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Ford 9N, 2N & 8N Discussion Forum
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Hard Cranking 2N

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Arthur Ahrens

12-09-2005 13:39:05




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Hello Everyone,

I am the proud owner of a 1943 2N that is supposed to have just three hours on a new rebuild. I have had this tractor for a month, but only have had it running twice. When it runs, it is a strong runner. However, oil pressure is not what I believe it should be-- it is only 20 psi when cold, and 15 when hot. I have not had a chance to troubleshoot this. It has a brand new starter, generator, resistor for the coil, braided ground cable, and wires from the battery to the starter switch, and from the switch to the battery. These are NOT the thick gauge wires. Back to the starting. Symptoms: With a fully charged battery, will spin and start almost immediately. HOWEVER, if I shut down and try to restart (after a couple of minutes of running) , she cranks real slow, and I need to recharge the battery. If I remove the spark plugs, the engine spins fine.
When I replace the plugs, she spins slow.

Any ideas?

Thanks,
Arthur

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don b

12-10-2005 06:22:42




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 Re: Hard Cranking 2N in reply to Arthur Ahrens, 12-09-2005 13:39:05  
What the other posts say and.....sounds like maybe the starter is pulling too many amps and that makes the battery real low and will not have enough amps for the second start.Might want to get both the battery and starter checked. don b



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duey

12-09-2005 19:35:59




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 Re: Hard Cranking 2N in reply to Arthur Ahrens, 12-09-2005 13:39:05  
AA: What *I* would do is break out the old voltmeter. 1. Measure the battery voltage at rest with the key off. 2. Measure the battery voltage as you try to crank the starter... it will vary some but get an idea anyway.
3. Measure the voltage at the starter POST as you are cranking.
4. You could also read the voltage drop (if any), between the battery "hot" post and the starter post, and likewise on the ground side.

Use the battery ground post when reading at the battery, use the starter housing when reading at the starter. Post your results and you will get advice.

I think that is what a technician would check if he were standing at the tractor trying to diagnose the problem. If you find even a one volt loss on a 6 volt system, that's too much and will cost you performance. (Wouldn't matter if the loss was on the ground side or the hot side, still loss).

duey

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John (TR)

12-09-2005 19:35:09




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 Re: Hard Cranking 2N in reply to Arthur Ahrens, 12-09-2005 13:39:05  
Hey, I have a 43 also, not many of them out there!



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Rob

12-09-2005 16:03:46




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 Re: Hard Cranking 2N in reply to Arthur Ahrens, 12-09-2005 13:39:05  
The push-button starter switch doesn"t need a "thick gauge wire" or cable. That wire is 18ga. Not sure what your getting at here: "wires from the battery to the starter switch, and from the switch to the battery. These are NOT the thick gauge wires."
There should be a 10-1/2" 1ga cable from the battery to the starter solenoid (relay). 12" is fine and available at most any auto parts or farm/ranch store. The proper 12" cable will be sold for use on 6v vehicles and will be the proper gauge for the length. Those shorter lengths will be 1ga. I"ve used a 14" cable because that"s all they had and that works fine too. Key is to get the cable for use on a 6v vehicle. If it"s sold for use on a 12v vehicle it will be a too small diameter. That braided cable is fine for a ground if it is sold for use on 6v vehicle which it probably was. You want that short too. 12" is fine but the original was like 7" on some of those tractors. If you don"t have a cable running from the battery to the solenoid that might explain why it takes everything out of the battery to start the engine. A small enough wire would discolor and melt the insulation off. Quick test of cables, wires, and terminals is to feel of them. If they are too small or otherwise bad they get way warm or even hot-hot. A good one will stay normal temperature.
You may have a bad battery that can"t hold a charge. You need to feel around next time you start it and again when it only cranks real slow. Keep cranking, even if slow, until you find a hot spot or until it just won"t crank anymore. If the cables and wires don"t get hot and are ok then get the battery load tested. Could be the starter but I don"t think so. Does it get uncomfortable hot?

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souNdguy

12-09-2005 21:14:08




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 Re: Hard Cranking 2N in reply to Rob, 12-09-2005 16:03:46  
Rob.. on a 2n.. there will be no 18 gauge wire for a starter switch.. remember.. its the mechanical jiggle stick operated switch.. using 2 pieces of heavy gauge 1/0 wire.... not the little grounding thumb switch like the 8n uses.

To the original poster.. I'd replace the battery cables with correct thick ones.. and then repolarize that genny cutout relay, and do a meter test and see if you are charging.. replace battery IF it turns out to be bad...

Soundguy

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Rob

12-10-2005 03:16:31




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 Re: Hard Cranking 2N in reply to souNdguy, 12-09-2005 21:14:08  
You"re absolutely right. Here I was fussing with 8N electrical parts stuff all day and then started talking early model and didn"t get my mind quite moved all the way around. Funny thing is, I even looked at the picture. Oh well, long day.



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souNdguy

12-10-2005 20:42:18




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 Re: Hard Cranking 2N in reply to Rob, 12-10-2005 03:16:31  
i know what you mean. i've been having those long days myself lately.. more often too.

have a good one.

Soundguy



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Jim.UT

12-09-2005 15:41:04




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 Re: Hard Cranking 2N in reply to Arthur Ahrens, 12-09-2005 13:39:05  
What jerrycpp said, plus:

We who have grown up with 12V cars and trucks have a different idea about how fast an engine should spin at startup. A 6V system is going to spin slower than you are used to, but will always start if the cables are the right size and the connections are "clean, bright and tight".



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jerrycpp

12-09-2005 13:44:16




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 Re: Hard Cranking 2N in reply to Arthur Ahrens, 12-09-2005 13:39:05  
A freshly rebuilt engine is ususally tight, but the oil pressure sounds a bit low. You might want to check it with another guage. As far as battery cables, 6 volt MUST have the "0" or "1" guage (large diameter) cables. The smaller 12 volt cables can't carry enough current when the starter demands it for a hard start. When you warm up the engine, everything expands, and thus is more difficult to turn over. Change the cables and try it.

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