-haulin-cubber

02-22-2008 13:47:16




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 Re: New Clutch / same old problem in reply to billde, 02-22-2008 13:37:02  
Thanks for response, I did put a new trow out bearing in it...I've got a full inch of free play on the pedal...



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