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Oil Pressure Surprise
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8NLvr

04-30-2003 14:13:42




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I've got a late model 8N with the side mount distributor. I've owned it about 10 years. No engine problems until now. I drove it out of the barn last month and got about 300 feet away when (like an idiot) I looked at the oil pressure gauge for the first time. Of course, it read zero. zilch. nada. I'd had this problem before - the oil pump had lost it's prime. Only I had always caught it before I started driving. So I got the oil pump working again (primed it), but the oil pressure fell to only 20 pounds when the engine's hot and it fell to zero at idle. It always had at least 10-15 pounds at idle before.

So, I pulled the engine and took it apart today, expecting shot rod and/or main bearings. Guess what? Rod bearings look excellent, mains look good. Lots of bearing material, some scratches, some wear on the mains, but it all looks good. I don't have any way to measure the clearances, but they can't be too bad. Also, (although it doesn't have anything to do with oil pressure) the pistons had minimal wear and there was no ridge at all in the cylinders.

The oil pump gears looked good (3/4" gears).

So, why do you think that the oil pressure went bad? Is it possible that the cam bearing surfaces are bad? Or maybe just the oil pump?

I'm thinking about having the cylinders measured and if they and the pistons are OK, then just going back with standard size piston rings. (4-ring pistons). The crank will need to be turned due to ridges on it.

Any suggestions?

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Tom Connor

08-30-2003 15:24:38




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 Re: Oil Pressure Surprise - Long in reply to 8NLvr, 04-30-2003 14:13:42  
I had a oil sender go south and put in a Sun Guage. Pressure is 45 when cold drops to 25 and 15 at idle after 30 miles @ 75 mph. I put a new sender in and it always reads great. I bought the (150 4X4) with 120,000 miles and it has always sounded like a diesel when really revved in low gears. I can't seem to hurt it though and I have put an additional 40,000 miles on it. The body (Short) is original and like new. Been thinking crate / rebuild / or just keeping on keeping on. I loose coolant, ( quart per week) and cannot find where it goes, not in oil and no oil in cooling system. Anyone out there experience this stuff with this bullet proof motor?

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8NLvr

04-30-2003 16:35:27




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 Re: Oil Pressure Surprise - Long in reply to 8NLvr, 04-30-2003 14:13:42  
Dell,

No reason to check compression. The engine ran OK (burned some oil) but compression had nothing to do with oil pressure. I know I have 4 ring pistons because they're laying on my work bench right now. I'm familiar with plastigauge, used it on many engine overhauls. It's just that i've never had this problem when the engine's bearings look this good.

To everyone: I will check the oil pickup tube right now and see if it's loose. The pressure relief spring and valve were OK, no debris and the oil pressure gauge is also OK - it's a mechanical gauge and tested fine.

Since I have this baby apart, i'm going to go ahead and send everything out to the machine shop - new cylinder liners, main and rod bearins, valves, and valve guides. Oh yes, and a new oil pump - just in case. This tractor lasted me ten years so far with very little maintenance, so at least now i'll know what's inside. All it takes is $$$ that I don't have. :-)

Thanks for all of the replies. I appreciate it.

8NLvr

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Dell (WA)

04-30-2003 15:28:12




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 Re: Oil Pressure Surprise - Long in reply to 8NLvr, 04-30-2003 14:13:42  
Did you EVEN THINK to check your compression BEFORE you so eagerly dismantled your engine? Ford specs: 90 psi min. While your concern about oil pressure is to be commended, once you got re-primed, you would have NOT DAMMAGED your engine doing a compression check.

How do you know that you have 4-ring pistons? I believe they stopped installing them in 1949 and sidemount engines started in mid 1950. Anyways, 3-ring aluminum pistons are better and are recommend for ALL years (39-52) N-Engines as replacements.

You can't tell a d*mn thing about an oil pump just by looking at it, ya gotta get the ol'feeler gauges out. Your camshaft does NOT have renewable bearings and are NOT likely to be the cause of your oil pressure loss. And yes, your most likely cause of prime loss is the oilpickup tube. Zane sez you can sweat silversolder it to reseal where the tube fits the oilpump.

As for your crankshaft, time to get the ol'plasti-gage out. You have to ask for it at real autoparts stores, it comes with instructions. That is how you measure your crankshaft bearing journals. And then if too "wide" clearance, hav'em turned to replacement standards..... ....respectfully, Dell

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jeb2n

04-30-2003 14:43:37




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 Re: Oil Pressure Surprise - Long in reply to 8NLvr, 04-30-2003 14:13:42  
it seems that usually when the oil pump looses prime, the pickup tube is the culprit. Check it for looseness and/or holes. If your oil pump gears are good, seals are good in the pump, then you either have a loose pickup tube (allowing air to be sucked into the pump rather than oil) or a bad oil pressure sending unit. Those would be my guesses. I'm no expert, but i've seen it done on this board a million times..... :P

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raytasch

04-30-2003 14:42:34




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 Re: Oil Pressure Surprise - Long in reply to 8NLvr, 04-30-2003 14:13:42  
Sounds like you may have jumped the gun on the teardown. You may have had the OP gauge go bad or some crud blocking the line partially. Unlikely, but could be your pressure relief valve has crud in it. Make sure the oil pickup tube is not loose at the pump. Kinda hard to decide what to do with out measurements. Your crankshaft might just require polishing. Might be time to learn about plastigauge. If it has never been turned you could install .001 or .002 bearings. If you have no ridge at top of travel you probably don't have any cylinder wear. What kind of ring gap do you have? How much clearance between top compression ring and the lands? Sounds like you had fair pressure before. I'd rebuild pump and install new bearings and rings, and touch the valves if I did nothing else. I think it was Dr Zane who said here that he had never seen bad cam bearing surfaces in an N.
good luck,
ray

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