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Ford 9N, 2N & 8N Discussion Forum
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engine block question

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Older

03-07-2006 07:23:28




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I have a chance to buy a (repaired - stitched) block for under $300, ready for rebuilding. It is a front mount block. The owner told me that it was his understanding that the only differences in the two (besides serno prefix) are the cam and front covers. I have read on this forum that there are other differences, like casting bosses for the generator mounts etc. Can anyone tell me the REAL story, please :-)

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Older

03-07-2006 08:43:13




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 Re: engine block question in reply to Older, 03-07-2006 07:23:28  
Dell, Thanks for the quick reply. The bosses I was referring to are the ones cast into the block that the brackets for the two different genny locations are bolted up to. Since the side mount genny is on the left side there are, I am told, a couple of bosses (tapped) for the brackets on that side that supposedly are not on the earlier engines. If this is so, it would make it pretty hard to fabricate a proper bracket to mount a genny on a 9N block converted to 8N side mount configuration. I'm so confused :-)!!!! And if you don't know for sure, does anyone?? Older, you self-confessed very confused older 8N (mutt - 48 8N with 52 engine) owner.

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John Smith8N

03-07-2006 10:17:19




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 Re: engine block question in reply to Older, 03-07-2006 08:43:13  
You're correct, the bosses to mount the generator on the left side for the sidemount are not there on the front distributor block. There's no place to mount the generator bracket. The sidemount block also has the oil filler tube moved about 3 inches to the rear for clearance for the generator. A sidemount block will replace a front mount but not vice-versa. You need a side mount block for yours.

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Gaspump

03-07-2006 08:42:42




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 Re: engine block question in reply to Older, 03-07-2006 07:23:28  
My question is why by a stiched repaired bare block for under $300, it would have to be about $275 under that before I would even look at it! You are correct, there is a mounting boss on the side mount block for the generator, oil filter bosses on the heads are different too. Yes the cam and front covers are totally different too. I would look for better block package than that one!



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Older

03-07-2006 09:04:44




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 Re: engine block question in reply to Gaspump, 03-07-2006 08:42:42  
Gaspump, can you tell me where I can get a good (no repairs) sidemount block. If it is reasonable and not too far from Littleton NC I would buy it. The engine in my mutt has what looks like a painted over JB weld repair and an unrepaired crack between the two freeze plugs on the left side of the block. I am leary of it and would like to replace it even though the thing runs pretty well. Older

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Older

03-07-2006 10:25:43




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 Re: engine block question in reply to Gaspump, 03-07-2006 09:51:27  
Thanks to all for your quick and knowledgeable replies. You confirmed my suspicians and saved me from what might have been an expensive mistake. Anyone here have a good side mount block cheap? What Gaspump said about not rushing into replacing my current patched up and cracked block is good advice but I just hate to see coolant seeping out of cracks and big ugly gobs of JB Weld on my old work horse.

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Dell (WA)

03-07-2006 08:26:19




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 Re: engine block question in reply to Older, 03-07-2006 07:23:28  
Older..... ....yer friend is correct, the frontmount camshaft is different from the sidemount camshaft. It has to do with the drive distributor drive schemes. Frontmount distributor is driven by an camshaft end "OFF-SET" slot scheme. Sidemount distributor is driven by drive gear on camshaft.

As for "bosses" to mount gennys, thats a new one. The frontmount genny is on the engine rightside and held on by a bracket, not a "boss". The sidemount genny is on the engine leftside and is held on by a bracket, not a boss.

The only things that I can think of that might confuse you is the flathead. The original 1939 flathead had a compression ratio of 6.0:1, and the latest replacement flatheads have compression ratio of 6.5:1. Which accounts for the change from 23hp to 26hp.

Then there is the item of replaceable dry "sleeves". The original sleeves were 0.060 sheetmetal. The BETTER sleeves are 0.090 CASTIRON. You haffta rebore the block to accept the thicker castiron sleeve. They found out that castiron actually had better wear characteristics than hard sheetmetal sleeves. You look at the end of the sleeve from the crankshaft. Even fuzzy eyeballs can usually tell the difference between 1/16" and 1/8". You can NOT tell the difference in sleeves from the top of the block as they both have "lips".

One last change, it the governor cup. The only governor cup is the proofmeter drive cup which works just fine when plugged.

One last note: early 9N engines oilfilter return drained straight down to engine block. They changed the oil return to the governors cup with a longer tube around the front of the engine. This was because governor balls were getting flatspots from insufficent splash oil from engine drive gears.

As I said, most engine changes are intuitively obvious..... ..respectfully, Dell, NOT an expert

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Dan

03-07-2006 11:03:52




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 Re: engine block question in reply to Dell (WA), 03-07-2006 08:26:19  
Dell - you write "The original sleeves were 0.060 sheetmetal.", I'm sure you know the original sleeves were 0.040" thick - just don't want to confuse the newer guys here.

Dan



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uh . . . Dell (WA)

03-07-2006 11:44:49




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 Re: engine block question in reply to Dan, 03-07-2006 11:03:52  
Dan..... ..yer right, 0.040" sheetmetal sleeve, brainf*rt, sorry. Like I said, even fuzzy eyeballs should beable to guess thin (0.040) or thicker (0.090)..... ..Dell



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ButtonRock

03-07-2006 23:34:08




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 Re: engine block question in reply to uh . . . Dell (WA), 03-07-2006 11:44:49  
Years ago when building our barn a neighbor brought over his JD crawler loader. Let it sit overnight and the temp went down to 20. He had nothing but water in it and the block cracked a 18 inch crack down alongside the block. At one point water would flow out like a faucet. The neighbor put 10 bottles of that flaky silver radiator sealer into the rad and gobbed it up on the outside with jb weld. The machine is still running today. If I didn't see it myself I would have never believed it. You know your engine is trashed so why not run it until it runs no more. JB gobbs or no it may out last all of us. Enjoy the day
Peter

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