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2N Pinnion

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Rusty

04-25-2000 20:33:43




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I rebuilt the engine for my 2N & while driving it for the first time in 5 years & grinning from ear to ear I noticed that the lower lift arms were leaking at the rear housing. Opened her up & noticed a crack where the rear pinnion bearing rests in the housing. This crack goes most of the way across the flat surface & heads upward. My intentions are to take it to a weld shop. Is this right & will it need to be machined out to fit a new bearing & race? What is the normal procedure for this . I was told it is quite common to break here. What might have caused this? Thanks for any information & thanks for all the good knowlege I've gained on this board.

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Nolan

04-26-2000 03:23:25




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 Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to Rusty, 04-25-2000 20:33:43  
I'd be inclined not to have it welded, but to have it stitched. From what I've read of it, stitching is a superior process for repairing cracks in iron.



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dave#1

04-26-2000 04:07:25




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 Re: Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to Nolan, 04-26-2000 03:23:25  
Nolan, what is stitching ? I've welded cast iron for the last 15 years, maybe I'm doing something wrong??


later,dave



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Nolan

04-27-2000 04:28:00




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 Re: Re: Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to dave#1, 04-26-2000 04:07:25  
I tag along on the Ford Flathead v-8 group to pick things up that I can use on my 8N. About a year ago there was a heck of a discussion on welding the blocks, as opposed to using plugs and this stitching method. From what I gleened, the stitching was the thing to use. It didn't involve heating the iron, so you didn't have to deal with crack propagation. It could also be performed on complex surfaces that the older plugging method wouldn't work on. The people that had used the stitching were all pleased with it, and the manufacturer claims it to be better then welding. I'd take that with a grain of salt, but some of the repairs they show being done with stitching I recognize as being considered impossible for welding.

If you've been welding iron successfully for 15 years, I'd say you know how to do it. Stitching may be something you'd want to add to your arsenal of repair techniques.

If you go to the web page about it, I'd be interested in hearing what your thoughts are.

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dave#1

04-27-2000 04:50:17




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to Nolan, 04-27-2000 04:28:00  
So, stitching is a product of the "Lock-N-Stitch Inc." ?

It's also a type of welding, cast iron welding !! I'd hate to see rusty go to his local welding company,ask if they could repair his casting, and have them say yes by welding it and have Rusty come back with "No, you can't weld it, you have to stitch it", he might look foolish !!

later,dave



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Nolan

04-27-2000 06:31:45




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to dave#1, 04-27-2000 04:50:17  
>So, stitching is a product of the "Lock-N-Stitch Inc." ?

No more then sewing is a product of Singer. Singer makes the needle, the actual sewing process is from the user.

>It's also a type of welding, cast iron welding !!

No. I don't know where you got that idea. It's an alternative to welding. As is pluging.

>I'd hate to see rusty go to his local welding company,ask if they could repair his
>casting, and have them say yes by welding it and have Rusty come back with
>"No, you can't weld it, you have to stitch it", he might look foolish !!

I don't know why he'd do that. I certainly never suggested anything of the sort.

If you wish to consider stitching to be stupid without researching it, that's fine. As I told you, I've come to understand from people with cast iron engine blocks that it is a very good method of repairs, far superior to using iron plugs, and sometimes better then welding. Repairs can be done this way to areas that normally could not be repaired by either plugs or welding. But again, if you wish to simply blindly ridicule it, that is your choice.

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dave#1

04-27-2000 15:49:35




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to Nolan, 04-27-2000 06:31:45  
Nolan, I never said "Stitching" was stupid ! I guess I should have said that stitch or stitching is a "Phrase" used by welders,and since your "Not" a welder you did'nt pick up on it, to stitch weld something (like cast iron) you weld several short beads of weld instead of one long bead, but not being a welder you would'nt know that, although your quick to give advice on the subject because of "What you've read" or "What you've beed told", Sometimes you need to get your hands dirty before "Blindly" give advice !

me

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Nolan

04-28-2000 03:52:27




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to dave#1, 04-27-2000 15:49:35  
Chuckle, by all means, continue to make a fool of yourself with your little tirades of ignorance about me, what I do, and what I know.


Sincerely recommending you not let your mocking bird mouth run away with your canary arse,
Nolan

PS, I got nuclear certified welding in the Navy. How high do *your* welding certifications go?



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dave#1

04-28-2000 04:39:23




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to Nolan, 04-28-2000 03:52:27  
LOL, Good one ! ROFLMAO, You the man....

Gee , guess I should have joined the navy to learn as much about welding as you did !

You have a good day Bubba #2 and we'll see ya around ! (-:

later,dave



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Nolan

04-28-2000 06:12:45




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to dave#1, 04-28-2000 04:39:23  
You have a good day too Dave. I'm really not interested in a pss'n contest or seeing if we can generate ill will.

On re-reading your sentence about stitching being welding, I understand what you were saying. That wasn't the way I read it the first time. Things can be read different ways, and it causes all kinds of problems with written text. I took it as you were saying this stitching process with the lock thingies was also a welding process, not that you were referring to stitch welding. A simple misunderstanding.

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dave#1

04-28-2000 14:49:17




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to Nolan, 04-28-2000 06:12:45  
Fair enough ! I'm not as blessed with the good old key board as some of you guys are, I could have made it alittle clearer.

Done deal.

me



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Gary Reed

04-27-2000 20:26:07




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to dave#1, 04-27-2000 15:49:35  
Nolan, Thanks for the kind words. From someone with thirty years of dirty hands in welding and metal stitching cast iron, I think that you understand quite well. The process is called metal stitching and has been around for over 70 years in one form or another and is quite well known in professional casting repair circles and by people who abandoned arc welding with ni-rod many years ago.

You are absolutely right that there is a relationship to plugging with tapered cast iron pins but with one very big difference.
Tapered pins induce a spreading force on the casting when tightened into the casting. Our patented CASTMASTER stitching pins and thread inserts do the opposite. The CASTMASTER threaded pins not only seal by installing them in an overlapping manner over the length of the crack but each pin adds strength back to the cracked area.

Dave is right that there is a method of welding known as "stitch welding". It is attempted with minimal positive results on cast iron. However, metal stitching does not involve any heat or epoxies to join the cracked casting back together. Lord knows that cast iron has a bad rap for being difficult to repair. I went through an apprenticeship thirty years ago in the art of hot welding diesel cylinder heads, engine blocks, transmission cases, etc. Hot welding involves very high preheat temperatures to properly stress relieve and anneal the weld and weld affected area. I cut my teeth back then using the old tapered pins or plugs. It was very slow and difficult to make serious, structural repairs. I know that it's hard to believe that there is finally a sound solution to this very old problem, but the truth is there really is a new, easy to use solution. There are thousands of people who have made millions of successful repairs with our products. Like anything else, you have to see it to believe it. So, Dave, take a minute and go check out the web site: www.locknstitch.com and spend some time on the CASTMASTER (C Series) pages. It really does work. I hope this doesn't sound like a sales pitch beause I don't intend it that way. We have a special understanding of welding and stitching cast iron and we want to share it with anyone who cares to spend a few minutes. Check out the section on cast iron welding and you'll see my dirty hand prints all over it.

Fact is, if the cast iron is at least 1/8" thick, and it's machinable (arc welding hardens the cast iron so hard that you can't drill it) and you can get to it with the tooling, it can be repaired. Thanks again for the kind words and for posting the link and for allowing me to intrude.

Thanks very much,
Gary J. Reed

PS: I've repaired a lot of 8Ns myself.

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dave#1

04-28-2000 04:20:38




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 2N Pinnion in reply to Gary Reed, 04-27-2000 20:26:07  
Thank you, that was all I was trying to say, that stitch or stiching is a phrase or term used in arc welding too. And you also seem to think that I don't like your product,that's not the case, I think it's a great product ! In my case, I don't see where I could use it, I work at a late model salvage yard, one of my jobs is welding engine blocks, I weld alot of broken or missing boss's, or "Ears"
Thanks for your input.

later,dave

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