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Harry Ferguson Tractors Discussion Forum
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relief valve question

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overunder1

08-26-2006 14:31:09




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I did my best to change out the relief valve on my to-30 through the side inspection opening but golly thats a small spot for big hands to get into. If I drain the fluid can I get to the valve from underneath or is there an even better way.
-Lee




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Subway

08-27-2006 09:20:29




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to overunder1, 08-26-2006 14:31:09  

I think your tractor is too-little for those big bales..... "risky task"


My 2 cents

Subway



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overunder1

08-27-2006 11:03:52




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to Subway, 08-27-2006 09:20:29  
Yes, the bales do make the front end a little light but still have good steering control. Since almost all of the moving is from barn (storage) to field without any inclines or ditches to worry about I am not worried about tip overs or hitting any of the flower gardens.
-Lee



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Subway

08-27-2006 11:15:19




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to overunder1, 08-27-2006 11:03:52  

Flower garden,,,flower banks....

I must be careful here to not pass over or damage
flowers with tractor or machinery because I will
have little speech or cook my supper myself...

ha..ha....

Happy tractoring

Subway



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John (UK)

08-27-2006 05:57:34




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to overunder1, 08-26-2006 14:31:09  
Pull the PTO shaft and use an open ended wrench you can do it that way, it does depend on the size of you're hands though, I am fortunate I only have small hands. Remove the seat and both side port covers and lie across the tractor, one hand in each port.
Why do you think the relief valve needs changing? Have you tested the pressure or are you changing it just to try it? There is a proper procedure to go through to eliminate all possibilities. It could just be a straight forward leak, you would get the same result (i.e down on pressure.) You can only change the Control Valve from underneath and not all of them as some have an oscillator fitted, and that would mean the Pump coming out.

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Ray,IN

08-26-2006 23:08:28




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to overunder1, 08-26-2006 14:31:09  
No, you can't access the valve from underneath. There is much work involved to remove the hydraulic pump. The valve is under the PTO shaft on the rear the hydraulic pump. You might be able to change the valve by removing the PTO shaft and working through the opening, using a long extension and deep-well socket. I've changed it through the right side cover plate, but small hands are an asset as you now know. I didn't even drain the oil. I'd find someone with smaller hands to change the valve through the side opening. I think it requires a short 3/4" open end wrench. BTW, don't use a Ford valve even though they appear identical. The Ford valve has a lower setting(1,800psi) than the H. Ferguson's 2,300psi. If you go to the "unofficial Harry Ferguson web page" you'll find an exploded parts drawing of the pump assembly. I can't post the web address here you know.

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overunder1

08-27-2006 07:16:25




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to Ray,IN, 08-26-2006 23:08:28  
The lift although quite happy raising my 600# medium duty bush hog is quite un-happy at 5x6 round bales. It will lift them maybe 6 inches or so then starts to chatter and stops. I read through all the posts on lift problems that I could locate and thought that maybe a new relief valve would give me the little bit more lift effort that I need to move the bales about the pasture. The shop manual is not all that clear about changing out the valve. I could put a pressure gauge on the top fitting and check the output pressure first. -Lee

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John (UK)

08-27-2006 12:25:52




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to overunder1, 08-27-2006 07:16:25  
That is the proper way to do it, check the pressure first, it should read 2000psi +/-100psi. You can make the hydraulics lift a little more if the pressure is correct by drilling the lower links and attaching the lift rods 3" further back, this changes the leverage as you can imagine and it will make a difference, just be aware of lifting too much and making the tractor unstable on the front end, if necessary use front wheel weights. Just make sure that the 3" measurement will allow your lift rods to miss catching on the lower-link or they will bend the lift rod. Some lift rods don't have as much clearance as others between the legs of the fork at the bottom.

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overunder1

08-27-2006 16:37:37




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to John (UK), 08-27-2006 12:25:52  
Thanks John, another great idea. Tomorrow I will pick up a pressure guage and verify reading. If that checks out ok I needed to order new lift arms anyways, since the ends are pretty much worn out. That might just do the trick. As it is now I can only just lift those bales so it should not take much. Will report on findings.
-Lee



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John (UK)

08-27-2006 16:57:38




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to overunder1, 08-27-2006 16:37:37  
Sparex do some lower link arms with three holes in already, the extra holes are for the HD stabilisers but you could use them. you would need to make a special thicker bush though, but that would be better than trying to drill them. the part number is S15174. We used that idea of moving the lift arms further back on the little Leyland tractor when it wouldn't pick up a flail mower, worked a treat.

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John (UK)

08-28-2006 14:03:17




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to John (UK), 08-27-2006 16:57:38  
Sorry I should have said about the check chains, what you do is use the middle hole for the chains as original, you may have to use the new type bolt though and just leave the chains at the original length. Make sure that when the lower links are at the top they cant swing at all when an implement is attached, the chains should just be taking the free movement.



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overunder1

08-28-2006 11:22:00




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to John (UK), 08-27-2006 16:57:38  
First up was drilling new holes. That is certainly high strength steel. Took two carbide bits to do them both in my drill press. Hooked up a pressure gauge to the front left port and found the following readings
1. Box Blade--- @ 350psi at first lift then back to zero unless I hit a bump while raised
2. Round Bale--- With the arms in the new holes picked them right up with a reading of +-1500psi wheee your idea worked John thanks
3. Nothing on the arms--- never saw the gauge move at all.

I will have to shift the link points back and forth depending on whether I am using ground engaging implements or the hay spear, but a side benefit of the second location is it supports the bush hog without the need for lower chains or worrying about it scalping the ground if the lift lowers.
-Lee

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John (UK)

08-28-2006 13:59:13




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to overunder1, 08-28-2006 11:22:00  
To check the pressure you do need to prevent the lower links from lifting, if you don"t all you get is the pressure reading necessary to lift whatever you have on the lower links at that time. With the lower links prevented from lifting then the relief valve should blow and that will be the maximum pressure you can get. Yes the links are very hard, you mustn"t have got the second email I sent that gave the part number of a lower link with three holes in it already. Anyway glad your problem is solved, just a word of warning, don"t oil or grease the lower link ball ends, they will collect grit and wear away rapidly. Nothing to stop you leaving the lift rods in the rear position if it is easier for you though.
Regarding the Bush Hog, if you email me I have the information on how to prevent it scalping and getting the tractor to control the height of the front of the mower.

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overunder1

08-28-2006 11:25:50




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to overunder1, 08-28-2006 11:22:00  
Also. I had to lengthen each check chain about two links each to allow full upward travel of the arms without binding.



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overunder1

08-28-2006 14:33:18




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to overunder1, 08-28-2006 11:25:50  
I went back out and tried lifting a bale with the lift arms in the original setting and watched the gauge climb to @2100psi then start to flutter along with a rattling sound from the pump. I guess that all in all a 5x6 round bale is right at the limit of what the stock hydraulics can pick up, thus problem solved with your suggestion. I know a bigger tractor could pick them up easily but driving over the divot that would make in my wallet would have made significant other more unhappy than possibly mowing down her petunias :)
-Lee

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John (UK)

08-29-2006 07:00:30




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 Re: relief valve question in reply to overunder1, 08-28-2006 14:33:18  
The reading you got of 2100psi is right on the button, you couldn't really expect to get anymore out of the system, but as long as you can now lift the bales that is great. You would be surprised at how many other guys that write in have the same problem as you with the "better half" they also mention how should this same peron want something like a new kitchen or furniture then that it is ok, what happened to equality for all? .....John

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