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Ford 9N, 2N & 8N Discussion Forum
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More or less lights on the subject

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Russ in SoCal

10-26-2004 17:47:30




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Now that we decided which terminal of the terminal block to run the lights from, why don"t folks with the switch on the right side sorta under the dash run it from the battery terminal of the voltage regulator?
Russ




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souNdguy

10-27-2004 06:13:25




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 Re: More or less lights on the subject in reply to Russ in SoCal, 10-26-2004 17:47:30  
Bob really hit the nail on the head.. you want the lights in the metered circuit so you can monitor 'net' charge conditions. If it was wired to the battery it would work.. accept net charge would be wrong, because the current consumed by the lamps would not be passing thru the ammeter, and thus (not) subtracting from the net charge shown.. etc.

Soundguy



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DanL-Colorado

10-27-2004 12:27:22




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 Re: More or less lights on the subject in reply to souNdguy, 10-27-2004 06:13:25  
Maybe I'm confused, but isn't that what you want? I mean, you don't want the lights (or any other accessories) drawing through the ammeter. You want the ammeter to read the amount of charge or discharge to or from the battery, not the other loads. If you're reading current for the lights, the ammeter would read CHARGE even if the battery was junk and not taking a charge on its own. Could be misleading, I think.

Point is, the ammeter should only read the amount of juice (sparkies??) going into or out of the electrical accumulator (aka battery).

What this means is that all loads such as lights should be tapped "upstream" of the ammeter. The other ammeter lead should go only to the battery.

Or am I all wet?

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souNdguy

10-27-2004 13:05:59




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 Re: More or less lights on the subject in reply to DanL-Colorado, 10-27-2004 12:27:22  
Not all wet.. just half wet.

You do want the lights in the circuit to measure " NET " charge.. NET charge is gross charge minus all loads.. That is what is left over to charge the battery. In other words.. with all your electrics in use.. if your needle is on 0 or less, your battery is not charging.

The key to the issue is to connect the lamp load to the correct terminal of the ammeter, Doing this will get you a 'discharge' reading on the meter with the genny not charging.. and that is what you want... You need to see the effect the load places on the whole system.

( To the poster wondering about relays: this is why I don't sugest relay's for lights.... most people have hard enough time just hooking up a light.. let alone a realy driven light.. )

Soundguy

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DanL-Colorado

10-27-2004 19:21:56




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 Re: More or less lights on the subject in reply to souNdguy, 10-27-2004 13:05:59  
I think we're saying the same thing. The loads should be taken from the "generator" side of the ammeter, rather than the "battery" side.



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souNdguy

10-28-2004 04:36:29




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 Re: More or less lights on the subject in reply to DanL-Colorado, 10-27-2004 19:21:56  
Correct. Anything loading the battery side of the ammeter will make the ammeters needle deflect more towards the positive making it look like it is charging more.. when in reality.. you may be in a state of discharge if you are exceeding the gennies capacity.

Soundguy



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DanL-Colorado

10-28-2004 06:45:04




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 Re: More or less lights on the subject in reply to souNdguy, 10-28-2004 04:36:29  
WHEW! Thought I was losing it for a while there!



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Rob N VA

10-26-2004 18:29:07




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 Re: More or less lights on the subject in reply to Russ in SoCal, 10-26-2004 17:47:30  
Just a guess here on your question. I think the voltage regulator cuts the flow to the battery if there is sufficient charge in the battery, therefore if the battery is charged there won't be any current comming off the battery side of the voltage regulator for which to run your lights. That might not be factual, but it sure sounds good, don't it? :)

Sierously, I would avoid drawing power from other sources for the headlights. They should be independent of other electrical devices. In the event of a system failure, it makes troubleshooting easier, and lessens the chance of one failed device being the cause of another failed device. Besides, wire is cheap, and another 15-18 inches of it to go to the terminal block or the battery is immatieral, in my humble opinion. Others may correct me on this.---Rob

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Russ in SoCal

10-26-2004 21:21:53




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 Re: More or less lights on the subject in reply to Rob N VA, 10-26-2004 18:29:07  
Rob,
The VR opens when the current drops below battery voltage to keep from motoring the generator. At the terminal, there"s at least battery voltage and once the genny comes up to more than battery voltage, the terminal has genny voltage. Battery will only charge to about 6 1/2 volts, but the generator doesn"t know that.
Russ



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Bob

10-26-2004 21:47:28




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 Re: More or less lights on the subject in reply to Russ in SoCal, 10-26-2004 21:21:53  
Actually, as the battery voltage begins to approach 7.4 Volts, or so, the VR points begin to open and close rapidly (vibrate), and the duty cycle % that they remain closed controls the field current in the generator, thereby limiting charging voltage to a safe level.

There is a separate CUTOUT relay in the voltage regulator that disconnects the generator from the battery when generator output voltage drops below the battery voltage, to prevent to battery from discharging into the generator when the engine is stopped, or the generator fails.

Actually, if you connected an extra light switch to the "Batt" terminal at the regulator, the ammeter readings would remain accurate, the same as if a separate wire were run to the terminal block to supply the extra light switch.

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