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8n smokes

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Rick

01-05-2003 13:37:46

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Hi, first I'd like to say I love this forum! My first post, my problem is my 8n smokes terrible. I checked compression by running a minute or two before shutting down, pulling all plugs then checking compression one cyc. at a time. Compression is 120 +/- 5 psi. all cyc. Some history, I bought this tractor 15 years ago from friend who was dying with cancer(pasted shortly after). He had put new sleaves in, pistons rings and crank. Don't know what he did to the valves. I do know this is a 9n engine on an 8n tractor. It will also foul plugs it seems on 2 and 3 cyc. most of the time. One more thing about the tractor He had put a 12v alternator on, remove front coil, removed winding, soildered coil wire to spring to button and put on a ford car coil. Been running like this for years. Seems like smokin has come on gradual over the years, smoke is a blue gray. thanks. Rick

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Rick

01-06-2003 18:47:43

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Re: 8n smokes in reply to Rick, 01-05-2003 13:37:46

Thanks for all the replies. Dell, you aked a couple questions back so I'll answer them best I can. It starts great when the plugs are not fouled and it has great power for an n. I'm very satisfied with performance. The plugs are carboned over when fouled, seems to be a light layer. I have a slight exhaust leak and the carb butter fly shaft is pretty worn, could it be I'm getting to much air in with the mix? I plan on doing a complete carb rebuild with new shaft soon. I've tried to change the oil often, but could not be regular enough. Will change and try the marvel mystery oil. Raytasch oil pressure is around 50 psi when first cranked, then after it gets real hot maybe a little more than 10 psi. Thanks again to all that posted replys, I really appreciate them very much. My father has a 8n with side mount distributor and I have the old hybrid 9n,8n combo, so I really love these old tractors. Thanks again Rick

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Mountainman

01-06-2003 20:25:39

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Re: Re: 8n smokes in reply to Rick, 01-06-2003 18:47:43

Sounds like your oil pressure is pretty normal if you have the later model, larger oil pump.

N's, with their up draft carbs, can be seriously affected by the throttle shaft wear so you are on the right track in rebuilding the carb with new shaft. You might have to put in bushings for that shaft too!

N - joy.

Mountainman...CA

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David - OR

01-06-2003 06:05:10

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Re: 8n smokes in reply to Rick, 01-05-2003 13:37:46

When I put my engine together, I noticed that it would be very easy to break the bottom rails on the three piece oil rings, if you didn't get the ring compressor wrapped perfectly around the piston and seated all the way down on the block. Those rails are so skinny they can pop out of the compressor and hang up on the top of the sleeve. If you then got too "vigorous" with the hammer handle on top of the piston, I can imagine driving the piston in but breaking the oil ring.

This could result in an engine with good compression but poor oil control.

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Vern-MI

01-05-2003 15:44:11

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Re: 8n smokes in reply to Rick, 01-05-2003 13:37:46

Just a reach but an intake valve openning late will cause oil consumption, IMHO.

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Dell (WA)

01-05-2003 14:37:25

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Re: 8n smokes in reply to Rick, 01-05-2003 13:37:46

Rick..... .....blue-gray smoke is almost ALWAYS a ring issue. Do another compression test, Dry then Wet. 5 puffs min. Ford dry specs: 90 psi min.

Several ring issues to consider. Has it always smoked? Just start recently? Could be ring end gaps and end gap alignment around the piston. Could be sticky rings, try Marvel Mystery Oil treatment. Are you having to constantly top-off your crankcase oil level? Could you be confusing blue-gray oil smoke with dark over rich carb smokie? Do you have enuff power and does it start eazy? Do you get oil fouling on your sparkies?

Ya can buy a lotta oil for cost of an un-necessary overhaul..... ...Dell

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raytasch

01-05-2003 14:25:24

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Re: 8n smokes in reply to Rick, 01-05-2003 13:37:46

Sounds like a classic case of stopped up oil rings. Has the engine set up any of these 15 years? Has the oil and filter been changed on a regular basis. Does the engine have a working thermostat?? How many hours are actually on the engine since resleeve? If the engine does not have all that many hours on it and the oil changes have been neglected you might clean it up by changing oil and filter on a stepped up basis; I've seen gummed up rings free up. Your do not mention oil pressure.
With that kind of compression don't be too concern about the valves or guides. Congratulations on having a good working 12v conversion and front coil elimination.
ray

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Rich, NJ

01-05-2003 14:12:04

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Re: 8n smokes in reply to Rick, 01-05-2003 13:37:46

Let me offer a suggestion or two. You don't say what weight oil your using. If it's too light, you maybe getting some blowby past either the rings or the valve stems. What comes out of the breather tube when the engine is hot? If there are blue smoke clouds, then it could be your rings despite the good compression numbers. Your friend may not have put new valves inthe engine when he did the work. hence, you could have oil getting past the stems under the vacuum. I'm a little envious of your compression numbers
so it sounds like both the rings and the valves are well seated. You may also upgrade to a hotter plug to reduce the fouling you speak of. I Hope this helps, Rich

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