Welcome! Please use the navigational links to explore our website.
PartsASAP LogoCompany Logo Auction Link (800) 853-2651

Shop Now

   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 8N,9N,2N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver

John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum
:

jd 650 won't start

Welcome Guest, Log in or Register
Author 
Jim DeLozier

07-31-2007 20:25:49




Report to Moderator

I have replaced the ignition switch, the front PTO switch, rebuilt the starter and it still will not start with the key switch. You can "jump" the starter from the battery, but then it won't shut down without killing it by popping the clutch. I am at my wits end. Runs great, but can't keep jumping.
I have checked the rear PTO switch and the neutral gear switch and have ground on both. ANY IDEAS????

[Log in to Reply]   [No Email]
Jim DeLozier

08-04-2007 15:00:14




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Jim DeLozier, 07-31-2007 20:25:49  
I want to thank everyone for their support and suggestions. I would like to especially thank Mike M who stuck with me through the stupid questions and helped me get the tractor going!
I have told everyone about this site and they are amazed that people are so helpful (for FREE!)
Again, thanks.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
machinery-man

08-01-2007 09:12:54




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Jim DeLozier, 07-31-2007 20:25:49  
any diesel will run if the pump is not shut down, either through electrical switch or mechanical. I have a 4400 and it has electical solenoid that has to be activated to allow pump to work.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Jim DeLozier

08-01-2007 19:32:05




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to machinery-man, 08-01-2007 09:12:54  
It won't even crank over when you turn the key. I know the battery is good because it will start by shorting the starter across. Still looking.
Thanks



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Mike M

08-01-2007 04:31:47




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Jim DeLozier, 07-31-2007 20:25:49  
I am very confused ? How does popping the clutch,or stalling it out the only way it shuts off ? Those do not have an electric shut off as it is mechanical by pulling back on the throttle lever. Also sounds like you need to free up or adjust your throttle linkage ?



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Jim DeLozier

08-01-2007 19:34:55




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Mike M, 08-01-2007 04:31:47  
Hey Mike, Sure wish I had asked this before I bought a manual for $30 to find that out. I didn't realize that you shut it off by throttling it down. I thought I had tried that and it still didn't work, but maybe I need to adjust the linkage like you said. I will try to look into that.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Mike M

08-01-2007 19:49:05




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Jim DeLozier, 08-01-2007 19:34:55  
Look close at the linkage. I had a 650 that wouldn't shut down with the throttle lever,but I could if I reached down and pulled back? or up ? on the linkage. I can't exactly remember the problem ? I think it was a combination of needing lubed and a weak or missing return spring.

On that starter if you can't get voltage at the starter wire from the switch trace it back checking the wire and at the switch. I don't think they have too much wiring on them as those were alot more simpler than the newer stuff. Does yours have an electric clutch for a belly mower ? if so these have an electronic interlock box that I had one go bad on our 750. I did replace it,but was able to bypass it same as if it was not equipped with a mower clutch option.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Jim DeLozier

08-01-2007 20:11:50




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Mike M, 08-01-2007 19:49:05  
I don't know about the electric clutch for a belly mower. It does have a belly mower, but it is not put on there right now. Where would I find this out?

I really appreciate everyones input and help. I would really like to get this fixed back up so my 77 year old dad won't be jump starting it anymore!



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Chirs in MD

07-31-2007 20:40:25




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Jim DeLozier, 07-31-2007 20:25:49  
This is a common problem on all 650/750/850/950 tractors.

The fix is to have a solenoid relay setup off of a John Deere 2520 tractor and wire it in so that the starter gets the full 12 volts at the solenoid.

I did this on a 950 which had the same problem as you. Although I can't remember how this setup worked, if you talk to a reputable john deere dealer and mechanic, he will tell you to wire this relay in.

This fix solved the problem.. and 5 years later, it is still starting right off.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Jim DeLozier

08-01-2007 19:38:53




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Chirs in MD, 07-31-2007 20:40:25  
Not sure if I understand just what you are saying, but there appears to be power at the solenoid. There is a wire from the battery to the solenoid and another wire coming out of the wireing harness that plugs into the front of the starter. Should I have 12volts there when I turn the key? I can check that pretty easy.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Chris in MD

08-02-2007 09:07:30




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Jim DeLozier, 08-01-2007 19:38:53  
Oh yes, you will need to check if there is 12 volts at the solenoid. And have someone turn the key and then measure the voltage at the solenoid again. If it is lower than 12 volts, you will need that setup like i have done to the 950.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
430WLPG

07-31-2007 20:36:18




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Jim DeLozier, 07-31-2007 20:25:49  
It may have a seat switch



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Jim DeLozier

08-01-2007 19:29:28




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to 430WLPG, 07-31-2007 20:36:18  
I thought of that and looked closely at the wiring diagram and see nothing indicating that there is a switch on the seat.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Mike M

08-01-2007 19:53:28




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Jim DeLozier, 08-01-2007 19:29:28  
It may or may not have a seat switch depending on if it is equipped with the front electric clutch option. It should have a pto and neutral switch.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Jim DeLozier

08-01-2007 20:07:33




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Mike M, 08-01-2007 19:53:28  
Don't think it does have a seat switch. I replaced the front PTO Switch. Do you think there is a switch on the clutch also? I don't see anything that looks there is.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Mike M

08-02-2007 05:11:49




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Jim DeLozier, 08-01-2007 20:07:33  
Since you have a belly mower and a front pto switch you have the interlock box. I think it is behind a plate on the dash you see as you sit in the seat. The front pto electric clutch is ran off the front of the engine and sits under a cover under the battery. You should also have a rear pto saftey switch somewhere by the shift lever and a neutral safety switch under a cover just ahead of the shift lever. A contiuity tester and volt meter should be all that's needed to test these.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Jim DeLozier

08-02-2007 10:00:29




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Mike M, 08-02-2007 05:11:49  
I will try to find the interlock box. The PTO Switch has a pair of ground wires on it that only have continuity when the PTO switch is in the off position. What does the interlock do?



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Mike M

08-02-2007 14:55:22




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Jim DeLozier, 08-02-2007 10:00:29  
Jim; I checked my books and I think I lead you astray. I'm sorry. It's been 10 years since ours acted up. It seems the interlock is only related to the front pto and not the starting circuit.

The starting circuit is a black and white wire that goes from the starter to the key switch C terminal. It also goes through 3 saftey switches I mentioned before. You NEED continuity through these switches. NOT TO GROUND as you mentioned before.

To check the key switch for continuity when in the start position you should get continuity on posts B to BR, B to C

In the on position continuity B to BR posts. Hopefully they are marked at the switch.

And for future reference if you do ever have trouble with the front pto interlock you can test it by bypassing it by hooking the green and blue (kinda purple ? )wires together to get the clutch to work.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Mike M

08-02-2007 10:37:11




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Jim DeLozier, 08-02-2007 10:00:29  
I double checked at JDPARTS and what I had in mind is indeed called a pto interlock and is only for ones with the front pto kit. part # AR102744 at $150.00 I knew the were pricey as I had to put one on the 750. I am not totally sure what they do ? but I think it will also keep them from starting. I was able to by pass mine to test it. I'd have to see if I can find the old pieces and which wires I bypassed. I'll try to remember to do this.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Jim DeLozier

08-04-2007 15:08:59




Report to Moderator
 Re: jd 650 won't start in reply to Mike M, 08-02-2007 10:37:11  
I just want to thank everyone for all their help in getting this problem solved. I want to especially thank Mike M for sticking with me through all the stupid questions. I got the tractor fixed this afternoon and believe me, it is nice to know that you don't have to jump the thing everytime you want to start it.
Again, thanks everyone.
Jim



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
[Options]  [Printer Friendly]  [Posting Help]  [Return to Forum]   [Log in to Reply]

Hop to:


TRACTOR PARTS TRACTOR MANUALS
We sell tractor parts!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]

Home  |  Forums


Copyright © 1997-2023 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters

Website Accessibility Policy