Remote hydraulics help needed!

My lift arms work great. I have hydraulic hoses connected to a control valve and then to the 2 FEL single acting cylinders. The loader relies on gravity/weight to lower the loader arms/bucket.

I have everything hooked up. The cylinders extended when I pushed the control lever forward. But, when I pull it back (this should return the hydraulic fluid from the cylinders to the internal reservoir) the arms won't budge. I now have my tractor sitting there with the bucket sky high! I thought since the cylinders hadn't been used for several years that they needed some help. So, I used a tow strap and a tree to see if I could back the tractor up and help push the loader arms down. No go!

At this point I'm wondering if I bought the wrong control valve. I have a: PRINCE RD-2575-T3-ESA1 SA OC VALVE. This is a 3 way, open center valve designed for one-way cylinders according to the sales info. You can view the valve here:>Link

Any>Link ideas would help. Tractor is out of commission until I solve this. (Can't use it with the bucket up high!)

Paul

I was going to email you to run this by you personally. I'm glad to see you spotted this thread.

The brass plug on the adapter plate was used to seal the previous owners return port (a quick fit connector was in this location). I don't believe the plug blocks this area. The depth of the plug was less than the depth of the old quick connect fitting originally on this location. And, I was getting perfect function of the 3 pt. lift arms prior to my recent issues. I assume if the return was blocked I'd have seen a problem even when I had the test port directly connected via a hose to the new return port.

I'm willing to take a look at this though if you think my above logic is flawed.

Thanks,

Paul.

I was driving over to our land to work on the tractor. I was planning on doing some tests with the hoses to isolate my potential problem.

As I was driving I began to think about how I initially kept moving different length hoses to different sites along my hydraulic set-up so that everything would look tidy. I was pleased at how it turned out too!

Then it dawned on me...What if I had the pressure and return lines going to my control valve accidently crossed with all the manipulations I had been doing? Hmmm, kinda dumb idea I thought to myself (especially considering that I've had my face approximately 6 inches away from the darn valve multiple times over the last 1.5 weeks!)

Well, when I arrived and examined the hydraulics guess what I found! I somehow had put the pressure hose in the OUT port and the return hose in the IN port.

Everything is corrected and the FEL and 3 pt. lift both work wonderfully.

Thanks for everyones helpful suggestions!

....I can't believe I overlooked such a basic mistake....At least i don't have to pursue any interal hydraulics repair.

Paul.

I am not sure why you need a second
valve when you are using the test
port for lifting your FEL. Position control UP - 3pt and FEL UP
Position control DOWN - ALL go Down.
Here is a picture of my setup.
Note the fluid returns to the top of the plate. Test port goes to "T"
up to dump valve and out to FEL.
Of course the 3 point must be chained
down to get the FEL to get the diverted fluid.
George

Paul

I Have to use the chain down method with
a rear scoop attached filled with rocks.
this gives me the needed ballast and holds
the 3 point down. With the FEL on it is
next to impossible to Hog or use the tractor
for much else anyway.

Does your FEL have a quick release from the
tractor and hydraulic quick connector
for ease of removal?

As for using the lift arms and FEL hydraulics, we both are doing this differently. I have done the modifications to the adapter plate which allows use of either system WITHOUT the need to chain down the lift arms. Without this mod the only choice is to do what you do (i.e., chain them down). The way I have it I can have an implement raised on the 3 pt lift arms while I use the FEL. As long as I don't try to use BOTH systems at the same time (not very likely in my uses) I'm OK.

Paul

Even if the three point hitch didn't work the one way control valve should.

When you modify the lift like you have to use a remote control valve the control valve must have a relief valve built into it too or the only relief valve that will be in play will be the high pressure system relief valve which is installed behind the hydraulic manifold lines on the bottom of the tractor and it doesn't like to be opened. It is a lot higher pressure than the pilot relief valve that is located on the back of the ram cylinder.

Take the line off comeing from the test port and determine if you have pressurized oil coming through itfirst.If you have you should have it going out the line to the top of the lift housing where it was modified when the control valve is in neutral.

Zane

I forgot to add...the control valve has its own relief valve.

Paul.

1: I bought an open center valve :-)
2: But more importantly, the adapter plate mod REQUIRES an open center valve so that the 3 pt. lift will get hydraulic pressure. Since my 3 pt. lift worked fine with this modification for several weeks prior to me adding the FEL control valve (and with the valve as well!) this tells me that I didn'te ACCIDENTALLY receive a closed center valve.

I'll try the test for pressure at the test port and get back to you. It may not be for several days....the weekend is over and I have to return to work.

Paul.

Also, I'm not that familiar w/ the modifications to the top cover you mentioned. How is the "out" port of the valve plumbed back to the reservoir?

Jeff

I played with it a bit. I even tried using the 3 pt. lift arm position control lever WHILE using the loader control lever believing that I may release the pressure this way. No go.

Then I noticed the 3 pt lift arms would not lift (with the loader control valve in neutral it should work...and had up to now). Hmmm I thought. Then I moved the loader control valve the the 'raise' position and the loader started to drop!

Well, I now knew that:

1: The hydraulic pressure was not being relieved previously. My original problem relates to not getting proper return. Since my 3 pt lift worked the new valve is my leading culprit!

2: The cylinders are confirmed to work both ways (No cylinder sticking issues causing my problem.

3: I now have a new problem since the pressure was now releasing BACKWARDS into the pressure line!

Currently, I cannot get the 3 pt lift arms to budge. And, I cannot get the loader to lift.

So, I fear I've damaged the pressure side of my hydraulics! How do I pinpoint the area? Pump? Relief valve? Other?

I'm learning fast but still have a long way to go. I certainly am not at the stage of hydraulic diagnostics yet. Any help would be appreciated.

At least the loader is lowered to a manageable level. But, now I can't move the back blade off the ground. (I can remove it to drive the tractor...lot of good that will do me!)

BTW, I added more hydraulic oil since with all this work it was a little low. But, no improvement or change. What happens if the oil gets too low?...Can I lose 'prime' of the pump? Could this be my new problem?

Paul.

1. Remove plate, determine which hole in plate corresponds to the 'pressure side' (basically the hole in plate that matches up with the test port), tap hole and place a threaded plug.

2. On the outside of the plate, find the raised elongated area which carries the pressure line (which you just plugged). Tap the end of this and add an elbow assembly. This is your return port.

It is easier to show in pictures. And my description is short and likely very confusing. Search for 'hydraulic diversion' and it will be more clear.

As for the control valve. They come default as open-center. The plug to convert to closed center doesn't even come with the valve. It is a separately ordered item.

Below is a link to a photo album with my adapter plate mods. My plate required an extra plug on the top since the previous owner had already attempted another mod to the plate...It is the brass plug on the top in some of the 'done' pics. Also, with this mod if you don't have your hydraulic implement hooked up you need to have a hose between the test port and the new return port on the adapter plate. Hence, the hose in the last couple of pics.

Paul.

• Adapter Plate mod pics

I have done the mod on the adapter plate (tapped and added a plug on the underside. tapped and added a return port on the top). This is a well known mod on the NAA to allow use of both the rear lift arms AND remote hydraulics...search for 'hydraulic diversion' on these forums.

I have hydraulics pressure coming from my test port (on the right side of the tractor housing) going to the IN port on the valve. I have the OUT port from the valve hooked to the new return port tapped into the NAA adapter plate. With the adapter plate mod I can use the lift arms just fine. This shows that with the open-center valve at the neutral position the hydraulic fluid flows through and returns to the adapter plate.

From Work Port A on the valve I have a T-fitting then hoses going to the 2 single acting cylinders. Pushing forward the control valve allows me to elevate the FEL. When I pull back on the lever (to release the pressure on the work port) the weight of the loader should push the hydraulic fluid back to the OUT port. The FEL doesn't lower. I really studied this A LOT prior to doing the mods and buying a valve. But, I'm wondering if I missed something and need a different type of valve?

Paul.

Here is a schematic of my hydraulic set-up. I thought this might help.

Paul.