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Security systems

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Ray

07-01-2002 16:44:42




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I am out of state on business a couple weeks each month. Tonight my wife told me on the phone she wants a security system on our house due to someone ringing the door bell last night at 11:00pm. Other than a big mean dog and a shot gun by the bed, what do you recommend? I'm not sure what good it will do since we are 18 miles from nearest sheriff office. How do I calm her down without getting a dog that ties us down when we want to travel?

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drewjunr

07-03-2002 16:04:37




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
We live near Navasota,Tx. The first time we called the sheriff we had to give directions for them to even find us. Being out in BFE, no one would hear if the door was being kicked in, patio door was being smashed etc. We have dogs, guns and Keep Out signs posted, but if someone wants something bad enough an alarm wont stop them. If you have what they want they will find a way to get it. Just like cars with alarms get stolen.
About guns: We have 5 kids ages 4-10 yrs and have taught them about guns. Even after teaching them, I don't leave them within reach, eyesight or even knowledge of where they are hidden. We don't let the kids play waterguns, rubberband guns or finger guns, guns are not toys. My wife will pick up a gun,(read- knife, pipe, hoe, 2x4 etc) to protect herself and the kids. If you catch her at the right time of the month...she won't need any weapons, she'll just rip your head right off, won't even know what hit ya.

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CJ in Michigan

07-02-2002 11:48:59




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
Since you live out in the country I would suggest the 3-point security system
1)Shotgun.
2)shovel.
3)shut up.
Seriously- most break-ins are spur of the moment events on the part tof the criminal. If your house has a couple of motion detectors, bushes trimmed so as not to offer concealment, more often than not they will move on. Motion detectors can be hooked up to local siren alarms also, say on your porch, inside a garage etc., and will scare the bejaysus out of anybody creeping around where they should'nt.

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Dave In Iowa

07-02-2002 11:10:55




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
Ray, Since you asked specifically about security systems, here's my thoughts FWIW.

We also live 15-20 minutes from police, ambulance, fire dept., etc. We have had no problems where we are, have a 130lb dog to help watch the place. But a few years ago I took a job where I was traveling alot, I looked into security systems for my piece of mind while my wife was home alone with two small children (one of the reasons loaded guns around the house were not something I wanted to do).

Talked to the three larger companies in the area that offer security system installs and monitoring in our area. Discovered that these companies are hungry and was able to bargin and negotiate until on of the companies offered a package I couldn't pass up. Here's our deal in a nutshell: $375 for master unit and installation, including 8 zones with glass break protectors, door monitors and motion detectors. It also has a cell phone backup if the land lines are cut. $15.95/mnth monitoring (calling police or fire when alarm goes off, etc. + service plan to cover all maintenance charges over the 3 year contract period.

How do I like it? ... First of all we got a very nice reduction on our home owners insurance do to the smoke/fire monitoring, being that we live in a rural area. Second, I like having it, it's just one more way to deter someone from your proerty and hopefully find an easier mark. You can see the keypads if you look through the windows, we put the little "protected by" stickers on our doors. You can set the system to watch all the doors and windows at night while you can still move around the house. Like I said, just one more link in the chain. Do we have false alarms, yea, a couple a year - always our fault. But the sheriffs dept. is great about checking it out (even though they make no pretence of residential alarms being super high priority to them. I once left the back door ajar, it blew open during the day and set off the alram. When the police got there they saw the back door open and check EVERY INCH of the house! They were nice aobut it when they found out I didn't get the door shut completely that morning. And even though they don't charge us for false alarm response, I gladly pay for that kind of service.

Sorry it got so long, but to summarize: I like having the system (in addition to a dog and a few outside motion detection lights). It's a bit expensive, but gives me piece of mind. If a fire breaks out while at work or vaction, or a door gets opend or a window broken, etc. The system calls the station and someone is informed. Not too bad a deal.

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Ray

07-03-2002 08:43:58




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 Re: Re: Security systems in reply to Dave In Iowa, 07-02-2002 11:10:55  
Dave, I appreciate your approach. Could I ask what town your provider is located in? I might try to get the same folks to do mine out by Grinnell.



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Ron/PA

07-02-2002 09:34:48




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
All the talk of guns, is a waste of breath, if you are not willing to pull the trigger! If your wife is not the kind who can look someone in the eye and still shoot them, then perhaps a dog is the best option. My thought is that if your are not 100% sure you can actually shoot an intruder, then grind the front sight off of you weapon, that way when they take it from you and shove up your butt, it won't hurt so bad. Just rambling,
Ron

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Brian-2N

07-02-2002 07:25:03




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
Ray,
Start by reading Ayoob. Here are some other points that I have gleaned from years of reading Guns & Ammo, especially their security expert "Jim Grover".
1. Get a dog-the best and cheapest security.
2. Remove hedges/bushes from around the perimeter of your house-they offer a criminal a place to hide.
3. Install motion sensor lights all around your house. Light is the best crime deterant known.
4. Create a "safe room". It should have a solid door with a good lock and deadbolt. This is your last line of defense.
5. In the safe room keep a cell phone in case your phone line is cut, and a flashlight. Keep a non-lethal defensive system (mace, stun gun) in addition to a weapon. Courts take a dim view of excessive force to keep someone from stealing a TV.
6. A shotgun is the most lethal weapon and the most effective, except in close quarters. If you opt for a handgun, choose a .357 magnum with 125 jacketed hollow points. Studies have shown this gun and round as a 97% 1 shot stop-the highest of any other combination, including the mighty .45. Avoid complicated semi-autos or antique guns.
7. Never, ever rack your slide or cock your gun to scare someone off. It may scare a cop, but not a deranged killer. By doing so, you've just given away your position.
8.Do not hunt the perpetrator. You could get killed, or end up in court for using excessive force-for what, your G** D** stereo?
9. After you call the police, announce is a clear voice from your safe room, that "I have called the police, I am armed, leave the house". 10. Your stuff can be replaced-you can't.
Hope that helps
Brian D.-Endowment member of the NRA and self-appointed safety expert

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Mt Bob

07-02-2002 06:38:59




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
If you are going to teach your lady to handle a gun, you'll have to stop your late nights at the bar and learn to keep your drive shaft in the garage. :-))



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Nick at the JG

07-02-2002 06:20:35




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
My wife shoots regularly at the local indoor range to stay in touch with her 40 caliber Glock and we always put her targets (life size silhouettes with the chests and heads punched full of holes)out on the recycle bin, right on top. Word has a way of getting around.



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Richard B

07-01-2002 23:21:20




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
I don't think you are going to beat a big black yapping mutt and a shot gun as first choice butt motion activated security lights are right up there. It's even better if the turn on a light inside or the porch light at the same time and it will help wake up the dog. My dog always barks even at me so a steak or a gun isn't going to shut him up very quick.



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Mark Hendershot

07-01-2002 23:40:09




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 Re: Re: Security systems in reply to Richard B, 07-01-2002 23:21:20  
No steak ain't going to deture my dogs! They are fed to good and would just look at it and wonder why you are feeding them and eat it later. 150 lbs dogs take a big steak to make them happy! Remember it is hard to bullsh*t a good dog, people are easy! Mark H.



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Richie Magoo

07-01-2002 22:09:29




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
Ray:

I love dogs....and have a great watchdog myself who's also my best friend.(O-K...I dont have a life!)

But: Crook with gun=dead dog. Crook with steak=Dogs' new best friend!

The only real protection for any home....city or country, is a large firearm. I had the displeasure of knowing some "former" criminals when I lived (and worked) in NY., and most of them could handle/weren't afraid of dogs- but ALL would run from a shotgun! (Hopefully not so fast that you couldn't riddle their stinkin' carcasses with lead a few times though!)

Just look at how the criminal-lovin' liberals want to take away us innocent peoples' guns- they know that's the only way we can win against the scumbags.

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Fast Ed Ohio

07-01-2002 21:56:21




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
Good neighbors that will keep an eye on the place and a house setter when your gone, security system ok, but by the time the cops get there its to late, I always leave some lights on inside and out . ( no problems here in 13 years, Im thinking of getting an ignition key insted of an on off switch for the old N since it sets out all the time .)



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Mountainman

07-01-2002 19:33:04




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
You don't need a gun or a dog - just brag to the most gossip prone neighbors about how well the wife did at the shooting range last week and... well news like that travels fast. (grin)

I would seriously consider teaching her how to shoot. Most women take to shooting much more than they thought they would after the initial apprehention wears off.

Hope she did not open the door.

A simple alarm is a motion detector activated light. Crime likes a darkened stage.

Mountainman...CA

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Dean - Mi

07-01-2002 19:09:25




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
Forget the guns, get a dog (or two). They are safer and more efficient. We've got two Aussies (Australian Sheppards) that are outstanding at protecting the better half. They handle any type of predator (with 2 or 4 legs), willingly placing their life at risk to protect their people/property. Dogs are a great deterrent to intruders and, at a minor cost, you get a companion, helper and entertainer. As others indicate, a dog is the last thing an intruder wants to encounter. If you ask your local vet or neighbors, you can find a good kennel so that the dog(s) can go to 'camp' when you are away.

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Vic

07-01-2002 18:28:35




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
When interviewed, most convicted burglars (and these may be a different breed from home invaders, but the same principles no doubt apply) said they avoided houses that (in order!) had:

1. Big, loud dogs
2. Alarms

I expect a .357 magnum would have been on the "to be avoided" list as well, but it's hard to tell that from outside the house.



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Jeff Hoo

07-01-2002 17:54:47




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
000 buckshot under the bed makes me feel better at night.

You're on the right track, though. It's not a good security system that you wife is actually looking for, it's something that will make her -feel- safer.

I haven't met my future ex-wife yet, but I've dated girls that are comfy around guns, and those that treat guns like spiders. I doubt that a woman that's uncomfortable with a gun would be happy with an alarm either...since it just confirms that someone is banging on the door late at night.

But, there may be hope! I've turned two girls from being completely afraid to touch a gun, to wanting to shoot skeet on weekends.

All women like puppies, tho.

(The mileage between two points does not vary.)

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Franklin

07-01-2002 17:47:54




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
Hi Ray...Get a copy of: In the Gravest Extreme: The Role of the Firearm in Personal Protection...by Massad F. Ayoob



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duey in MN

07-01-2002 19:49:12




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 Re: Re: Security systems in reply to Franklin, 07-01-2002 17:47:54  
YES, Massad, he the MAN!!!! One of, if not THE finest!! Truely!



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DON TX

07-01-2002 17:47:06




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 Re: Security systems in reply to Ray, 07-01-2002 16:44:42  
Will she use a gun? Even with a security system, your security depends on your actions til the police arrive. The loading action of a semi-auto shotgun can be heard thru a door. It's the best security system you can put in your house. Just remember to call ahead when you head home. No surprizes.(%^) Also, dog kennels are good dog sitters when you want to travel. Or better yet leave the dog to protect the house and get a neighbor to care for the dog.HTH
DON TX

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Gr8Grndaddys8N

07-02-2002 06:14:02




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 Re: Re: Security systems in reply to DON TX, 07-01-2002 17:47:06  
Yep, and what I like about a shotgun is all you have to do is ask "where is he?" "North".....blam!" If the intuder is lucky, he started on the way out when you got to the "where" part!



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Gr8Grndaddys8N

07-02-2002 06:13:48




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 Re: Re: Security systems in reply to DON TX, 07-01-2002 17:47:06  
Yep, and what I like about a shotgun is all you have to do is ask "where is he?" "North".....blam!" If the intuder is lucky, he started on the way out when you got to the "where" part!



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steve mi

07-01-2002 19:22:22




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 Re: Re: Security systems in reply to DON TX, 07-01-2002 17:47:06  
don, reminds of a time when we went to a house at day break to ask a young fellow about 3 murders, we were going there to just ask some questions we had a very weak tip on he might know some thing, my buddy and a state cop went to the door, I was on the cornor of the house and to others were on two more cornors watching the windows, right after they knocked there was a clear racking of a pump gun, you never saw so much speed out of some fat cops heading for the neartest cover, then the shooting started, turns out he had killed his parents also, but that sound of a gun racking will send shivers down your spine and we couldn't see where he was as the house was dark.

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DON TX

07-02-2002 05:41:02




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 Re: Re: Re: Security systems in reply to steve mi, 07-01-2002 19:22:22  
Fuuunny!!! I was told about the shotgun sound by a Dallas cop. I understand it can't be imitated. Hats off to all Law Enforcment.
DON TX



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Hal/WA

07-01-2002 23:42:05




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 Re: Re: Re: Security systems in reply to steve mi, 07-01-2002 19:22:22  
PUCKER FACTOR #1!!!!! Been there, done that, glad it's over and we all made it through. Kind of remarkable how fast you can move under those conditions isn't it?

I personally think that a noisy dog is the rural dweller's best and cheapest security system. That dog is going to consider your house and buildings his turf and he will defend it, even if that just means alerting the rest of his pack (you and your wife) that he thinks something out of the ordinary is going on there. Yes dogs can be neutralized by killing them or bribing them with goodies, but most dogs that bark will say something long before the crooks get that close.

This gives you time to give yourself an advantage. I think a shotgun is best for the average homeowner, because it does not need much practice to be brutally effective, rounds will not carry very far, and the open end of the barrel looks absolutely huge. But few people leave a loaded shotgun by their bed. You need the time a dog's alert can give you.

But if someone uses a gun, they better be absolutely right and totally sure of the target. Deadly force must be justified or the shooter ends up being the one that goes to jail, or worse.

Security systems cost a lot of money and generate false alarms. My area has a false alarm ordinance that charges the homeowner for more that a couple of false alarms per year.

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R.M. In AL

07-02-2002 21:26:04




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Security systems in reply to Hal/WA, 07-01-2002 23:42:05  
Dont even waste your money on an alarm system.Either the law officers will not show up at all, will be 2 hours later or will want to fine you for any false alarm. They just do not work 15 miles out of town.I go with the motion detectors..Have a good fourth everyone...R.M. In AL



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