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Governor (1945 A) Revisited

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1945A

08-20-2004 07:46:07




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I"ve asked this question concerning governor operation, and have checked things suggested. However, the governor on my "45 A still doesn"t seem to want to do anything when load changes.
I"ve had the left side cover off, everything seems to be in place, and moves easily. The spring on the governor arm isn"t broken, linkage to the carburetor is adjusted, but whenever the load on the engine changes, I have to "man the throttle" so that it doesn"t lug too badly, or worse, run away.
Any suggestions as to what the problem is?
Thanks in advance!

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ToddF

08-20-2004 14:14:28




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 Re: Governor (1945 A) Revisited in reply to 1945A, 08-20-2004 07:46:07  
I had a similar problem with a 70 after rebuilding the carb. I don't know if your carb has been rebuilt or cleaned. It turned out that the new throttle shaft bushing/seal was tight enough to cause this same described problem. I put the old bushing back in and it worked flawlessly. It was pretty hard to feel any difference by hand between the new bushing and the old on the throttle shaft. Clooney described how the spring and the governor work against each other, anything (e.g. dirt or friction) that increases the force required to move the throttle shaft delays when either the spring or governor will overpower the other. The same thing is going on inside the governor between the fly weights and the spring, if the weight assembly does not move freely it would cause the same described problem. I have been fortunate in not ever having to take one apart. It may be possible that things are worn such that they feel free at rest but at speed they don't work well, although I suspect you could see evidence of the wear. Well, I've told my story whether it helped or not. Good Luck.

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Mike M

08-20-2004 09:59:59




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 Re: Governor (1945 A) Revisited in reply to 1945A, 08-20-2004 07:46:07  
I wish I had my parts book handy but it is not.
Do you have one ? I would double check that you have the correct gears in your tractor as the later A's had the weights mounted on a different gear than the earlier A's some are on the fan gear others are on the gear that drives off the cam. I don't know but anything is possible something could me mismatched ? I have however seen these tractors with the arms on the weights pushing against the thrust bearing when they are actually to push against the end of the sleeve the bearing mounts on.

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Duane Larson

08-20-2004 08:59:08




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 Re: Governor (1945 A) Revisited in reply to 1945A, 08-20-2004 07:46:07  
1945A,
You might learn something about the governor operation if you remove the key holding the governor rod to the throttle butterfly, start the tractor, lift the governor rod out of the butterfly, and manually control the speed of the engine by hand by rotating the butterfly while holding the governor rod with the other hand. As the engine speed changes you should feel smooth operation of the governor rod. If the governor does not work smoothly you indeed have a governor problem. If it is responsive to changes in engine speed you introduce, then it is probably ok and other things (like the carburetor) may need to be investigated.

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Clooney

08-20-2004 08:56:21




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 Re: Governor (1945 A) Revisited in reply to 1945A, 08-20-2004 07:46:07  
1945A, pull the carb linkage rod loose that carb throttle shaft lever & operate the carb by hand while holding the linkage rod in the other hand.. As you accelerate the engine you should feel the governor SMOOTHLY try to move that rod back toward the idle position.. Then as you slow the engine down it should smoothly allow the rod to be moved the other way..

If that part is ok make sure the linkage from the governor to the carb is FREE & not hanging up on anything. Hold the carb & governor arm in the wide open position & adjust the front rod to be about 1 hole short of entering the carb lever hole.. When re-installing the front carb rod cotter pin make sure the cotter pin isn’t hanging up on the carb casting [a rather common problem]..

If it still acts up look for a problem in the carb like a loose throttle plate or excess throttle plate end wear..

You have a strange problem there as it is acting up in both acceleration & over-run [coast].. Usually a broken or warped governor spring will not allow the engine to speed up correctly under a load but that doesn’t usually effect the return to idle as the governor wants to pull it to idle anyhow.. It sure sounds like a linkage hang up problem or a problem inside the carb..[maybe work the carb & linkage by hand a few times & see if you can feel any hang-ups]..

One last thought--- Make sure the governor top arm & spring are installed facing the correct direction.. If that arm/spring is on backwards you will only have manual throttle control & not very good control at that..

JDClooney@aol.com

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1945 A

08-20-2004 09:11:47




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 Re: Governor (1945 A) Revisited in reply to Clooney, 08-20-2004 08:56:21  
Clooney, my governor/spring is situated so that the governor arm is closest to the carb (front) while the spring is to the rear----is that correct?
Also, when I have the left side cover off of the governor, where should the control arm be in relation to the flyweight assembly?
I"m not exactly clear as to how it should work. It appears to me, that centrifugal force of the flyweights would cause them to move away (toward right side)from the control arm, and if the control arm (fork) isn"t in contact with the weight assembly (mine isn"t, at the moment) the governor would have a hard time controlling speed. Am I missing something here?
Final question (for now, anyway, lol)is, how is the W.O.T. set? Is there a special tool for this,or is engine speed limited "by design" of throttle, governor (if working)?

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Clooney

08-20-2004 11:56:11




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 Re: Governor (1945 A) Revisited in reply to 1945 A, 08-20-2004 09:11:47  
third party image

45A, the governor spring is correct when you pull the hand lever all the way to the rear,, then hold the governor arm in place,, then move the hand throttle to wide open.. If the spring & arm are on correctly the spring will bend when the hand throttle is advanced… Then when you let go of the governor top lever it should snap the carb to wide open [all done with the engine NOT running]..

You ask ..

Quote: “I’m not exactly clear as to how it should work. It appears to me, that centrifugal force of the flyweights would cause them to move away (toward right side)from the control arm, and if the control arm (fork) isn"t in contact with the weight assembly (mine isn"t, at the moment) the governor would have a hard time controlling speed. Am I missing something here?”…..

--I’m not exactly sure what you are saying here so see picture…The governor’s job is to TRY & hold the carb’s throttle plate closed as much as possible.. The spring’s job is to try & open the carb’s throttle plate as far as possible.. When the governor weight pressure balances the spring pressure the throttle stays steady,, as the engine slows down the governor weights lose some of their centrifugal force so loose some push & the spring wins & opens the throttle more… When the engine revs higher the governor weights gain some centrifugal force so gain some push & the governor wins & closes the throttle more.. It’s a simple push & shove match between the governor weights trying to close the throttle & that big flat spring trying to open the throttle.. In a nut shell,, simple as that!

Quote: “how is the W.O.T. set? Is there a special tool for this, or is engine speed limited "by design" of throttle, governor (if working)?”….

---The “W.O.T.” is set by a limit bolt at the hand throttle lever area.. It just limits the distance the hand lever can deflect the governor arm spring.. To tell what the “W.O.T” engine RPM is you need a hand held shaft speed tac to place on the center of the either the crankshaft or the PTO shaft then count the revolutions for one minute..

Any more questions just post back..

JDClooney@aol.com

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1945A

08-20-2004 14:13:53




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 Re: Governor (1945 A) Revisited in reply to Clooney, 08-20-2004 11:56:11  
Thanks, Clooney!
I THINK I understand what you"re trying to tell me, and I"m pretty sure (I"m nowhere close to the tractor at the moment) that my spring/governor arm are on backwards. I"ll look to make sure, but that"s my suspicion. The spring, (which I believe is facing the operator right now won"t let the governor do it"s job).
What you describe as "only having manual control of engine speed" is exactly what I have at the moment, and even trying to "come back" to the same speed each time is a real challenge, at the moment.
I"ll post back when I get it fixed and let you know how it went. Thanks Again!

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