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Job Im dreading

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John T

07-17-2003 16:01:54




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I have a job probably tommorow Im really dreading grrrrr rrrrr rrrrr . I was rakign hay and the front wheel spindle off my 620 Gas Tricycle Tractor broke off. There remains 2 good 3/4 " threaded bolt holes on one side of the round mounting plate and 2 broken off bolts about flush which I wont be able to weld a nut on I dont think for extraction. Being overhead will complicate things for sure. I likely will have to drill them out startign with small then up to larger bits and try to hammer/wedge a big torx bit up inside them (I hate EZ outs but may try one) and see if I can extract them. My question is one of those I already probably know the answer but wanna ask it anyhow. My buddy Ben already warned me against this so Im probably NOT gonan try it lol. I recently put new pins and O rings and wiper seals in the PS unit so I sure dotn want to ruin any of that hard work.

My question is, if I tried to heat/melt/slobber/drip n run/cut out those broken off bolts out of their holes usign my torch, is there a possibility I may overheat and ruin some of those lower o ring seals????? ?????

Can anyone stop by tomorrow and help me????

Ol John T

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Scruffy

07-18-2003 06:16:13




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 Re: Job Im dreading in reply to John T, 07-17-2003 16:01:54  
Hey John, I'd come help if I was near you. I'm in Iowa. What state do you call home?

Later,
Scruffy



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John T

07-18-2003 06:51:29




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 Re: Re: Job Im dreading in reply to Scruffy, 07-18-2003 06:16:13  
Im in Bloomington (South Central) Indiana, come on downnnnn nnnnn nnnn. Im headed for the shop in a few minutes. John T



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Scruffy

07-18-2003 12:23:36




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 Re: Re: Re: Job Im dreading in reply to John T, 07-18-2003 06:51:29  
By the time I got there you'd hopefully have them out. Let us know how it goes.

I was lucky earlier this year. I jacked up the front of my 70 to put on new rubber and the front pedistal just swung in the wind. One bolt was just screwed in three or four theads, the other just a little farther. The other two bolts were missing!!! How it didn't break off can only be explained by devine intervention.

As lucky as I was that day I should of bought a lottery ticket. I probably would have won the big one!

Later,
Scruffy

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davidval

07-18-2003 00:10:48




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 Re: Job Im dreading in reply to John T, 07-17-2003 16:01:54  
like don posted, go from easy to tough. start unscrewing with a center punch,it may work since the bolts were removed and installed recently (if they were not locktited). if that doesn't work then try the left hand drill, then the bolt extractor, then welding a nut ....
david



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BB

07-17-2003 23:22:30




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 Re: Job Im dreading in reply to John T, 07-17-2003 16:01:54  
They will probably come right out with your screw extractor. They were broken off from stress and use, Not from being hopelessly rusted in and twisted off with a wrench.

Some people have this idea if they twist off a rusty bolt that a screw extractor will magicaly remove that same bolt that was rusted in so tight it twisted off. Screw extractors are for your bolt which his not rusted in.



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Hotwrench

07-17-2003 23:02:43




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 Re: Job Im dreading in reply to John T, 07-17-2003 16:01:54  
John take it from one who has been there many times the Torch in your bolt problem is the very last resort, Because once you apply heat to a good quality bolt, like a grade 8, It will harden so that you can not drill, you can only grind or Torch. Ez outs are next to worthless as they expand the bolt making removal tuff.
My first choice would be a Stud extractor made by the Rigid tool Company. Also sold buy the Snap On tool truck. These extractors are driven into a drilled hole in the broken bolt, It is sort of like driving a nut onto square head of a tap except the extractor is 6 fluted instead of only 4, then a small hex is slid onto the extractor and the proper wrench is used to turn out the bolt. I think it would be worth your time to hunt up a set of those extractors, Look in the Phone book for supply house that sells Rigid tools. Next best method is welding with the washer and nut be sure to use the washer it makes it easier and lets you use a little larger nut, good luck, like some else said careful of the eyes

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Hotwrench

07-17-2003 23:12:38




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 Re: Re: Job Im dreading in reply to Hotwrench, 07-17-2003 23:02:43  
John the Rigid stud extractors do not expand the bolt I forgot to mention that



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Dave Wis

07-18-2003 19:47:33




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 Re: Re: Re: Job Im dreading in reply to Hotwrench, 07-17-2003 23:12:38  
Another good kind of extractor is Roddick (I'm not sure if that is the correct spelling) also sold by snap-on among others. They have a short fine spiral with a shoulder to keep it from going in too far and spreading the bolt/stud. Also they have a reduced size shank so if they do break off there is a stub you can get a hold of to remove it. As stated by others, any extractor works only on bolts/studs not broke off because of rust, cross threading etc. Good luck

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Clooney

07-17-2003 18:08:12




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 Re: Job Im dreading in reply to John T, 07-17-2003 16:01:54  
John, what ever else you do, DON'T try to hammer a torx driver into a drilled hole in that bolt. That will expand the bolt & your chances of getting it out then will be slim.
~Don't use a torch & try to burn them out either, there is a rubber "O" ring just above that bottom bearing & a cork seal just above the flange. I don't have to tell you what will happen if you heat it.
~The welding a washer on then a nut will work but that won't be easy overhead & if it doesn't work makes it more difficult to drill the bolt out. If done correctly it should get it out though.
~If it were mine I would just drill them out with a L/H drill bit, probably take about 10 minutes a bolt. Then chase the threads with a tap [DON'T DRILL TOO DEEP], use the unbroken bolt holes as a depth guide. Probably the L/H drill bit will catch & spin the broken piece out as those bolts usually don't seize too tight....Good luck & watch you eyes as that overhead work is murder on the eyeballs..

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DON

07-17-2003 17:57:02




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 Re: Job Im dreading in reply to John T, 07-17-2003 16:01:54  
ALL I EVER DID WAS USE A SMALL HAMMER AND A CENTER PUNCH AND TAP THEM SO THEY WILL TURN OUT. THE POST AND BOLTS ARE HARD ENOUGH THAT THEY ALWAYS TURNED OUT FOR ME. I MADE A LIVEING FOR 40 YEARS WORKING ON THESE OLD TRACTORS. THE REASON THEY BROKE WAS THEY CAME LOOSE OR WERE NOT TIGHT ENOUGH IN THE FIRST PLACE, TILE HOLES ASIDE. HOPE THIS HELPS DON



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ChuckW

07-17-2003 17:14:57




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 Re: Job Im dreading in reply to John T, 07-17-2003 16:01:54  
John T. I would do the following. Get some extremely good support and raise the front end up as high as possible. Where the bolts are broke off, I'd get some new nuts and some nickle welding rod. Get the surface clean then center the nuts over the broken studs, weld them good in the center..let cool and they may back out. I would try this before trying to re tape as it is hard to get the right hole size.

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Dave Wis

07-17-2003 17:33:54




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 Re: Re: Job Im dreading in reply to ChuckW, 07-17-2003 17:14:57  
John T. If you go the route of welding a nut onto them, weld a washer on first then a nut to the washer. You can get a much better weld to the broken bolt or stud that way. I have done that hundreds of times over the years and rarely does it not work. Good luck, I don't envy you a bit.



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Lary

07-17-2003 16:40:07




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 Re: Job Im dreading in reply to John T, 07-17-2003 16:01:54  
John T;Have you thought about a left hand drill bit? We have had some luck with them in like situations, with just a little heat.



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Wayne in Pa

07-17-2003 17:18:23




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 Re: Re: Job Im dreading in reply to Lary, 07-17-2003 16:40:07  
The left hand drill bits sound like a good idea.
When your drilling from doddom up try to rest your drill on a hydraulic jack and jack slowly.



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