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841 crankshaft counter weight

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A-from-la

11-10-2005 17:31:24




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I have a guy in the process of rebuilding my 841, I think it is a 61 or 62 model. Anyway he told me the counterweight for the crank has previously been removed, and I wish someone could explain to me what it does and looks like. The tractor ran before the rebuild was started, it just smoked BAD. The number stamped on the crank is B9NN6302B and has SF stamped below this number. There is a ring gear about the center of the crank that's kind of dinged up a bit, and I think that's where this counterweight rides, or attaches or whatever you call it. I couldn't really understand how it operates.

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Farmer Alf

11-10-2005 22:30:27




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 Re: 841 crankshaft counter weight in reply to A-from-la, 11-10-2005 17:31:24  
Hi A-from-la,

Folks have tried to answer the practical aspect of your question so I thought I'd give ya the theory.This will take some thinking. Imagine an engine with a 6 in stroke and a 12 in connecting rod. The crank pin rotates in a 6 in diameter circle 3in up from center and 3in down. Assuming an end view of the crank, when the crankpin is at 9 o'clock the piston is about 11in above the crank centerline because the connecting rod is at an angle. At noon the piston is 12in of connecting rod plus 3in of crankshaft lift or 15in above crank centerline. At 6 o'clock the piston is 12in of connecting rod minus 3in of crankshaft or 9 in above crank centerline. In other words, during the top half rotation the piston moves 4in up and back and in the bottom half it only moves 2in. The crank rotates at a constant speed through the rotation so the piston has to move faster through the top half. On a four cylinder engine the jerk created by the 2 pistons going up does not ballance the corresponding jerk of the two pistons going down so a ballancer is sometimes used. (numbers chosen are totally arbitrary to illistrate my point and are not mathematically accurate)

The ballancer is a box with gear driven offset weights which are timed to the crankshaft. The idea is the offset weights are sized and timed to exactly counterballance the above effect.

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B. Jones

11-10-2005 19:17:26




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 Re: 841 crankshaft counter weight in reply to A-from-la, 11-10-2005 17:31:24  
I have a 971-D. It was built in Dec. 1959 and was an early model but it had the balancer. Around 1970 the balancer went bad, and we took it out. Up to about 1700 rpm it was not too bad but above that it shook pretty bad. Within 6 months, my dad bought a new balancer and we put it back in. It really makes a lot of difference. We were lucky as the tooth broke off the balancer and not the crankshaft. A new balancer fixed it up. If you can still buy or find one, it really helps.

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Wayne in Iowa

11-10-2005 18:21:17




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 Re: 841 crankshaft counter weight in reply to A-from-la, 11-10-2005 17:31:24  
When Ford first came with the four cylinder diesel tractor engines (144 & 172 cu in) they had no balancers. Later, and I don't remember how much later,he put balancers in these engines and eleminated a lot of vibration. I would speculate that a prevuse owner had a balancer go bad and couldn't get parts so put it back to gether without. It will probably run a long time that way, as these tractors are not run 24/7 like the used too when they first came out.

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A-from-la

11-10-2005 17:33:21




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 Re: 841 crankshaft counter weight in reply to A-from-la, 11-10-2005 17:31:24  
Sorry, I meant 641D not 841



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Hurley J. D.

11-11-2005 05:59:46




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 Re: 841 crankshaft counter weight in reply to A-from-la, 11-10-2005 17:33:21  
You will have to find a balancer that was supplied for your engine as a dealer installed kit. It attaches to the engine with the bolts that attachs the main bearing cap. On the later engines the balancer was installed at the factory and the installation was different. The shop manual from IT and Ford explains this.



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RickB

11-11-2005 15:55:43




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 Re: 841 crankshaft counter weight in reply to Hurley J. D., 11-11-2005 05:59:46  
It is true there are differences between the field installed and factory installed balancer kits. But a '61 or '62 should have been factory fitted. A couple years ago I broke the crank on my unbalanced 1958 841D. With the help of some guys here, I rounded up all the stuff to do a retrofit balancer. The balancer housing itself was different, but readily available. The cradle that mounts to the center main was another story. I was lucky to get a NOS cradle.

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Hurley J. D.

11-11-2005 20:18:13




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 Re: 841 crankshaft counter weight in reply to RickB, 11-11-2005 15:55:43  
If this info is correct then I have a balancer that can be fitted to your tractor. I only have the balancer, no mounting hardware and the oil shield on the bottom is gone. I know where there is a 55 gallon barrel full of the balancers. This persons father took the balancers out of every engine that he worked on. He said they did not need them and made a very loud whining noise.The old Ford mechanic at the local NH shop says there was a lot of broke cranks in the area also. Any way let me know if you need the balancer.

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A-from-la

11-11-2005 09:12:09




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 Re: 841 crankshaft counter weight in reply to Hurley J. D., 11-11-2005 05:59:46  
Thanks to everyone for the info. The casting numbers on the crank are the same as for a 172cid. So, would a balancer gear from a 172 work on my 144 also? Any Ideas where to find one? Does it usually come matched with a new crank? Thanks in advance.



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