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Garden Tractors Discussion Forum

14 hp 321 fighting itself

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Steve

12-23-2003 10:20:49




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Have a case 444 when i go to full throttle the motor pulls down and stalls like its under load. if i pull the throttle back to idle then it keeps running.i rebuilt the carb, set the points, checked the valve gap can anyone help. Ive been working on engines for years and never ran into this before THANKS




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Rick O

01-16-2004 20:06:20




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 Re: 14 hp 321 fighting itself in reply to Steve, 12-23-2003 10:20:49  
Steve, What is the status of your problem?



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DaveJWI

12-25-2003 09:00:59




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 Re: 14 hp 321 fighting itself in reply to Steve, 12-23-2003 10:20:49  
I had a cousin with a Case field tractor that idled and ran fine but didn't make the kind of power and rpm's we thought it should. One day he was out in the field working it hard and the muffler blew right off like a rocket. All of a sudden the rpm's and power came up. Kind of like the old potato in the tailpipe gag. Too much backpressure. I had a Mazda car that would idle and quit when you gave it gas; had a plugged fuel filter.

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Floyd C Hurd

12-24-2003 17:06:03




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 Re: 14 hp 321 fighting itself in reply to Steve, 12-23-2003 10:20:49  
I am an older geek and have worked on about everything in my life. I have worked professionally on mostly autos for almost 30 years. I have seen some really simple things screw a rig up. For instance,a few years ago I had a weed whacker that had sat around a while.One day I wanted to use it,it started,but when I gave it throtle it would not rev up,but idled fine. After taking it all apart with no luck, I just noticed that a mud wasp had pluged up the exaust!I have seen a few autos do this trick with a pluged up catallist converter. I would go with the pluged up exaust first,if that is open,then fuel problems.

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Art

12-24-2003 14:58:08




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 Re: 14 hp 321 fighting itself in reply to Steve, 12-23-2003 10:20:49  
You may want to trouble shoot the fuel line and fuel pump too.

I do this using an old clean plastic fuel tank from one of my junkers. Run a separate fuel line from the plastic tank directly to the carb. making sure to keep the tank higher than the carb.

Put a little gas in and test to see if your problem persists.

If it runs good--you got fuel line or fuel pump problems. Good luck!



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KenF

12-24-2003 09:29:24




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 Re: 14 hp 321 fighting itself in reply to Steve, 12-23-2003 10:20:49  
I notice you rebuilt the carb but if there is rust, sand or other debris in the fuel system it might still have gotten into the carb float bowl.

The fix is so sinple it's worth a try. Just take off the air filter and with the engine running take a cloth in a ball (actually, with this small an engine you can use your bare hand), raise the revs as far as you can and then "choke" the carb (fully cover the inlet) till the engine almost dies. Let the revs pick up again and do this again several times. Then see if it will rev up any better.

The debris sits at the bottom of the float chamber, but as the fuel flow increases (higher revs) it is sucked up and blocks the main jet. This causes the engine to die back. When the engine revs drop, the debris drops back to the bottom and the engine runs normally again. Since this debris is usually so small the above procedure will suck it thru' the main jet. Often, if there is not too much debris in your tank, repeating this procedure a couple of times will clear it. If it's more severe you will have to clean out the system.

It's bit a silly and it's probably not your problem. But it's so easy to check that's it's always worth a try.

Let us know what you find.

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jim

12-24-2003 07:14:42




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 Re: 14 hp 321 fighting itself in reply to Steve, 12-23-2003 10:20:49  
Even though you have checked the points, on a Kohler engine, I have seen the point gap set anywhere from .018 to .022. You need to check your timing on a Kohler engine, it sounds as though it is out of time to me, find the little hole on the blower housing, then the mark of flywheel, set the timing so the mark is in the middle of the little window. If that does not appear to be the problem, also check to make sure your plug is an H10C plug with a gap of .025. If this all appears to be right, make sure your points and condensor are hooked up on the neg side of coil. If this still does not solve the problem , then replace the coil, had a Wheel Horse doing this once and after checking everything, it had a bad coil.

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Jim

12-24-2003 05:52:21




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 Re: 14 hp 321 fighting itself in reply to Steve, 12-23-2003 10:20:49  
On Case tractors, there is a small filter in the bottom of the gas tank that get plugged off with rust, debris, etc. and blocks the flow to the fuel pump.
Remove the fenders, rear panel and loosen up the straps that hold the tank in place. Remove the hose, unthread the ell fitting and remove the screen. Put an in-line filter near the fuel pump.
This has been a rear problem with Case tractors, especially ones with the steel gas tank.

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Dale

12-23-2003 20:22:14




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 Re: 14 hp 321 fighting itself in reply to Steve, 12-23-2003 10:20:49  
If it does it cold change points & cond. if it gets worse the hotter it is and acts like its locking up when you give it the gas and when you bring it back down to a idle it runs good then your head gasket is blown.



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Rick O

12-23-2003 13:26:16




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 Re: 14 hp 321 fighting itself in reply to Steve, 12-23-2003 10:20:49  
I'm not sure but I seem to remember that a Case 444 has a hydro transmission. If so your problem may not be with the engine. The transmission oil pressure relief valve may be stuck or your transmission oil filter may be plugged. At low RPM's the trans does not build up much pressure. At higher RPM's the pressure is at normal operating range - if the filter is plugged or the relief valve is stuck it can drag the engine right down.

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Chuck

12-23-2003 13:02:19




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 Re: 14 hp 321 fighting itself in reply to Steve, 12-23-2003 10:20:49  
Check your oil level.Is it over full,or smell like gas?Is your muffler plugged?Are you getting enough gas to the carb?Just a few things to check.



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KennyW

12-23-2003 17:20:07




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 Re: Re: 14 hp 321 fighting itself in reply to Chuck, 12-23-2003 13:02:19  
Like Chuck said, check the muffler for cloggs, Take it off and see if it will throttle up without it.
I've also seen that problem occur when a condensor is hooked up to the wrong side(+) of the coil, good at low throttle, spits and coughs when throttling up.
Kenny



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