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MM M-602 starter

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Dan

06-14-2003 12:17:13




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Does anyone have an idea where I could find a starter for this tractor? Also, the PTO always turns when the engine is on, and my dad (who owns the tractor) doesn't remember it ever being any different. Is this normal? We'd like to take it to tractor shows in the area, but it would be nice to have the PTO off completely for obvious safety reasons.
Thanks




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moline

06-16-2003 11:09:18




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 Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Dan, 06-14-2003 12:17:13  
Dan,I have a M602 and the pto always turns on it when it is running.If you put even the slightest load against it ,it stops turning.This is normal.With the tractor shut off and the pto disengaged,I can turn the shaft by hand.If you can turn it with the engine OFF!!!,and the pto disengaged,the plates are not warped and it is just residual drag from the oil spinning the pto.Just my 2 cents worth.Thanks,Moline

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Dale

06-15-2003 18:29:11




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 Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Dan, 06-14-2003 12:17:13  
Starters on these used to be a serious problem, broken noses are more common on these and M5's than anything else we've come across. Sometimes even the armature gets tweaked to the point you're better off with a different starter. We have a used one here, can get new replacement nose cones,or the best solution is a new Delco to replace the OEM Prestolite. For more info call 920 295 3278 or email riverdalefarmshop@yahoo.com. You're best solution to take your tractor to shows or pulls or parades or anytime to the public, and be safe is to buy the afore mentioned PTO cover. They look nice and were offerd from MM when new so originalty is OK. Dale

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Greg Smith

06-14-2003 19:43:09




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 Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Dan, 06-14-2003 12:17:13  
Is this starter for a gas or diesel? I have a diesel starter off an M5. It is the delco model.



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Greg Smith

06-14-2003 20:02:49




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 Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Greg Smith, 06-14-2003 19:43:09  
sorry, e-mail is mmgsmith@yahoo.com if interested in starter. :)



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Dan

06-14-2003 20:52:05




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 Re: Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Greg Smith, 06-14-2003 20:02:49  
Greg,
It is for the gas model, not the diesel model. The starter actually works, but the "nose" that extends out at the tip of the starter has broken off. (Sorry for the lack of technical terms.) It has already been welded back into place once, but it only lasted for about a year. We're hoping for a permanent solution to the problem.



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Kevin Moschenrose

06-14-2003 14:20:59




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 Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Dan, 06-14-2003 12:17:13  
I am not sure if the M602 is like my 5-stars or not. But on my 5-stars there is a lever which engages it and disengages the pto on it. Left side of the seat. I am thinking the two tractors are pretty close to the same thing. If so and it still turns then the clutches in that are in the rearend that drives the pto shaft are warped. There is always another way to get around this though. What I did is made a guard for mine from the parts book I have. If your rearend has two bolt holes one on each side of the housing then you can take a pipe longer then the pto shaft and weld two straps on it and bolt that to the housing. I could email you a picture of it out of my book if you would like.

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Kelvin

06-14-2003 18:02:33




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 Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Kevin Moschenrose, 06-14-2003 14:20:59  
I've got several of both the long and short NOS pto covers. I tried to sell once for 15 each, sold 2.



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Kevin Moschenrose

06-14-2003 19:55:31




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 Re: Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Kelvin, 06-14-2003 18:02:33  
Kelvin, send me another email please. I seemed to have lost it or deleted it some how. Have you found that air cleaner hose yet?



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dan

06-14-2003 16:01:20




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 Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Kevin Moschenrose, 06-14-2003 14:20:59  
Yes, the PTO lever is on the left side; sounds like the tractors are close to each other in design. I have the two bolts on each side, like you mentioned, and adding that guard is probably what I will have to do to it.
However, you mentioned that the clutches might be warped. Is that an impossible fix to do? Our local AGCO guy faxed me the service manual which showed a way to adjust the clutch, but it sounded like the adjustment was mainly for a problem where the PTO would not engage, not a problem where the PTO would not stop running.
Any ideas?

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G. L. Perry

06-14-2003 21:05:01




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 Re: Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to dan, 06-14-2003 16:01:20  
Most later models like the M670 and U-302's or Jet Star 3's all have a brake band on their PTO's. Yours does not. I don't know about the warped clutch part, but sometimes shafts just turn when not hooked up because of "drag" of components in case, but won't have power to actually run anything. Won't turn shafts when off. To get to them, you need to pull off the tele-flo and remove cover to see. NOT an easy job, I just did to my 670. I think there's a spec for "drag" on the pto shaft when off that helps in setting the clutch pak. One model had a cover on side of case to adjust the clutch thru. Think it was maybe 5star, not sure. Must not have been easy, no others had the hole!

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Kevin Moschenrose

06-14-2003 19:44:10




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 Re: Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to dan, 06-14-2003 16:01:20  
Well I have never had to work on one yet to speak of. I know of course it can be done and that they "the discs inside" look alot lot the ampi-torc but not for sure. It also sort of cams over center for the adjustment like the model U's do with the clutch adjustment you may try it and see. You will have to gain access by taking the cover off and all the stuff on top of it to get there, three point and so on. Once there and of course tractor is off, you should be able to tell if you done any good by grabbing the pto shaft and turning it by have. If it does than it's of course free if not well? But I am afraid though that the drive plates may just be too warped to do any good. If it was me I would try it first. I have turned off that new hide your email thing. I thought the two tractors where alot a like I know I took a radiator out of one for my diesel 5-star.

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Dan

06-14-2003 20:59:08




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Kevin Moschenrose, 06-14-2003 19:44:10  
Kevin,
Thanks for the input. I'm not sure that I'm brave enough to try something like that, but perhaps Dad and I might get crazy and jump into it later this year.
If you run across anyone with experience in something like this, and they'd be willing to give their 2 cents, please have them post their comments as well.
Dan



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pete-mi

06-14-2003 21:18:55




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Dan, 06-14-2003 20:59:08  
Does the pto still turn if it is hooked up to a piece of equipment and the lever off position? If so then it will need adjustment or repair. If it shuts off with a minor load it may need adjusting. This is not always the case because there wasnt a brake on the pto until the M670. All the earler units from 1956 to the mid 60's just had the clutch pack. We have had tractors in that the pto turns some when cold because the 80-90W oil is thick and turns the shaft. If the oil is somewhat warm and it is hooked to a light piece of equipment like a brush hog and still turns then get ready for some repairs. If it doesnt the best option is to put a pto shield on. This would be a good idea anywhay for safty.

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Dan

06-15-2003 08:59:53




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to pete-mi, 06-14-2003 21:18:55  
The PTO shaft does not turn when under load and the lever is in the OFF position.
A shield will have to be installed, no doubt about it. I'd like to go the extra step and make sure that the PTO is immobilized when off. Given what you've written, do you think it is possible to do that? Or is it just a fact of life, with an M602, that the PTO shaft will rotate slowly even though it is turned off?

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HOWARD

06-27-2003 18:36:29




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to Dan, 06-15-2003 08:59:53  
I OWN TWO 602 GASSERS AND FOUND NEW STARTERS FROM A LOCAL SUPPLIER EASILY AVAILABLE EMAIL IF YOU NEED INFO



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HOWARD

08-05-2003 20:18:12




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to HOWARD, 06-27-2003 18:36:29  
SORRY FOR THE LATE POST I PICKED UP NEW STARTERS IN FARGO ND. @USESCO WAREHOUSE RECIEVED THEM IN A COUPLE DAYS SOMEWHAT SPENDY AROUND 375.00 EACH



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Dan

06-28-2003 06:34:34




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: MM M-602 starter in reply to HOWARD, 06-27-2003 18:36:29  
Howard,
Please post more information about your starters. Our local guy tried to rig up a 30MT. The bolt pattern fit OK, but the body was too wide, so the effort failed. He is working on Plan B right now; not sure what it might entail.
We will also need to get a new ignition switch. Do you have an idea of where we can find one?
Thanks
Dan



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