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Ford 8N

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ricko700

12-07-2005 19:12:02




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Do any of the 8n models have a live pto?? If not, is there a way to make them live?? One more thing..what is a reasonable amount to pay for an 8N in fair shape? Kinda new to this tractor thang, but I need one bad.




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ZANE

12-08-2005 12:37:27




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
Didn't you guys read what Don Barkley said????

There was an aftermarket device that went between the output of the transmission and the rear end that took the place of the drive coupling shaft that did in fact give the 8N or any N tractor for that matter live PTO. Not live hydraulics but "Live PTO". It was used primarily for PTO driven implements such as a square baler or corn picker or silage cutter etc. Anything that was prone to clogging up and the PTO needed to remain turning and let the tractor ground speed stop so the machine could clear out before going on.

I make and market a Live Hydraulics unit for the N tractor and the Ferguson T model tractors that is belt driven from the engine and gives the N tractor live hydraulics that allows the operator to depress the clutch pedal and stop the tractor and the lift will continue to operate as long as the engine is running. Not Live PTO, Live Hydraulics!

See the link below

Zane

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don b

12-08-2005 07:39:21




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
Richo..... ..Yes as some have posted,there was a clutch pack assy.made by Sherman for the late 1952 8n.This assy. was called Manually Operated LPTO and did not have any hyd. lines to operate it.This clutch pack is located between the main output shaft of the tranny and the pinion and is operated by a long handle with a black tranny shifter knob that is located on the lefthand access cover along with the pto shifter lever.The pto shaft and lift on the 8n is operated by the tranny countershaft.With the engine running and the clutch out,both the main and countershafts are turning.With the Sherman LPTO installed,if you move the above mentioned handle,the power from the mainshaft to the pinion is interupted and the tractor rear wheels will cease to turn.The countershaft will continue to turn and so does the pto shaft[if the pto lever is engaged].This is called "live pto". We have a restored 1952 8n in our showroom with this feature.However,this feature is very rare and hard to find.Like the others have said,if you need this feature,I suggest you look for a later model tractor or buy the Zane Thang from Zane Sherman. don b

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Towbar

12-08-2005 07:03:55




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
FarmerDawn did you by chance once work at a fertilizer terminal on the notth side of Waco Tx.



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FarmerDawn

12-09-2005 08:29:36




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to Towbar, 12-08-2005 07:03:55  
Nope. I've been sitting here trying to think of where that is, but I'm not sure. Is it over by the big turkey plant near Bellmead?



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Towbar

12-10-2005 03:33:13




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to FarmerDawn, 12-09-2005 08:29:36  
It was on the West side of Bus 77 North of Loop 340. Cant recall name of it as many of them changed names thru the "80's and "90's.



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FarmerDawn

12-10-2005 05:16:17




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to Towbar, 12-10-2005 03:33:13  
Hmm. I know that intersection area fairly well, but don't remember a fertilizer plant there. A lot of things (including a huge ag coop) in that area have closed down in the last few years, leaving big vacant industrial buildings and lots. Maybe it was in one of those. Or maybe it's still there but I simply didn't "register" it as I drove by. But at least I know where you mean now. Brown's Hardware smack on the corner of 77 and the Loop road there. :-)

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Gaspump

12-08-2005 06:13:44




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
KCM is correct, there was a kit made for the 8N that gave it live hydraulics action. This kit, similar to the one on the NAA was a hydraulic slip clutch mounted between the tranny and the rear end.



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Dan Hill

12-08-2005 03:24:59




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
AC model WD has live power.Usually sells for lower price than a Ford.



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old

12-07-2005 20:59:09




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
No live PTO or Hyds on any of the Ns. As far as price it depends a lot on what the tires look like, how well it runs, weather or not its side mount or front mount distibutor and what the sheet metal looks like. I've seen them sell for as little as $300, not running and bad tires/rims. To as high as $4000 restored. Not to knock fords but theres a lot of tracotrs out there and some come cheaper the some of the Ns do and have live PTO and hyds. But I do also have 5 tractors for sale right now and there all over as far as price.

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2fordsmike

12-08-2005 07:40:28




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to old, 12-07-2005 20:59:09  
Old: That's a good reminder that there are a lot of tractors out there that are sorta orphan sized--too big for small acreages and too small for farmin' farmers. They're gettin' a little long in the tooth and raggedy, however. As you know, they will do twice the work of an 8N without strain, but don't fit in the garage and they can be a bit dangerous for kids and grandkids. Mike



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old

12-08-2005 07:55:43




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to 2fordsmike, 12-08-2005 07:40:28  
Yep but almost any thing can be dangerous for kids. Shoot there more kids hurt or killed by bikes and swiming pools then a lot of other thing includeing gun.



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6N's Short

12-08-2005 10:18:16




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to old, 12-08-2005 07:55:43  
Near as I can tell from reading all the forums over the years the N Fords are pretty darn dangerous. Same idjit will get hurt no matter what he is driving. Garages are for cars....but don't tell mine that!



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old

12-08-2005 10:52:34




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to 6N's Short, 12-08-2005 10:18:16  
Well at one time farming was the most on safe job a person could have. Don't know if thats still true but I know its still up in the high 5 or so. Biggest problem with farming is you have one person out on a tractor away from any body else and when that person makes a miss take it can be his last miss take.



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2fordsmike

12-07-2005 19:46:25




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
Continuous running PTOs first became available for the '53 Jubilee and '54 NAA, but they are rare in these models. We had one in an NAA when such were new. These behind-the-transmission units or something very similar were also put into a few, very few, 8Ns. I learned of this 50 years after the fact. They are RARE. So if live or independent PTO is a requirement for your tractor needs, you need a 1955 or later Ford with such equipment. Such tractors likely will cost from around $3,500 to $5,000 and up and up. There are many alternatives, as you will learn if you stick with this tractor thing for a while. Mike-Iowa

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Grove

12-07-2005 19:46:13




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
FarmerDawn is right about the prices they range from location, condition, and the desire to have it. N's can be found for sale on the left under classified ads or ebay.

Take a look at The Smith's web page and click the FAQ tab for info on prices/ tips for buying.



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B. Jones

12-07-2005 19:45:04




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
Dear Rick,

There is No live pto for the 8N ford. Zane does make a kit that will give it live hydraulics but no live pto. The best you can do is to buy an over running clutch but that is still not live pto. To really get it you need to buy a 861 or an 860. The hundred series tractors with a 6 as the middle number do have live pto. I own a 971-Diesel which is a select-o-speed and all of them were also live pto. I hope this helps some. B. Jones

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KCM

12-07-2005 19:44:23




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
The 8N never had a live PTO from the factory, or live hydraulics for that matter. Sherman made an aftermarket kit that put a clutch between the transmission and rear end to act as a psuedo live PTO, but these are rare. The Jubilee/NAA from 1953 to 1954 did not have a live PTO, but did have live hydraulics. Again, Sherman made a kit for those tractors too, and again they are rare. It wasn't until 1955 (100 series) that Ford came out with a factory live PTO, and then in only certain models with the 5-speed transmission. Later, in 1958 the live PTO was added to Select-O-Speed models.

Basically there is no way to make the 8N live at the PTO. People sell couplers that fit on the PTO shaft that they say make it live, but this is not true as these couplers are only one-way clutches that prevent implements from driving the tractor through the PTO shaft, a dangerous situation especially with a whirlybird mower that has a lot of momentum. These couplers are a necessity with these types of mowers. There is a guy out there that sells a live hydraulic kit, though.

Check out the link below, and the site www.8nford.com, for more information to help you make a decision.

As far as price goes, that varies by location and condition. I would say they would run from $1500 for a tractor in running condition but a bit rough, to $4000 for a restored show quality example. Best to shop around and check prices in your part of the country before buying.

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FarmerDawn

12-08-2005 06:25:20




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to KCM, 12-07-2005 19:44:23  
Great resource! Thank you for posting the link!



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Mr Bill No. Mn.

12-07-2005 19:40:03




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
Dawn nailed it pretty well on the head. No live pto on an 8n and can"t make it that way. The Zane Thang is for live hydrolics?. Cost wise like Dawn says depends on where you are.-Bill



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6N's Short

12-07-2005 19:29:38




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
I'm pretty sure if you talk to Zane that he has a "THANG" that converts to live PTO. Hang around a while, someone will post it for you.



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FarmerDawn

12-07-2005 19:22:28




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:12:02  
Seeing as how it's late enough the Eastern fella's are probably all off-line, I'll take a stab at this. I'll warn you, though, that I am . . . er . . . known to be wrong. From time to time. :-) But I think that unless it's been seriously modified, an 8N does not have a live PTO. I think you have to "step up" to a Jubilee (NAA) for that. I won't hazard a guess on cost, though, because so much depends on where it is and what kind of shape it's in, and whether or not it's been modified to 12-v or a Sherman transmission, stuff like that. I'll let the others wing that one. Or, possibly, also correct the misinformation I might have accidentally given you. (But hey, at least you got an answer right away. When you're a newcomer, that can be nice.) Good luck on getting a nice one!!

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ricko700

12-07-2005 19:45:42




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to FarmerDawn, 12-07-2005 19:22:28  
so does the pto stop when the clutch is pushed in or when the buggy quits moving forward?? and does it work in reverse?



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Dell (WA)

12-07-2005 21:58:41




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:45:42  
Ricko..... ...Dawn's given you some good answers and I admire her attempts (grin)

But to answer your question, the "cute" flathead engined 8N does NOT HAVE "live PTO", which means everytime yer clodhoppers clomp down on the clutch pedal, yer splined PTO stops turning. And since yer internal hydraulic pump is run by the same splined PTO shaft, the hydraulic pump stops pumping.

Our friend "Zane", sells a "live-thang" front fanbelt operated hydraulic pump that is "plumbed" back into the corner hydraulic pressure test port. This means as long as yer engine is runnin', you'll have hydraulic's to lift your 3-point arms, no matter what yer clodhoppers doing.

As a general rule, while BOTH LIVE PTO and LIVE hydraulics are nice bell's and whistle's; you can learn to live without them; many have and do..... ...respectfully, Dell

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FarmerDawn

12-08-2005 06:39:48




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 And THANKS! in reply to Dell (WA), 12-07-2005 21:58:41  
I have to say, that brief explanation of how the clutch and PTO connect is the first one I've read that I understand. THANK YOU for posting it! I've saved it, as up until now the PTO function, especially as related to the drive train and so on, has remained a complete mystery to me. --Dawn



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FarmerDawn

12-08-2005 06:32:15




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to Dell (WA), 12-07-2005 21:58:41  
Cute? Arthur is in a huff. :-) Handsome!! (grin)
plus Strong. Noble. Cooperative. Friendly. Reliable. and Humble. (Hey, the N's replaced the mule with a minimum of bells and whistles. Isn't that "humble"?) :-)



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FarmerDawn

12-07-2005 19:48:44




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:45:42  
Uhhhh . . . well, you've hit the end of the rope on what I know with that one. Sorry about that!



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ricko700

12-07-2005 19:41:59




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to FarmerDawn, 12-07-2005 19:22:28  
Thanks neighbor...I think...Im in Lewisville, Tx...I know the jubilee does but I have a chance to buy an 8n for 1500-2000 with a box blade and shredder in Okieland (where my 40 acres is)and need to get up to see it. supposed to run "reeeely gute!!"



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FarmerDawn

12-07-2005 19:46:51




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 Re: Ford 8N in reply to ricko700, 12-07-2005 19:41:59  
That sounds like a GREAT price, with those implements especially!! I used to live in TX but now I am way up in extreme NW Nebraska (10 miles from WY & 20 from SD). So I used to be sort of a neighbor to you! :-) Gosh, I hope that 8N works out for you. It sounds like an absolute peach!



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