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9N Starting Assistance Needed

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9n'er

07-01-2000 05:23:13




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Connected gas tank. Turned carburator needle adjustment closed, then opened them 1.25 turns. Connected battery terminals. Checked wiring. Pulled choke, turning over, but not firing. Smoke coming from starter. Starter assembly very warm to the touch. Paint overspray could have entered into starter... Suggestions as to what to do next? Battery is run down, will charge it up. Paint could be preventing adequate grounding...will check that. Your help is appreciated. thanks 9N'er

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9N'er

07-01-2000 08:26:59




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 Re: 9N Starting Assistance Needed in reply to 9n'er, 07-01-2000 05:23:13  
Charged up battery...replaced solonoid (12V system on this tractor). Checked wiring. No current at all, no turning over, deader than a door knob.



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Dave Todd

07-01-2000 10:17:55




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 Re: Re: 9N Starting Assistance Needed in reply to 9N'er, 07-01-2000 08:26:59  
9Nr, Did you by chance paint the block and then put the starter on?? You need a good clean connection between the starter housing and the block. No paint or rust. Also, what about your ground cable. It too needs a clean connection where it is bolted to the tractor. Also, what's this about a 12 volt system on a RESTORATION?? Just kidding. Wanted to beat Bg to the punch. Good luck!!
Dave



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9N'er

07-01-2000 13:35:21




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 Re: Re: Re: 9N Starting Assistance Needed in reply to Dave Todd, 07-01-2000 10:17:55  
12V on a restoration!? I know, I know, the pain of it all. Hey the good thing is this dang tractor is better than it was. The bad thing is...I'm broke. So the 12V is the low guy on this totem pole...as shamed as I am :)

ok, ok, yes, I did paint the chassis and I suspect it's not grounding. I'll scrape the paint away from the chassis where the starter makes contact. And the same thing with the grounding cable for the battery. It has paint on it more than metal too. I suspected the ground is the culprit. At least a good place to start. I'll do that. BIG QUESTION: DID I FRY THIS SYSTEM...AND THAT'S WHY THERE IS NO ELECTRICITY TO ANYHTING AT ALL NOW? i MEAN, THERE IS NOTHING. UGGHO. 9N'ER

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Dave Todd

07-01-2000 14:49:45




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: 9N Starting Assistance Needed in reply to 9N'er, 07-01-2000 13:35:21  
9Ner, Yes, for shame!! Grin!! My uneducated guess is that you didn't have a good enough ground which would have put all the amps to the bolts holding the starter on. I could be all wrong here, but this may have caused some smoke.?? I doubt, unless you cranked the old girl a long time, that anything is fried. Go back and make sure ALL of the connections are clean and that there is no paint on the start switch where the cables hook up. Also, check the starter for any paint where the cable hooks to the starter. All you should see is nice shiney copper. Next, I would take a jumper cable and go from the battery,(hot side) to the post on the starter. This will tell you if the problem lies elsewhere. It should run the starter, unless the battery is dead or real low. If that be the case, better take care of that while you are cleaning connections. If all this farting around doesn't work, better post again. Good luck!!
Dave

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9N'er

07-01-2000 19:14:18




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 9N Starting Assistance Needed in reply to Dave Todd, 07-01-2000 14:49:45  
sounds good...will give that a try. I would never have guessed that paint would do that, but my hunch was telling me a "grounding problem" (reminiscent of growing up I guess...Seemed like I was always being grounded!). Will get up early in the a.m. (my only time to work on it tomorrow), coffee in hand, and wire wheel in the other. If it fires up...well, I will dump the coffee and have a Coors Light...seems that is the poplular remedy for N-Series problems! ;) thanks for posting a reply...much appreciated. 9N'er

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Dale O'9n is it running?

07-02-2000 09:56:02




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 9N Starting Assistance Needed in reply to 9N'er, 07-01-2000 19:14:18  
Well is it running yet. Need to know what you did so I can be sure not make same mistake. Thanks for the other help. Dale O'9n



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9N'er

07-02-2000 16:09:56




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 9N Starting Assistance Needed in reply to Dale O'9n is it running?, 07-02-2000 09:56:02  
Haven't mucked with it yet. Family day today...may be able to attend to it tomorrow...hopefully it's too much paint at critical ground points...and that is it...and hopefully no damage! will keep ya posted! 9N'er



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truck

07-01-2000 08:39:58




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 Re: Re: 9N Starting Assistance Needed in reply to 9N'er, 07-01-2000 08:26:59  
9Nr, have been reading your saga, it looks like you've had some real fun. Anyway, to the troubleshooting now.
Do you have a voltmeter? or at least a test light?

General procedure is to start at the battery and follow the hot lead to the starter, testing for power at each circuit connection. As in first, is there power at the battery post? Then put your light or meter probe on the cable terminal. Is there power there? Now go to the other end of the cable, where it attaches to the solenoid.. check for power. Next would be the other side of the solenoid , where the cable goes to the starter. Then the cable connection, then the other end of cable where it goes into the starter, then the post on the starter. Find out the cause of the power loss if you find a point where voltage drops seriously or to zero. Usually it will be paint or rust blocking current flow, or a loose connection. Don't be afraid to take a wire wheel or sandpaper to all the connections. And make sure the solenoid is the right one for what you are doing. I beleive only the original solenoid will work with the original switch, as the 12V ones are designed to be activated by a HOT 12V+ instead of grounding the "start" lead. Similar testing should be done with the "hot " circuit for the ignition, all the way to the coil. You have checked for spark at one of the plugs, right?
Any questions, Ask away!

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9N'ER

07-01-2000 13:46:09




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 Re: Re: Re: 9N Starting Assistance Needed in reply to truck, 07-01-2000 08:39:58  
I think's it's time in my life to get a meter. Seems like the hot ticket item to get now that I need to troubleshoot electrical systems. I'll start with the ground connections and removing paint. And before I connect the terminals, I'll do the meter test and determine if there is a breakdown along the circuit. Looks like Wednesday at the soonest, now that auto parts stores are closed for the holiday weekend. Any suggestions on type of meter and price...would a cheapie do for my intermittent work? As noted above: THERE IS NOW NO CURRENT AT ALL TO ANYHTING...DID I FRY THE SYSTEM? i MEAN IT IS NOW DEADER THAN A DOOR KNOB. But the, good thing today...I removed the 8N hubs, and replaced them with original 9N hubs, rims, and BRAND SPANKING NEW 4.00 x 19 single rib Miller Company tires... What a difference in appearance now. When I got this ol'd tractor, the nicest unit was the brand new stamped steel 1999 rims and tires on it...I knew I made progress, when they then looked like the most out of place thing on the 9N...except for that big cancerous globbed on 12V generator...oh the shame, the shame of it. 9N'er

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Truck

07-02-2000 18:16:54




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: 9N Starting Assistance Needed in reply to 9N'ER, 07-01-2000 13:46:09  
A Walmart cheapie meter and a $3.99 test light will do ya just fine! I noticed wally world has digital meters in the automotive section for under $20, and analog(dial) meters for under $10. for the basic testing you are doing they would do ok. When I went to SUNY AG for Automotive Technology, they had us buy a Radio Shack meter that cost about $25. I still have mine. What you have to watch out for is having the meter set on OHMS and applying voltage. That'll burn em out QUICK!
If you ever get a chance to buy a Snap On test light, you will have the world's most durable and reliable test light. Not too expensive either. I buy every one I find at yard sales. I'm wondering if I need locking lug nuts on my old hat style 32 inchers.. Sounds like they are getting scarce!

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