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Tractor Identification

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Vernon Reeves

01-12-2008 15:56:49

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Can anyone help me identify my tractor? It has on the housing Ford 4000. It is a 4 cylinder gasoline model with a select-o-matic transmission and PTO. On the left side of the transmission are several lines stamped. the first line says 312259 F?(can't read ? but looks like letter) and the second line says CWC. The third line is very hard to read but if it helps, I will try to get the information. It is losing compression and I have decided to rebuild but I need to know the model to get the correct specs.
Thanks to anyone who can help!

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Larry NCKS

01-27-2008 11:21:51

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to sotxbill, 01-12-2008 15:56:49

Vernon. all I see on page 2 of "Tractor Photos" is multiple listings of your name but no pictures that I can open. If indeed you have what you say you have someone at some point has put a replacement transmission in your tractor and restamped the tractor serial and model numbers on it.
I'd be curious to know if you actually have a red transmission or if someone has rebulit a blue one in a red case. I don't even know if the latter is possible.

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Larry NCKS

01-26-2008 09:26:57

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to Wayne in Iowa, 01-12-2008 15:56:49

Yep, Jim, but if you look at Vernon's previous post, he has a transmission casting number of 312259. That casting number was not used in '63 - '64 or later tractors. As I've said previously, I have SN 8370 - 41205 which already has the updated (blue) SOS from the factory. It's casting number is CONN 7006 B. No . . . and I repeat, no 312259 transmissions came from the factory in '63 to '64 model 41205 tractors.

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Larry NCKS

01-24-2008 12:44:30

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to john_bud, 01-12-2008 15:56:49

I don't see pictures either. It might help, if they actually did get posted, if we knew exactly what you titled them.

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Larry NCKS

01-15-2008 05:22:51

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Re: Where are you getting the Model 205 from? in reply to RICKWI, 01-12-2008 15:56:49

ok this is probably crazy since you're insistent that you know what you have, but I'll take one more stab at it.
The Ford service manual for those tractors is SE-8175, readily available on ebay, no matter whether they're 55 models or 64 models.

Secondly the 312259 transmission was only factory equipment in 1959-1962 01 series and in early thousand indsutrials. A 63 - 64 transmission bears the number CONN 7006 B or C3NN 7006 B in gthe same location yours has the 312259 cast into it. It is possible that someone replaced the later transmission with the earlier one, but that would be a giant step backwards. To come up with your quoted SN and remnant of a model number someone would have had to grind the original numbers off and restamp the numbers off the original transmission.
if your SN is complete, at least part of your model number is missing. The only other number that means anything to me in all you've posted is the 312259.

The model # on a 4000 is a 5 digit number and on a 63 or 64, as I've stated previously it would start with 41 followed by a 1 (row crop), 2 (ag all purpose w/adjustable front axle) 3 (light industrial w fixed axle) or 4 (heavy industrial w/fixed axle) then the 05 for SOS w/540 PTO, but not from the factory on a 312259 transmission!!!!

What I guess we need is a photo. There are date codes on the top of the radiator and on the rear axle trumpets that will help you identify when those components were built.

I will guarantee you, that if you go to get transmission parts and portray this as a 63-64, you'll get some wrong parts.

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Vernon Reeves

01-15-2008 17:19:48

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Re: Where are you getting the Model 205 from? in reply to Larry NCKS, 01-15-2008 05:22:51

OK, I think that I best send some pictures.I guess I just copy them into my response. Will take a couple of days.
In any case, thanks for continuing to try to figure out what it is.

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Larry NCKS

01-14-2008 06:07:10

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Re: Where are you getting the Model 205 from? in reply to Larry NCKS, 01-12-2008 15:56:49

I've been trying to comprehend all of what's been said in this entire thread and put it together with what I know for certain.

1. a 312259 (red, ORC) transmission does not need a supplement manual!

2. I own a 41205 (63-64 4000 with SOS) SN # 8370 built in late '62 but billed as a '63 model. It came from the factory with a CONN 7006-B (blue, DDC) transmission installed. Therefore your serial number 16929 does not jive with a 312259 transmission.
Conclusions I draw are these:

1. You are missing a 1 in the SN. It should read 116929

2. You are missing part of the model number. Since I don't know that any 4000s were built as ag all purpose tractors prior to the '63 models, I'm going to assume that your model number is missing a 40 and you have interpretted a 3 as a 2, making your model # 40305.

3. given the above assumptions are true, you have a light industrial 4000 built in mid 1960.

4. As has been said, all 172 engines are basically identical except for some very early ones that had the samll intake and carb.

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Larry NCKS

01-13-2008 15:40:00

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to old, 01-12-2008 15:56:49

John,

Like to know your basis for that assumption. The transmission casting number he has given is from the 59-62 era. He has a four cylinder engine. 65-68 era 4000s had 3 cylinder engines. 64 4000s were not the same tractor as 68s were. 64 4000s had the 4 cylinder 172 ci engines. The casting number on the transmission itself, 312259, was not used in even the earliest of the 4000s, let alone the later ones.

With all due respect, I think your analysis of the original post is far from accurate. Some has badged or painted his tractor incorrectly!!!

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Vernon Reeves

01-13-2008 19:16:28

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to Larry NCKS, 01-13-2008 15:40:00

Seems to be a 1963-64 Ford Series but I have not yet found the model number from which I should be able to identify a correct service manual.

Thanks for your help!

Vern

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John Fisher

01-13-2008 14:42:43

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to Vernon Reeves, 01-12-2008 15:56:49

It sounds as though you have a Ford 4000 X series made between about 1964 and 1968. The select-o-speed was a disaster in New Zealand as most farmers put on oversized tyres which overloaded this transmission system. The motors were sound though. To run a check on the motor the inlet manifold usually had the FoMoCo letters on it which indicated the motor was in fact made by Ford. There should be identification on the side of the engine block too in the form of letters and numbers which most engine rebuilders would be able to identify the motor by for the purpose of ordering parts.

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Vernon Reeves

01-13-2008 19:19:19

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to John Fisher, 01-13-2008 14:42:43

Thanks for your help! It appears to be a 1963-64 Ford 400 series but the model # of 205 doesn't ring any bells.

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Larry NCKS

01-13-2008 07:02:24

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to john in la, 01-12-2008 15:56:49

Good synopsis. Betting this is either an 801 or a 901. Surely nobody would have replaced a blue transmission with a red one which is indeed what the 312259 casting number indiciates.
BTW Vernon, its proper name is Select-O-Speed.

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NWMO 901 SOS

01-12-2008 21:05:53

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to Vernon Reeves, 01-12-2008 15:56:49

Vernon,

The numbers you've given are "cast" into the transmission housing. The model # will be stamped above/behind the starter. Follow awhtx's link. Since your tractor is gas, it should still be there, may require a wire brush and bright light.

Based on the casting #'s, I believe you have the earlier transmission with the the overriding clutch. I will let Larry NCKS and others educate both of us. I would have speculated, that the change to the direct drive clutch would have taken place before the 4000's were built (1962-1964). You may have a 901 with a 4000 hood, or possibly an early 4000? Model # will clarify if transmission is original.

Chris

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Vernon Reeves

01-13-2008 19:23:36

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to NWMO 901 SOS, 01-12-2008 21:05:53

Thanks so much for your help!! the model # is 205 and the serial number is 16929 (appears to indicate a 1963-64 Ford 4000) but the model # is ????. No such digits appear on the web site you sent me to.

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awhtx

01-12-2008 16:22:23

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to Vernon Reeves, 01-12-2008 15:56:49

Try this link.

Ford ID

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Vernon Reeves

01-13-2008 19:09:45

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Re: Tractor Identification in reply to awhtx, 01-12-2008 16:22:23

Thanks so much for the link! I found my tractor to be a 1963-64 Ford series. My only problem is that the data I found (Model # 205) still confuses me. the model number digits are a code and, at the link address,the meaning of these digits was not defined Fortunately the serial # indicates a 1963-64 ford 4000. Unforetunately, I need the model # codes to get the appropriate service manual.I will probably send him an email and ask for further information. Thanks again for furthering my search.

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awhtx

01-13-2008 22:35:13

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Where are you getting the Model 205 from? in reply to Vernon Reeves, 01-13-2008 19:09:45

Is "205" stamped into your transmission just above the serial number? I believe the Service Manual is the same for all of the 4 cylinder Fords built from 1955-1964. You may need a supplement for your SOS.

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Vernon Reeves

01-14-2008 10:25:54

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Re: Where are you getting the Model 205 from? in reply to awhtx, 01-13-2008 22:35:13

Sir, See the answer to your question re the model 205 below. Below is all the stampings & markings I could find

The following markings are on my tractor. The tractor housing says Ford 4000.It is a Select-o-Speed with clutch pedal. It has a PTO and a three point hitch and runs on a 4 cylinder gasoline engine. It is painted blue but there seems to be an orange coat below the blue. It appears to be a 1963-64 Ford 4000 Series from its stampings (see Stampings 1 below). I am very interested in rebuilding the engine as it has lost compression. Markings/Stamping are as follows: (1) Left side right behind starter motor on top of flat surface are two rows. Top row is 205, bottom, between two diamonds is 16929; (2) directly below the oil dip stick and coil, about 2 inches above the pan-block join is CONN 6015J; (3) left side stamped on transmission is three rows. Top row is 3 or 8 followed by 12259 FZ, next row is CWC or GWG, bottom row is K180 or KJ80; (4) Left side below generator and about 3 inches above pan-block is 3A15; and (5) On muffler is 310079.
I need to identify the model so I can get the correct service manual.

Does this help?
Vernon Reeves
vreeves@juno.com

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