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Can cast iron axle be welded?

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Hans

05-05-2003 22:29:21




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I have a Bolens HT-23 that drips from the rear axle because of a groove that was worn into it by a improperly connected PTO shaft for a rototiller. The tractor is in great shape besides the slow drip. I've called around, but none of the welding shops around here will mess with Cast Iron. Is Cast Iron even weldable?

I use the tractor everyday, so obviously, it's not that much of a problem, but I'd still like to have it fixed to where there is no drip at all. The epoxies like JB Weld are not working. The oil eventually seeps through even after draining the rear end, throughly cleaning the surfaces, and letting it dry.

Although it's not causing me much grief, it's one of those things that sits in the back of my mind and just bugs me. Is it possible to weld this?

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Chester

05-07-2003 16:23:27




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 Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Hans, 05-05-2003 22:29:21  
Look at SPEEDY SEAL at www.lidering.es/catal/spsi.htm There is also something similar called a SEAL SAVER, but couldn't any info.



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deano rookie mechanic

05-07-2003 19:48:15




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 Re: Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Chester , 05-07-2003 16:23:27  
I am not the most competent welder but i welded with ni rod today a nub on a carrier yoke for ih 240 i preheated and turned out great...i was wondering if you heard of superweld..... ....i have had better luck with that epoxy...but i can't remember who carries it./



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david stearns

05-06-2003 17:51:35




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 Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Hans, 05-05-2003 22:29:21  
You can weld the axle with ni-rod , dc reverse polarity on the welder. (nickel rod) You make short welds and pean the weld as it cools to relieve the stress. then make another 1/2 inch weld and pean.The part does have to be clean and upright. ni-rod is not fond of being used overhead or up or down hill. Greys Marine makes an epoxy that is used on cracked engine blocks all the time up here. It is a 4 to 1 mix, white in color. I put a honda in my friends bolens a coulple of years ago and if I remember the axle housing unbolts. Shouldn't be hard to take off.

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Ollie

05-06-2003 09:04:12




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 Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Hans, 05-05-2003 22:29:21  
"Bob" is obviously a welder and gave you the correct answer. I can only add that in spite of doing everything correctly, cast iron will sometimes still warp. Long thin castings are more likely to warp than something "blocky" in shape. This is the reason your local guys won't touch it.

You'll be money and grief ahead if you find another way to fix it, or possibly replace it. The fact that JB Weld is failing in spite of your apparent correct application tells me that the part is under some stress. There are industrial adhesives/fillers, more flexible than JB Weld, that may work. Look up "industrial supply" in a big city phone book. They may be able to steer you to a product that will work in that application.

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Bob

05-06-2003 09:03:21




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 Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Hans, 05-05-2003 22:29:21  
The problem you're having with the JB Weld is that cast iron is porous, and your casting has absorbed oil over time, and even if you clean the surface, the epoxy is still affected by the oil seeping to the surface of the cast iron, affecting the bond of the epoxy. I know exactly what you are talking about, as I own a Bolens with the same injury that was welded up before I got it. It seeps through the nickel rod weld.

If you were to completely dismantle the rear and, and bake it for a number of hours to burn all the oil out of the cast iron, it could be sccessfully brazed or welded with cast iron or nickel rod while still hot, and then allowed to cool down slowly to prevent stress cracking. The old blacksmith in our area used to bury welded cast pieces in hot ashes from a wood fire, and allow them to slowly cool along with the hot ashes. Another way is to wrap the just-welded piece in glass wool insulation to prevent fast cooldown.

How to bake the casting? Some use an old kitchen oven (Hopefully not the Wife's!) to heat the casting to 400-500 degrees for several hours. Some up-to-date automotive machine shops use an industrial oven to burn the crud off of engine blocks before rebuilding. Perhaps there is one in your area.

Arc welding the casting takes a certain amount of experience, although it is not that hard to do. However, with a one-of-a-kind part such as this, it might be a poor choice of a part to experiment on!

The alternative would be to bake the part clean of oil, clean and roughen up the area around the damage with coarse emery cloth, and then epoxy it, possibly putting a metal patch over the damaged area. If done in this manner, I doubt you would ever again have trouble with a leak through the epoxy, and, in fact, this may be the best fix.

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Steve from MO - a sleeve?

05-06-2003 08:18:20




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 Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Hans, 05-05-2003 22:29:21  
Sounds like you might have another option. Unless the axle diameter is critical for strength, you can have that shaft machined smooth and a steel sleeve put on over the former location of the groove. The outside diameter of the sleeve would match the inside diameter of the seal. A good machine shop should know how to do this.



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CJ

05-06-2003 07:41:06




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 Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Hans, 05-05-2003 22:29:21  
Cast can be welded using nickle rod. I have had the front axel of one tractor welded at a high stress point and it worked out fine. The guy that did it for me used a torch to pre-heat the casting and when he was done just let it air cool - no water quenching etc. Brazing is also another alternative - I have brazed up cast before and it works pretty well.

CJ



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bob

05-06-2003 06:28:03




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 Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Hans, 05-05-2003 22:29:21  
They probably would do it if you brought them the bare casting, completely disassembled of all gears, seals, etc. In order to weld cast iron correctly it needs to be preheated, welded, and then cooled vverrrryyy slowly, over a matter of hours, in order to alleviate any stress which was caused by the welding. Brazing would likely work also to seal up the leak, but I'd want to disassemble the unit before doing that as well.

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Glenn(WV)

05-06-2003 05:21:38




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 Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Hans, 05-05-2003 22:29:21  
Have been told that cast iron can indeed be welded, but it takes a special welding rod and a guy who knows what he is doing, cast iron not being as easy to weld as steel. I have not done it myself.



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dhermesc

05-06-2003 06:02:05




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 Re: Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Glenn(WV), 05-06-2003 05:21:38  
I am surprised the local shops don't want to deal with it. A competent welder should be able to do this with no problem. If you are not familiar with the process, I would not attempt to this yourself.



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Lou

05-06-2003 01:06:43




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 Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Hans, 05-05-2003 22:29:21  
You might be able to braze it.



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Jeff Rehm

05-06-2003 08:32:07




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 Re: Re: Can cast iron axle be welded? in reply to Lou, 05-06-2003 01:06:43  
You can weld cast iron, but preheating and proper cooling are essential. The piece should be heated to 500-1200 degrees F prior to welding. If you don't have a forge or some other fairly modern method of preheating, you can preheat in a wood or coal stove, or even a charcoal grill if you get it hot enough.

Lacking these, you can also weld it without preheating if you weld about a half inch, wait till it cools to the touch, and weld another half inch.

In any case, use a sand or lime box, or some other method to keep drafts away from the piece and retain the heat so it will cool slowly.

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