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What are they teaching these new JD mechanics?

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emschram

11-01-2003 05:47:34




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I recently had a problem with the clutch on my JD 80. I couldn't adjust it because the adjusting bolts were not holding so I tried to pull off the belt pulley with no luck. I mentioned this to my Son in Law and he said he had a freind that is a JD Mechanic and that he would ask him to come out and take a look. Well he came out allright. He brought a gear puller with him and when I explained the problem to him he started to argue with me. I said that I needed to get the clutch adjusting bolts out because I suspected a broken clutch dog or two. He told me that the bolts were just straight square head bolts and I said no..... actually they were T bolts. Well, he tried and tried to pull the gear but nothing gave so he stood up and declared that it would not come off unless I cut it off. OUCH. He then said that the tractor was not worth restoring and that's when I hit the roof. I told him that this tractor has been working fine for 50 years and he better go back to school. Anyways I finally got the gear off just yesterday and I didn't have to cut it off either. Lol. I am going to start restoring old john this winter and hopefully have it done by spring. Hopefully. I love that old tractor it has lots of oooomph.

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Ty

11-02-2003 09:19:34




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 Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechanics? in reply to emschram, 11-01-2003 05:47:34  
It varies all over. I'm 22 and just love the old equip. over the new. It is easy and basic and very reliable. New equip is a big computerized machine that if one thing goes wrong the whole thing doesn't work. At shows there a quite a few younger people there that do there own work and darn good at it. Know of one who can get the flywheel start ones going before you know it and runs like it came from the factory. Two years ago when I got the RC 70D the diesel was worn out the pony loose but not running and people said why bother with it. BS! I worked on it myself with the help of a service book, discussion board people and locals. I fuel off of people who have no faith in something that is past it's prime. Makes me want to do that much better. When it was all done running like it was new people were impressed. At shows get compliments with a great running pony and diesel. Also when I plow "Man does that thing have power" or "Wow do you do a unbelievable job plowing" That is such a reward! Even the guy's in their 80's say that you don't find that often and don't give it up and appreciate that it keeps going on and not fade away. Alot say you should have been born 70 years ago.LOL! When I got a std 70D that hasn't ran in 15years and in pieces they thought I was nuts. If you get that thing running it will be a miracle. Well pony and all. It's been quite the talk of the town around here. If young ones are interested they will get into it! If they don't get shot down by others or get any hands on experiance it will make them lose interest. Doesn't seem to be a problem in my area. As for the dealer mechanics it seems to be the middle age ones who are best of knowledge.

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JD-Tractor

11-01-2003 18:16:22




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 Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechanics? in reply to emschram, 11-01-2003 05:47:34  
Hey guys !!Listen to what you sound like,Most young people now have the attitude that if they haven't seen it ,it just dosen't exist."We are the problem " We push for progress !! We buy a new tractor or whatever and immediately spout off about how they should have built it.think about it these things are 50 years old .Do we really expect or want our young people to concentrate on 50 year old technology ? If they did they would starve pretty quick.These thoughts from a 55 yr.old who is always the first to bemoan the fact that these young people don't know what we expect them to.

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ChuckW

11-01-2003 14:35:05




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 Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechanics? in reply to emschram, 11-01-2003 05:47:34  
my viewpoint goes deeper...what a life to be growing up in a short term economy. Best store you've shopped is W----- best restuart is Mc----- - no wonder our young people are confusted and us older ones somewhat frustrated.



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Tyler-MO

11-01-2003 11:50:31




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 Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechanics? in reply to emschram, 11-01-2003 05:47:34  
Hey now.....some of us "youngin's" do know a thing or two. I realize that there are very few younger people these days that know or even care about old machines. I am fortunate enough to have a very close friend who worked for JD in the 50's, owned and operated his own machine shop for 30 yrs, and knows 2cyls like the back of his hand. I learn more working with him in 10 minutes than sometimes in a week of college classes.

I do know of a few young people that take interest in old tractors and that want to learn. It's just too bad that the streotype labels all of us as "young, dumb, ignorant kids". I've found myself in many situations where I was judged by others to be some dumb kid that wants to play with grandpa's tractor. Often times old timers won't take me seriously and then maybe I get through to them when I start talking about something technical like power steering vane seals or setting the backlash on governor gears. I've had several people just stand there with their mouth dropped open when they realize that I might actually know something.

I read this discussion board regularly and tinker with my 720, 520, and other tractors regularly. I try to take as much in as possible because I realize that the next generation of collectors/restorers has a much narrower technical knowledge. I've had lots of experience with repairing and maintaining various two-cylinders and with my uncle's shed being full of debuques that he can't even change points in. Maybe someday people like myself will be in demand and rare. The old timers won't be around forever.

Of course I realize that my upbringing really assisted my in my technical skills and common sense development (that many people have too little of if any at all these days). I would often become offended by mature people taking me as a dumb kid, but now I really enjoy the challenge of trying to make them realize that I know the difference between a clutch toggle and a throttle disc. I have been fortunate to have an internship at a local JD dealer. I love to surprise customers as they come in asking about their old tractors and equipment. Most people think that I'm just the punk kid behind the counter who doesn't know how to change the oil in the lawnmower but they usually leave with quite an improved impression. I've even helped a few people work on their tractors. It is surprising how many people really don't have a clue about their tractors. A fellow just the other day asked me what you were supposed to put into the big plug close by the clutch pulley. He was worried that he couldn't see any oil in there (reduction cover) and he was needing oil so he could fill it up(to the top)! He was sure glad that he stopped by or he would have had real problems.

So anyway, enough of my ranting,

but please next time you see that punk kid(and maybe dressed in clothes that your mother wouldn't have let you wear in her house) at least give us the benefit of the doubt...however I caution to ask plenty of questions and urge us on to find the right solution and not yield to frustration and grab that "fire wrench" in angst.

Thank You

Tyler Buchheit in Missouri

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CAM

11-03-2003 11:31:56




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 Re: Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechan in reply to Tyler-MO, 11-01-2003 11:50:31  
Tyler,

Just want to add my atta-boy also. If you can keep up your knowledge and interest in this subject, then your value only goes up. My kids are just entering the teen years, so I know that there are more interests now than ever. Turning wrenches on tractors is further down the chart even more for the average kid now,( and I stress average) what with the complexity of the average car (to also help drive interest), and new things like computers and video games that weren't on the scene 30 years ago. I could talk bicycle repair in high school, as that's all my resources could take. You sound fortunate enough to have walked into a nice match of resources,ability and interest at a young age. I sincerely congratulate you, and would love to come across a young person such as yourself to talk tractors. Cam.

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Steve Crum

11-02-2003 08:41:06




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 Re: Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechan in reply to Tyler-MO, 11-01-2003 11:50:31  
I have a 15 year old son, the only reason he comes into the fabrication shop is to use the computer. He could care less about old tractors or new ones, or anything mechanical for that matter. If it won't plug into a computer or Gameboy he has no interest. I won't pressure him on this. He's talking his first car, I've told him lots of luck, most garage rates are in the $50.00 per hour range now. Having been in production management for almost 20 years now, I've come to have very low expectations of young people. A few bright stars pop up and I help them however I can. For the "mature" folks among us, I won't argue as I always learn something, God knows I don't have all the answers! The BSers are not hard to filter out, and the mean mouthed ones I walk away from. I try to deliver the highest quality in my trade and the vast majority seems to be happy with that. As far as the younger/future generations go, one would be truely foolish to expect them to embrace "obsolete technologies" when today's technology will be obsolete tomorrow. If someone takes an interest I will take the time to show or explain to them a detail. If they don't take an interest well that's their loss.

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Joe Smith

04-29-2005 13:21:26




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 META HTTP-EQUIV=Refresh CONTENT= in reply to Steve Crum, 11-02-2003 08:41:06  
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emschram

11-01-2003 13:57:32




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 Re: Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechan in reply to Tyler-MO, 11-01-2003 11:50:31  
Tyler;
Dont get me wrong. There are some good young mechanics out there. My son knows a fair bit about these old tractors too. He is not a mechanic but he still understands and is willing to listen and learn. There is nothing wrong with young mechanics but to find someone who knows much about antique John Deere's in my area is very hard to find. Especially a JD80.



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G-MAN

11-01-2003 13:34:10




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 Re: Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechan in reply to Tyler-MO, 11-01-2003 11:50:31  
Very well said, Tyler, and I couldn't agree more. I've had the same thing happen to me countless times - been passed right by by a customer on his way to talk to an older mechanic about an older tractor, only to have that older mechanic bring the customer right back to me. It is fun.



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buickanddeere

11-01-2003 09:52:38




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 Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechanics? in reply to emschram, 11-01-2003 05:47:34  
Repair shops has mostly parts replacers instead of mechanics. Lots of money in selling parts and billing shop time. Many so called professionals in any trade incluiding medicine just take an educated guess at problems rather than thinking the entire problem through. Many don't know enough about the topic to think the problem through even if they tried. Doesn't matter if six months or 40 years experience.

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Dave K

11-01-2003 09:17:06




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 Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechanics? in reply to emschram, 11-01-2003 05:47:34  
I think JD would prefer to sell you a new tractor, not have you fix up an old one that will still do the job. They get over $2000 for a lawn tractor these days. I think the A's sold for under $1000, don't know about the 80 but the fun is in the rebuliding and the returns you get from the satisfaction and the continued work from the tractor are well worth it!

Dave



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Ralph

11-01-2003 09:12:24




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 Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechanics? in reply to emschram, 11-01-2003 05:47:34  
It isn't a question of what they are teaching, but what the "students (K - 12 + JD)" are willing/able to learn. For all the public belly-aching about poor teachers, poor schools, high salaries, etc., etc., I have never heard anyone complain about rotten students or parents. When I retired I thought I would help tutor poorly performing students. First day comments - I didn't bring my book, Do you have a pencil, I don't have any paper, I didn't bring my list of assignments. Been there, Done that, Ain't going back!

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John T

11-01-2003 09:00:10




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 Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechanics? in reply to emschram, 11-01-2003 05:47:34  
This is somewhat similar to the good natured joshing I give the young shop manager at a small local mom n pop machine shop I use. Their "machinist" are young and wearing tie dye shirts, tennis shoes, maybe baggy pants and backwards baseball caps. I tell the mamager when I was a kid

"REAL MACHINIST" are fit trim older gentlemen with silver hair, bifocals, smooth polished cotton gray work shirts and matching pants, and a pocket saver in their shirts with a small metal scale. Im sure any of you over 40 know exactly the ones I described??

Also there were "Service Stations" where the owner attendant wore a gray or blue uniform with the logo on their shirts and jackets, some a tie even, and matching caps, who checked oil and added fluids and us teens hung out sitting on wooden coke cases. The Roadway Truck Drivers (drove Macks mostly, B or H models often) who stopped in had aviator style caps with Roadway badges and logo on hats, shirts and jackets. Us kids listened to the trucks entering Loogootee's Arrow Cafe/Truck Stop from the east (Shoals) and guessed the engines as Cummins, Mack, or the easy and obvious 671 or 318 whining 2 cycle GMC's.

Gotta love Nostalgia

John T

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Donny-B

11-01-2003 19:56:34




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 Re: Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechan in reply to John T, 11-01-2003 09:00:10  
Now hold on there, John T. I'm a 45 year old "REAL Machinist" who learned the trade starting at age 11. I am not silver haired(or any hair), I do not wear bi-focals (not yet) and I absolutly HATE Pocket Protectors!!! LOL. Its ironic that the young machinists you discribe matches the young man I work with. He also wears a bunch of chains around his neck and has a micrometer earing.



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G-MAN

11-03-2003 13:44:24




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 Re: Re: Re: What are they teaching these new JD me in reply to Donny-B, 11-01-2003 19:56:34  
I agree. Anyone that tries to judge somebody's skills or abilities by appearance is going to be disappointed more often than not. Looks are most often a product of the era someone was born and grew up in, rather than an indication of what they can do.



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emschram

11-01-2003 10:12:32




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 Re: Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechan in reply to John T, 11-01-2003 09:00:10  
I know exactly what your saying. I loved to sit in the local truck stop and look at all the big rigs. Man there were sure some nice ones back then. You still see some of them around. That's one of the reasons I like to restore these old tractors. Cheers emschram



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G-MAN

11-01-2003 07:56:18




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 Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechanics? in reply to emschram, 11-01-2003 05:47:34  
Sounds like you got a hold of a bad one. THIS JD mechanice likes working on two-cylinders, and views every opportunity to do so as a learning opportunity. Did he have the manuals for the thing, or was he just winging it? Not worth restoring? He obviously doesn't know much about "80"s, does he? There are two of us here that are the "go-to" guys for two-cylinders, and we're more than happy to keep it that way, lol. I'll never forget when we had an Ag-Tech kid here on one of his co-op quarters. Somebody drove a "B" into the shop and his first question was "is it supposed to sound like that"? And it's not always the young guys. I've worked around a few guys in their fifties that didn't know squat about two-cylinders. I've heard various people say that when dealing with older tractors, you want to look for the old, gray-haired guy in the shop and talk to him. Don't rely on that method.

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emschram

11-01-2003 10:05:29




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 Re: Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechan in reply to G-MAN, 11-01-2003 07:56:18  
No he didn't show up with any manuals. Just attitude and gear pullers. What really made me laugh was the first thing he did was walk up to the tractor and jiggle the clutch and then tell me that there might be something wrong. Ahh yeah Duh. He also told me that he had a D that he was restoring and I felt like asking him if that was his grade in school. LOL I realize that they probably teach these guys everything they need to know about the newer equipment. Oh well. What can I say? I deal a lot with my local John Deere Dealership and they are pretty good about getting me parts but I would not take my tractors in to them to be worked on. If someones going to screw it up then it better be me. lol.

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G-MAN

11-01-2003 11:16:10




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 Re: Re: Re: What are they teaching these new JD me in reply to emschram, 11-01-2003 10:05:29  
No, they don't even teach anywhere near everything they need to know about the new machines, either. Deere's product line is just far too large and diverse to even come close to learning even something about everything, let alone everything about something. I'm surprised that you had trouble with him, if he's into two-cylinders. You never know, maybe he was just in a bad mood that day, which is still no excuse. Move here - we'll take GOOD care of you, lol.

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emschram

11-01-2003 13:48:27




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: What are they teaching these new J in reply to G-MAN, 11-01-2003 11:16:10  
Thanks G-Man
Well I think he was hoping that I would say "Want to buy it" I don't think that he really is in to 2 cylinders but whatever. I just have to laugh thats all.



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old

11-01-2003 08:05:33




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 Re: Re: What are they teaching these new JD mechan in reply to G-MAN, 11-01-2003 07:56:18  
Ya finding some one that can work on some of these old tractors can be hard to come by most just want to sell you a new one. I guess thats why I do all my own work and out of 8 tractors only two don't run but I plan on makeing at least one of them run again its a 36B been in the family since 1938 it only needs one part a carb. Well just had to put in my 2 cents worth have a good day popping with your johnnys

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