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Ford 9N, 2N & 8N Discussion Forum
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rrs26ja

04-08-2006 09:12:58




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My 9N has no spark. I have disconnected every wire on the tractor and ran a wire from the battery to the coil. I get 12V at the top of the coil. I have replaced the coil, points, condensor, rotor and cap. The funny thing is I always measure 12v at the top of the coil. I would think that when the points close, I should measure zero volts. So I take the distributor out thinking the points are not closing. I measure an open when the points are open and a short when the points are closed. I am taking this measurement between the screw that the coil touches and the breaker plate. The points are set to .015 gap. I am really lost. Can someone please help me..... .

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Wood chuck

04-09-2006 04:14:47




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 Re: Help in reply to rrs26ja, 04-08-2006 09:12:58  
I agree with alot of the other comments,make sure your coil contacts that brass screw,make sure your points are not pitted or dirty check your distribtor cap for cracks and also where the rotor makes contact also make sure your rotor is in good shape and clean off anything stuck where contact is required. Make sure the points are opening and closing properly. good luck



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Dell (WA)

04-08-2006 09:24:42




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 Re: Help in reply to rrs26ja, 04-08-2006 09:12:58  
you write..... .."The funny thing is I always measure 12v at the top of the coil. I would think that when the points close, I should measure zero volts"..... ...that is exactly what you should read on an OPEN CIRCUIT.

you write..... ...I am taking this measurement between the screw that the coil touches and the breaker plate"..... ..that is good as it should be. It ain't shorted out.

It just means that the danglin' springy-thingy underneath yer squarecan ignition coil it NOT making contact and needs to be gently stretched so it makes contact with the ignition points screw..... ..Dell, yer sell-appointed sparkie-meister

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rrs26ja

04-08-2006 09:52:40




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 Re: Help in reply to Dell (WA), 04-08-2006 09:24:42  
Dell, That's what I thought, I did stretch the spring, when I had the distributor off I sat the coil on top of it, and it was making contact to the screw....

I thought if the points are closed, the coil shorts to ground and the voltage at the coil should read zero?



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Bob

04-08-2006 10:21:09




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 Re: Help in reply to rrs26ja, 04-08-2006 09:52:40  
You have a "12-Volt" coil, right?

Even with that, you should be using a resistor to keep it cool and comfortable!

With 12-Volts jumpered direct to the terminal at the top of the coil, the voltage there is gonna read 12-Volts, no matter what!

It is the OTHER end of the coil primary, the "infamous" spring thingy that will alternate between grounded and battery voltage, as the points open and close.

The "spring thingy" needs to make good contact with the special brass screw beneath it. From there to the breaker points is a flat copper strip that often cracks and breaks. Have you checked that?

You need continuity from the coiled spring all the way to the moveable breaker point arm, though the points themselves (when closed), to the breaker plate, and to the distributor housing.

On the other hand, you may have a SHORT somwhere in the breaker plate area that will have the same effect as points that never open, or a shorted condensor.

Make sure the snap ring that holds the breaker plate is not touching insulated parts!

OR... you may simply have points with a film on them that prevents good contact.

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Dell (WA)

04-08-2006 10:14:20




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 Re: Help in reply to rrs26ja, 04-08-2006 09:52:40  
depends..... ..volts at the top of the 1-terminal squarecan ignition coil will ALWAYS read sumptin' depending upon point open (always battery volts) or points closed will be part of a series resistance circuit. Kierchhoff's Law still rules.

The typical 6-volt squarecan ignition coil with "infamous ballast resistor" with points CLOSED will read about 3-volts. (2.5v min) Points open, about 6.3 volts.

And depending upon yer 12-volt conversion, (points closed) you may about 11.5v, (9.5v min) or 3.5v (2.5v min).

And while it is "rare", there is always the possiblity that yer current ignition coil is internally "open". A simle ohm-meter test between the coil top termial to both of the coil bottom terminal should read continuity. To the springy-thingy about 3-ohms, and to the coil secondary tab, about 7000-ohms..... ...Dell

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rrs26ja

04-08-2006 10:47:56




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 Re: Help in reply to Dell (WA), 04-08-2006 10:14:20  
Well the coil seems good, it reads 3.2 ohms and 8.2k ohms. It should, I just bought it. The points are closing and I should be making good contact with the brass screw. I get nothing. Man I am getting tired of putting the distributor in an out. I was thinking of purchasing a new breaker plate from Ebay. $49.00. The dealer wants $110.00. Any other tests I can do? How about I put everything back together but not hook up the 12v to the top of the coil. What resistance reading should I get between the top of the coil and ground if when the points open and when the points close. Wouldn't this be a way of ensuring the springy thing is touching the brass screw. Shouldn't I get the same 3.2 ohms?

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Bob

04-08-2006 11:01:24




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 Re: Help in reply to rrs26ja, 04-08-2006 10:47:56  
Yes, you will see the resistance of the coil primary between the top terminal and ground, with the points closed.

No need to buy anything... you can figure this out!

3.2 Ohms sounds a bit high, although I haven't checked a "12-Volt square can coil in quite a while. Have you verified your meter "zeros" buy taking a reading with the leads touched together?

Safely clamp the distributor in a vice, and hook up a battery to it. You can troubleshoot it there, and get it working before you reinstall it.

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rrs26ja

04-09-2006 04:11:06




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 Re: Help in reply to Bob, 04-08-2006 11:01:24  
Bob, Not sure what you mean by clamp the distributor in a vise and use a battery to check out the distributor. Could you please provide more detail..... .Thanks for your help



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rrs26ja

04-08-2006 20:07:56




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 Re: Help in reply to Bob, 04-08-2006 11:01:24  
Bob, Not sure what you mean by clamp the distributor in a vise and use a battery to check out the distributor. Could you please provide more detail..... .Thanks for your help



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Bob

04-08-2006 21:08:13




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 Re: Help in reply to rrs26ja, 04-08-2006 20:07:56  
I was suggesting lightly clamping the distributor in a bench vise, and the powering it up with a battery, to see if it will spark, instead of repeatedly taking it on and off the tractor while you're working on it.

You could troubleshoot it with the cap off.

Warning... when you DO get spark, it will jump from the flat tab at the lower front of the coil that would contact the distributor cap, if it were installed. You could have a ground wire clamped near that tab for the spark to jump to.

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Phil (NJ,AZ,Sask)

04-08-2006 15:05:06




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 Re: Help in reply to Bob, 04-08-2006 11:01:24  
[quote]I have disconnected every wire on the tractor and ran a wire from the battery to the coil. I get 12V at the top of the coil.[/quote]

You have the battery connected directly to the top of the coil and your measured voltage will always be 12 Volts regardless of points open or closed. You are measuring the battery, not the coil.

The way to Test is to place a Known resistor ~ 1.0 Ohm in series with the wire to the coil and then the voltages will divide when the points close. With a 3.2 ohm coil & test resister (1.0)
with points closed your coil will measure ~ 9.0V
and Resister ~ 3 Volts

Its also very important that ZERO current flows when the points are open (no shorts in Dist). I would measure "across" the coil.. or the test Resistor. Points open = absolute Zero Voltage.

Hope This Helps,

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