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Compression stuff, How's it possible.......

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Rich,NJ

04-05-2003 01:02:24




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In checking the specs listed in this group, I find that the compression ratio is 6 to 1. that being the case, I multiply 6 times 14 (14lbs being air pressure at slightly above sea level)
I come up with 84 lbs as the theorectical maximum compression. How can you get 120 lbs with a six to one comp ratio ? Maybe in death valley. Regards, Rich




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George Willer

04-05-2003 11:10:46




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 Re: Compression stuff, How's it possible....... in reply to Rich,NJ, 04-05-2003 01:02:24  
Rich,

I've pondered that same thing many times...like every time someone mentions a reading higher than is theoretically possible. I've come up with some possible answers:

1. The engine has been modified to raise the compression ratio.
2. The combustion chamber is reduced in volume due to deposits...effectively raising compression ratio.
3. The manufacturers deliberately change the calibration of the gauges so they will sell better. (feelgood error)
4. Multiplying 14.7 x 6 produces a different result, if you went to a different school.
5. We can compute it in absolute pressure by adding the absolute beginning pressure, and then deducting it from the final result...comes out the same.
6. Another metric conspiracy.
7. All the variables (cams, timing, engine condition, ect.) that have been mentioned will all produce a lower reading.
8. The lower reading for the first few strokes is because of the volume of the measuring equipment itself which has to be pumped up. It can't pump higher than atmosphere times compression ratio.
9. Running the test at a location below sea level.
10. The manufacturer made an error when originally computing the compression ratio.


George Willer

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Scott-NC

04-05-2003 09:15:31




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 Re: Compression stuff, How's it possible....... in reply to Rich,NJ, 04-05-2003 01:02:24  
Camshaft timing (overlap, duration and lift) as well as the rod length to stroke ratio, cranking speed and inlet or exhaust restrictions (or the lack there of) all play a part in cranking compression. And don't forget ring and valve seal. Personally, and this is just my opinion, I have found checking cranking compression to be a test of marginal value. I would much prefer a leakdown test as it eliminates all the above variables except the ring and valve seal, and thats usually what you're wanting to know about anyway.

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Don C

04-05-2003 05:20:16




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 Re: Compression stuff, How's it possible....... in reply to Rich,NJ, 04-05-2003 01:02:24  
The actual compression ratio is a measurment of the volume of the cylinder above the piston at bottom dead center and the space at the head including the gasket, then again how much the area changes when the piston is at top dead center.



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Dell (WA)

04-05-2003 01:29:04




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 Re: Compression stuff, How's it possible....... in reply to Rich,NJ, 04-05-2003 01:02:24  
Rich..... ....air pressure at sealevel is 14.7 psia, compression ratio 6.0:1. do the math 88.2 + 14.7 = 102.9 psia..... ...Dell



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forgot . . . Dell (WA)

04-05-2003 02:35:41




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 Re: Re: Compression stuff, How's it possible....... in reply to Dell (WA), 04-05-2003 01:29:04  
gotta convert 102.9 psia to 117.6 psig for 6.0:1 compression test, most peoples eyeballs would probably read that as 120 psi..... ....Dell



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Rich, NJ

04-05-2003 05:35:55




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 Re: Re: Re: Compression stuff, How's it possible....... in reply to forgot . . . Dell (WA), 04-05-2003 02:35:41  
Dell, Of all the guys I hate to disagree with, Gotta be you. Howemsoever, 6 to 1 to me means 6X14.7 ( I adjusted the 14 to "slightly above sea level) actually about 700'msl) OK sea level, 14.7 = 88.2 assuming 100% volumetric efficiency which at cranking speed would not be off base. Where does the other 29.4 (117.6 - 88.2 = 29.4) or two atmospheres come from, that sounds like 8 to 1,
not 6 to 1. I can understand adding the original Atmos. Press. of 14.7 to the 88.2 for 102.9 if thats the way that these things get calculated, but where'd that other 14.7 come from? Regards, Rich

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Dell (WA)

04-05-2003 10:25:06




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Compression stuff, How's it possible....... in reply to Rich, NJ, 04-05-2003 05:35:55  
Rich..... ...extra 14.7 comes from difference between psia and psig. Basic physics nominclature, pounds (per) square inch ATMOSPHERE, and pounds (per) square inch GAUGE. Just a sliding scale..... .....Dell



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Stan(PA)

04-05-2003 15:09:06




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Compression stuff, How's it possible....... in reply to Dell (WA), 04-05-2003 10:25:06  
To convert psia (absolute pressure) to gauge pressure, you would subract 14.7, since the gauge reads atmosphere as 0 psi. Just my opinion, and I'm normally wrong....



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Slowpoke

04-07-2003 00:30:08




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Compression stuff, How's it possible....... in reply to Stan(PA), 04-05-2003 15:09:06  
Stan... Sounds reasonable to me.



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