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rotary rake purchase

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7812

12-13-2007 10:32:09




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Once again the rotary rake vs. wheel rake question. I'm going to buy a new rake in January. Help me decide between a V rake with 2 center kicker wheels and a rotary with 1 bigger rotor. I need you hay guy's opinions!!!!!




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Nathaniel Watts

12-16-2007 14:53:24




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
We use a dual windrow Fella rotary and a single too. There is no way you can make a better windrow at 10mph than these machines make. Both machines have been over 500+- acres a year for 5 years. I have replaced only a handful of tines. Hows that for cheap operation?



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randy hall

12-16-2007 12:47:08




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
i bought a new kuhn rotary rake two years ago. it makes very fluffy windows and it dosen't rake up all the little stones and gravel like the wheel rakes do.



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7812

12-15-2007 19:49:28




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  

Thanks Cliff, I sent you an e-mail to get your phone number this week to pick your brain on these rakes. Maybe you didn't get it. If you want to e-mail me your # , I have a couple questions for you.



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7812

12-15-2007 18:35:00




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
Thanks all you guys for your input. Jd Tom I have raked enough hay in 15-20 mph winds with my wheel Vrake to make me puke. One more question. I'm looking at Miller Pro as an option 1150 or 1350 model. Any comments on them????? Also, do you make 1 full round to get 1 windrow or in heavier hay is one pass enough. I'm very interested in how you guys with rotarys manage that. Please respond....

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RodInNS

12-16-2007 09:27:36




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-15-2007 18:35:00  
In light hay I will sometimes double the rows up, but even light hay 'here' is a lot for the baler when the rake is pulling 14 feet. 25-28 feet is just too much unless it's just a light crop of second cut...
I only double the rows if there's a time saving for the baler. There's no point in building a huge double row that fills a baler in 200 feet and I have to drive at 1/3 the speed to make the baler swallow it.
You can also rake 1/2 rows or whatever you like. The rake doesn't care.

Rod

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Cliff Neubauer

12-15-2007 18:50:13




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-15-2007 18:35:00  
I think the Miller rakes look pretty good but I'm pretty sure they've quite making hay equipment to focus on their self propelled sprayers so who knows what kind of support they will have in the future. In heavy hay with our rotary rake we make one round to throw two windrows from a 13' conditioner together and in lighter hay we will add more as needed. Our 4120 works great for throwing two 13' windrows together in two passes but to merge 3 or more windrows requires an extra pass to throw them all together. The rotary rakes rake so clean you don't have to follow the windrows when raking and you can even rake half a windrow if you want.

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flying belgian

12-15-2007 15:32:47




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
Neighbor tried raking wheat straw behind my combine with a wheel rake. I had left about a 10" stubble. It would not work at all.



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jd-tom

12-15-2007 07:29:49




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
I guess none of you guys have ever tried to rake hay with a wheel rake when the wind is blowing 15-20 mph - what a mess! I've owned 2 wheel rakes in the past - a 9-wheel inline pull-type rake and a 4-wheel 3-point hitch model (which I still have.) I traded the inline rake in on a Kuhn 4120 rotary rake. I wish I had done that a long time ago! Makes loose windrows that dry faster but the wind doesn't seem to bother them (unless it is blowing 40 mph). Yes, its slower but I end up with better results. The wheel rake has its place, say, in a ditch where you need something that can hug the uneven ground better. But the 3-point model I have will also bunch the hay if its really heavy (gets caught under the frame). I also have a bar rake around but very seldom use it - it ropes the hay too much. It really depends on what type of hay you grow, what part of the country you live it and how much you can afford to spend on a rake ($150 +/- per ton hay helps out a lot on that!)

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Lee in Iowa

12-14-2007 19:40:17




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
As far as drying time goes with the wheel rake, it's gentle enough and fast enough I usually leave it dry in the mower swath until the morning of the day I'm going to bale it, so I wouldn't think the drynig time would be any longer with a wheel rake than a rotary. Lee



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Buttsbrooke

12-13-2007 23:24:04




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
You need to look at the cost, maintainance and efficiency of the machine. Wheel rakes can be purchased new for a quarter of the price of a rotory rake and maintained at a fraction of what the cost of pinion gears, PTO shaft and bearings cost on the rotory rake. Both do the job needed. I have both. Prefer the wheel rake for ease of operation and timelyness, doesnt leave a windrow as nice and clean as the rotory does though. I do a lot of small feilds and side hill work, the rotory rake has a tendancy to slide or list to the down hill side and leaves the outside windrows a mess to bale. The wheel rake is lighter and stays straighter on the hill sides and can be picked up at the end of the windrows. A rough feild is no good for a wheel rake, it will skip sections when bouncing. The rotory rake cleans up better on rough ground. If time is a factor the wheel rake is hands down the fastest for making a windrow, just not the cleanest. The Rotory rake does allow for a shorter dry time and makes a nice, clean windrow for baling. All depends on $$ and type of feilds your working.

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hayray

12-13-2007 17:05:35




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
A V-rake, hands down. If you want to spend a lot of money, rake real slow, beat the hell out of the hay and knock the leaves off of it, and limited to only using a tractor to pull the rake, then buy a rotary rake. If you want the opposite of everything else I just wrote, then buy a V-rake. Have had one for 13 years and never did a bit of work on it baling over 300 acres of hay per year with it.

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Cliff Neubauer

12-13-2007 17:59:01




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to hayray, 12-13-2007 17:05:35  
In dry alfalfa I'll put our rotary rake up against any other rake anyday. In dry alfalfa you need to slow the pto down some but I haven't seen any other rake work as well over a variety of conditions as our rotary will. I've ran up to 9 mph in alfalfa with our rotary rake, it might not be as fast as a V rake but with $200/ton alfalfa it's worth taking a little extra time to get it right.



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Lee in Iowa

12-13-2007 14:54:25




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
I only used a rotary rake a little bit (rental) it worked ok but it took a small swath and I thought the the hay needed to be a little damp so you didn't knock leaves off. I've had a ten wheel v wheel rake for about ten years and like it. It takes a big swath and you can rake when its fairly dry without knocking leaves off alfalfa. It can also be used to rake cornstalks for baling, and the first costs and maintenance have been low. Lee

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mss3020

12-13-2007 14:50:03




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
One I can answer!!! I have a 9 foot J.D. side delivery rake. I used it for years. did a nice clean job. TOOK FOREVER though. I bought a V rake. One of the cheeper ones. 10 wheel. I can rake in 1/4 the time it took with the side rake. BUT...the v rake rakes dirty. I mean the hay is dirtier than it was with the side rakte. The V rake needs the drive by the ground.

But mine does a real nice job and wouldnt go back to the side unless break down.

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7812

12-13-2007 14:41:39




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
rod i'm looking at a Kuhn 4120 for $6200. good price? I don't know. One concern I have with rotarys is gear boxes, pto shafts etc. Compared to a wheel rake there seems like there would be more maintenace. Any thoughts? Do you think the hay would dry any faster with a rotary vs. wheel? Kinda torn between the 2 rakes.



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RodInNS

12-13-2007 19:26:28




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 14:41:39  
I can't remember the Kuhn model numbers. I think we paid somewhat more than that a few years ago, but we're talking Cad dollars, and at that time they were 60 cent dollars.... so your price sounds OK to me. I don't remember the exact figure we paid.
In 3 seasons use we've had zero issues with this rake. We only cover about 200 acres a year with it, but I expect it to last a long time. I just grease it and go.
There's a few things to bugger with to get it leveled on your tractor, and I found that it dragged a lot of dirt and crap into the rows until I got it leveled out properly... but I don't think it's picking up too much stuff now.
Anyone that thinks it's slow needs an awful big reality check. I'm running this one on a 3930 Ford (45 HP) and it travels in sixth gear, wide open at speeds up to 10 mph. The only limiting factor is power on our hills. It's not uncommon to cover 8 acres an hour. This rake is on walking beams so it takes the rough ground pretty well.
The biggest downside I've found is the sheer weight of the rake. I think it's a solid 3/4 tonne, well out behind.... and it's all that little tractor can lift. Kuhn builds a commercial grade machine which is a good deal more than can be said for some of the others on the market, and generally anything built 'here'. The only exceptions to that rule are the machines that NH and Deere import out of Kuhn's factory.
Claas would be in the same league as Kuhn in my opinion.

As far as drying time.... I don't know. I'd suspect that it may dry a bit quicker behind the rotary for the simple reason that the hay is thrown and placed in the row rather than rolled into a knot, but I could be wrong. We used a NH 254 tedder rake for 20 years now so I hardly remember what the drying time was on the hay when we used the old wheel rake....

I think a person should stand back and ask themselves why they see so many rotary rakes in Europe to the almost absolute exclusion of all others. Their economic conditions are probably a good deal tougher than here... so one has to wonder how they could afford to 'waste' a pile of money on a 'slow' rotary rake.

The answer is simple in my mind. The rotary is cheaper to run and does a better job.

Rod

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Cliff Neubauer

12-13-2007 16:29:22




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 14:41:39  
We've got a Kuhn GA4120 we ran over 700 acres this year and we will be buying a second one for next year. A local dealer has a year old 4120 that he quoted me $6,250 for so your price sounds good. So far we've had zero repairs on our Kuhn and it's built heavy enough I don't see that being a problem like it was on the older rakes. We quit using wheel rakes several years ago but our rotary rake will dry hay half a day sooner than our bar rakes on average but it can save a couple days under the right weather conditions. The rotary rake will put alot more hay in the windrow than a wheel rake will and they make a windrow thats alot nicer to bale as well.

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RodInNS

12-13-2007 14:00:11




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
I've never used v-rake. I have used the older side delivery wheel rakes. I spose they're better than a pitch fork, but not much. We were lucky we didn't find more teeth in tires than we did...

I'll stick to the rotaries, thankyou. Have a Kuhn 14' model right now that work fast, clean and easy. I like it. I would also look at Claas although I'm not sure I'd bother with any of the others...

Rod

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hayray

12-13-2007 17:12:41




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to RodInNS, 12-13-2007 14:00:11  
You are talking about those piece of junk rakes with the spring coil teeth bolted to the outside edge of the wheel, those suck. The newer v-rakes with the spring teeth going all the way to the hub center don't loose teeth and rake real clean. I had a couple of the ones you are describing, one a Deere and the other a New Idea and you can't even rake hay with those pieces of junk.



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RodInNS

12-13-2007 18:53:20




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to hayray, 12-13-2007 17:12:41  
No, this was a Massey. Mid to late 60's vintage. The tines went to the very center of the wheel. We baled a lot of them.
The newer rakes may have a heavier tine, but hell will still freeze over before I have another one.

Rod



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7812

12-13-2007 13:49:33




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
The v rake I have doesn't rake as clean as i like and I know that rotary rakes do a better job that way. Any comments about hay drying out faster with a rotary?



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rrlund

12-13-2007 12:30:17




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 Re: rotary rake purchase in reply to 7812, 12-13-2007 10:32:09  
I've got the wheel rake and a small rotary. (10 foot) I prefer the wheel rake hands down going away for everyday raking. Takes a lot wider swath,does just as clean of a job. Only downfall,and the only thing I use the rotary for anymore,is turning windrows if they get rained on. The V rake won't work for that at all. it just bunches.



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