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Overhaul Question

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OverMyHead

04-11-2003 11:44:01




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I am in the middle of an engine overhaul on an 8N. Everything has gone well to the point of replacing the rings. I bought an entire overhaul kit, so I am assuming parts should match, but that could be a bad assumption. My problem is that the bottom ring (which is acually three rings, two very thin rings seperated by a spacer ring) is to tight. The top and middle rings are fine, I had to file them to adjust ring end clearance just slightly. Without any rings on the piston, it moves freely in the sleeve, as I would expect. With the top two rings on it is a little stiffer, but no more than I would expect. When I add the bottom ring it gets very tight. At that point, it's all I can do to move the piston by pulling or pushing on it. I have checked the ring end clearance, it is fine. It seems like that third ring is just a little to large. I have inserted the two thin rings that make the bottom set into the sleeve without a piston and have plenty of end clearance, but the spacer that is in that set, actually makes the thin rings stand out slightly from the piston.

Any ideas, or do I just have incorrect rings.

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OverMyHead

04-11-2003 21:34:23




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 Re: Overhaul Question in reply to OverMyHead, 04-11-2003 11:44:01  
I knew how the three rings work together, just seems that they slightly big, even with ring end gap set correctly. I put this whole thing together a couple days ago and couldn't even begin to turn the crank, with any amount of force. I have adjusted the ring end gap some since then, maybe I should try again and see if it is a bit looser now.



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Week N Warrior (MS/MO)

04-12-2003 03:07:14




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 Re: Re: Overhaul Question in reply to OverMyHead, 04-11-2003 21:34:23  
You did clean the carbon out of the ring grooves didn't you?
If not, this could cause the problem you are describing.
They make a tool to do this or you can break an old ring and use it.

Carl



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OverMyHead

04-12-2003 13:53:58




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 Re: Re: Re: Overhaul Question in reply to Week N Warrior (MS/MO), 04-12-2003 03:07:14  
Good idea, but I have brand new pistons.

Thanks!



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Dave Smith

04-11-2003 19:27:25




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 Re: Overhaul Question in reply to OverMyHead, 04-11-2003 11:44:01  
Over, If you look at the oil ring expander you will see it is omega shaped. That is U shaped with just the outer top ears and not the inner ears. The inner edge of the 2 thin flat steel rings go up to the ears on the expander. The expander will compress.
third party image
Put the expander in the groove first, then the rings.
Dave <*)))><

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Rick H. Ga.

04-11-2003 18:34:35




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 Re: Overhaul Question in reply to OverMyHead, 04-11-2003 11:44:01  
I believe you posted this same problem (or at least the tightness of the newly assembled engine) a couple of days ago. If you are trying to push and pull the pistons up and down by hand you are naturally going assume they are too tight because they will be rather stiff. After you get all four pistons in and torqued to the crank, the assembly will be rather tight to turn by hand.

When I did my N engine rebuild I had to use a ratchet or a big screwdriver to turn it over (without the head on). When I got it all back together and cranked it for he first time it turned over a little slow but soon fired right up and ran superbly.

I would follow Dell’s advice and seek the opinion of an experienced mechanic if you fell your rings are just too tight. HTH. Rick H. Ga.

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Dell (WA)

04-11-2003 12:48:44




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 Re: Overhaul Question in reply to OverMyHead, 04-11-2003 11:44:01  
You are talking about the "oil control ring" which is a 3-part ring (2 very thin rings separated by a wider wavy spacer ring). Each thin ring should be individually endgap fitted to its appropriate cylinder.

Your description of the spacer ring "forcing" the thin rings out of the piston groove is worryingsome. Are you certain that you're assembling the oil ring correctly? It all most sounds that the 3-part oil ring assy is "to thick" for the pistonring groove. It might be time to get out that ol'micrometer. Altho you might get a good check on thickness fit by NOT installing the rings over the piston, BUT BY trying to slide all 3-parts into the piston grove at one time kinda like a figgure "8" (top view).

I'm assuming that you are using a piston ring compression sleeve to install your piston assy in the engine block.

Remember to "off-set" your ring gaps by 180*.

It might be "show and ask" time at a real engine rebuilder shop..... .....Dell

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