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1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start.

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Patrick M

09-29-2001 05:45:33




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My 1955 Ford 860 was running okay until two weeks ago after a lot of rain. It will crank but won't start. The carb dumps fuel when I stop cranking. I'm not getting spark. I thought it was the coil, so I replaced it, but still no spark. I have one of those testers that looks like a screwdriver with a light in it. It lights up if I put it across the coil terminals but not if I put it on the output of the coil while I crank. Any ideas?
Thanks Patrick

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MarkB

10-01-2001 03:28:22




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 Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to Patrick M, 09-29-2001 05:45:33  
Your test light probably won't work on the high side of the coil. There's not enough current to illuminate the light. However, you can use the test light to make certain that the points are opening by cranking the motor and making sure that the light goes out when the points should be open.

Double check to make certain that you really aren't getting spark at the plugs. My experience is that the carburetor will blow gas out when several of the intake valves are stuck. This is not uncommon if the tractor has been sitting out in wet weather.

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Brandon Howell

09-30-2001 08:41:16




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 Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to Patrick M, 09-29-2001 05:45:33  
I just had the same problem with my Oliver 77. It turned out to be the condenser. IT only cost like 16 bucks or so to replace maybe less.
I hope this helps.
Brandon



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keep the ground of the light tester on the battery ground

09-29-2001 17:32:50




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 Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to Patrick M, 09-29-2001 05:45:33  
or on the mainframe of the tractor. you should get a light on the battery side of the coil. And on the distributor side of the coil when the points are closed.



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tom

09-29-2001 17:28:04




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 Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to Patrick M, 09-29-2001 05:45:33  
Patrick,

I have the same problem from time to time.

Check to see battery is fully charged. And with the 6V, it doesn't take but a 1 volt drop in resistance somewhere to reduce the volts enough to prevent a good start.

Most often it's the points. It doesn't take much for them to have a tiny bit of corrosion set in after awhile especially after a period of rain or wet, thus blocking good contacts. Even after a slight filing with 600 grit paper, it starts after a couple of sandings, but, the coating is micro thin and two to three filings is all I can get off a set before chucking them into the woods, and putting a new set on with condensor. That does the trick most of the time.

The next thing and usually the first thing I do is make sure every connection is tight, corrosion free, clean and bright...from the switch to gauges, all the way to the coil. Then I go through the points scenario I described above.

If that doesn't work, I check for a possible ground inside the cap on the distibutor plate where the points mount. The main wire coming into the cap from the coil must not be touching the distributor plate or the distributor. Make sure it is properly insulated to prevent a grounding situation.

Lightly sand the rotor and contacts inside the cap. Look inside the main lead on the top of the coil...clean the contact there on the wire and the coil itself...the inside of that where water may have set in there to start some corrosion.

If you're getting current on the distibutor side of the coil and on the points themselves...it has to be a ground out or poor contact/corrosion issue...or weak battery.

It could be the coil...as some posted, some new coils just are bad coils out of the box.

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Jim.UT

09-29-2001 09:40:51




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 Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to Patrick M, 09-29-2001 05:45:33  
I've not had to replace a coil on my 850 yet so I don't have experience, but I've heard of numerous bad 6V coils right out of the box. I would follow the other advice first and make sure the distributor is very dry. I had a Farmall Cub that would not start after a rainstorm until it dried out.



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walt

09-29-2001 09:00:45




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 Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to Patrick M, 09-29-2001 05:45:33  
Lots of Rain? I would remove distributor cap, wipe dry. Leave the cap off to dry out the insides. Points may have gotten wet..May need to file them a little



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Patrick M

09-29-2001 09:33:38




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 Re: Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to walt, 09-29-2001 09:00:45  
I will try filing the points. The inside of the cap is very clean and dry. When I put my tester across the terminals on the coil, I get no light, (even when I crank). Is that correct or do I have a bad ground? If I touch from either terminal to the ground on the battery, I get a light, (when the key is on), but from terminal to terminal no light.

Thanks Patrick



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Patrick M

09-29-2001 10:39:21




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 Re: Re: Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to Patrick M, 09-29-2001 09:33:38  
I tried filing the points. No luck. Anything else I can check?

Thanks Patrick



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ErnieD

09-29-2001 13:46:58




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to Patrick M, 09-29-2001 10:39:21  
Your tester should blink as the points open and close to the coil. You get a spark off the coil when the magnetic field of the coil windings collapse. You can manually open and close the points, with your finger nail, and trace your electric with the tester.



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Patrick M

09-29-2001 14:36:16




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to ErnieD, 09-29-2001 13:46:58  
If I clip the tester to the battery ground (+) and then touch either terminal on the coil when the key is on it lights up. If I crank the engine while touching either terminal the light blinks. If I touch the output of the coil I get no light ever. It's a brand new coil. If I clip the tester to one terminal of the coil and touch the other terminal it will not light whether the key is on or off or even if I crank.

I don't know what else to test.

Thanks Patrick

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ErnieD

10-01-2001 18:44:12




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to Patrick M, 09-29-2001 14:36:16  
If it blinks, the low volt side is good. Try a spark gap on the secondary side. You should have a good blue fat spark with a snap. Wash the distributor cap out with 90% alcohol and set in the sun to dry. Make sure there is no carbon tracking inside the cap or rotor. Scrape the aluminum posts to get rid of the oxide crust.

Pull the spark wires off the plugs and let lie on loosely. This is an old trick to build volts to spark accross wet/dirty plugs before the spark is bled off the insulator.

Be sure of the coil wire to the distributor, test it with your light tester.

Lastly drain the carburator bowl, I think it is a 1/2 in cap at the bottom of the bowl. You may have a slug of water in the carb. Check sediment bulb for water, if it is full you may be able to tell.

If it seems to be ignition, its a fuel problem.

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Patrick M

10-02-2001 04:15:24




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to ErnieD, 10-01-2001 18:44:12  
Thanks to all who posted. I bought new points and condensor for $5.00 and it started up! Thanks again to everyone who helped out.

Patrick



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David Felkner

10-01-2001 11:50:02




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to Patrick M, 09-29-2001 14:36:16  
One side of the coil goes to the battery via the ignition switch and the other side of the coil goes to the points and condenser. The polarity of the coil terminals is different depending on if you have negative or positive ground sytem. If you have a positive ground system, the (+) terminal of the coil goes to the points and condenser, the (-) goes to the ignition switch. Reverse this connections for a negative ground system. With the switch on and the engine cranking, the points open and close which makes the coil turn on & off. The condenser is just a capacitor around the points (in simplified terms, it boosts the output of the coil). The coil generates a high voltage when the coil is turned off by the points. Turning the coil off makes the electrical field in the coil collapse which is what causes the coil to produce the high voltage. If you do not have an output from the coil, it is because the points are not opening, the points are not closing, the condenser is bad, or the coil itself is bad. I recommend purchasing a new set of points & condenser. This will cost about $8 at your local automotive store or a vendor such as Ncomplete.com. If this does not cure the problem, the coil is defective. My first guess is that the condenser is bad.

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John

09-30-2001 16:44:57




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 1955 Ford 860 will crank but not start. in reply to Patrick M, 09-29-2001 14:36:16  
Patrick,try this.Loosen the nut a little bit which connects the wire from the coil to the distributor.Push the nut into the distributor just a little bit,[1/16 inch],and try cranking the tractor.It's probably helpful if you watch the wire while someone else cranks the tractor. This worked for me on my 820.I was told that the bolt inside the distributor sometimes shorts out the system,so when the nut is tight,it won't start,but when the nut is loose,the tractor starts right up.I'm told that I need to put a nonmetallic washer or shim on the terminal bolt inside the distributor.I haven't yet,but she runs!Sounds weird,I know, but it works.

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