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Clutch adjustment (different question)

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SCgoatfarmer

05-04-2006 11:19:30




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Last week, I believe OldHokie or old wrote back how to check to make sure the clutch was put back together right by putting in gear, raising tires, and spinning with clucth depressed.

I jacked up entire back end. while raised and in gear with clutch not depressed one tire would spin one way and the other the other way. Out of gear same thing. In gear with clutch pressed down, same thing.

Is this because my clutch is not adjusted right or is this an indication that the clutch is somehow not back together right.

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old

05-04-2006 12:03:46




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 Re: Clutch adjustment (different question) in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 05-04-2006 11:19:30  
To test your clutch like your tring to do you jack up ONLY ONE WHEEL, not both. Then you put it in gear and push down the clutch pedel and try to spin the wheel. It should spin but you will feel a little resistance from the gears etc. If you can't spin the wheel watch the engine and see if it tries to turn at the same time. If it does you probably have a problem with the way you put it back togeather.

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TheOldHokie

05-04-2006 11:46:41




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 Re: Clutch adjustment (different question) in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 05-04-2006 11:19:30  
Wasn't me and as other's have said this behavior is normal.

TOH



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FarmerDawn

05-04-2006 13:17:04




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 wait wait wait... in reply to TheOldHokie, 05-04-2006 11:46:41  
This is NORMAL!?! That one back tire spins one way and the other back tire spins the other way? I don't understand that. I see in the FO-4 (just now) that there isn't a single "rear axle" as such, that the rear wheels are attached independently to the differential. (Right?) But why would they spin in opposite directions if they roll the same way on the ground when you move? (I am not saying I don't believe you, because I do. You know this stuff and I don't. I just want to understand it because it's amazing and unexpected and tells me there is something major here I don't have a CLUE about!!!) --Dawn

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RockyMO

05-04-2006 18:29:19




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to FarmerDawn, 05-04-2006 13:17:04  
It works that way because with out a load the differential rotates around the spider gears instead of rotating the ring gear. This is normal.

RockyMO



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FarmerDawn

05-04-2006 18:37:43




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to RockyMO, 05-04-2006 18:29:19  
Aha! Thank you! I will look up the spider gears and ring gear!! ("Spider gears" sounds NEAT!) --Dawn



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old

05-04-2006 17:12:55




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to FarmerDawn, 05-04-2006 13:17:04  
Dawn, have you ever got a car or truck stuck in the mud or snow?? Well if you have did you ever notice that one tire would spin like He)) and the other one just sat there and didn't do any thing. Well a diff. is set up that way so when you go around corners etc that one tire can spin faster then the other. Other wise when going around a corner one tire would squel like when you spin out on pavement. Hope that explains it a little better. Or you can look in that army manual and I'm sure it will explain it even better and how things work LOL

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FarmerDawn

05-04-2006 17:45:19




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to old, 05-04-2006 17:12:55  
So on a tractor, it's like a car with standard (non-slip) rear wheel drive? Only ONE of the wheels actually turns to drive the tractor and the other one just rolls along????



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old

05-04-2006 18:10:54




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to FarmerDawn, 05-04-2006 17:45:19  
Well yes, no and sort of. When going in a stright line both wheels are pulling till one looses traction then it will spin and the other one will try to stop turning. Thats one reason why tractors have brakes the can be controled for each wheel. If one wheel starts to spin you apply the brake on the side and the other one starts pulling more and if all works right you keep going.

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FarmerDawn

05-04-2006 18:16:26




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to old, 05-04-2006 18:10:54  
So is it more comparable to a limited-slip rear axle, like what's on my Ranger truck? Or is something else entirely? Or . . . ?



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old

05-04-2006 18:46:37




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to FarmerDawn, 05-04-2006 18:16:26  
No its like a normall car or truck rear end but, and heres where people get things wrong. On a car or truck both tires pull as long as both have even amounts of traction. Its a false hood that only one side pulls because it that where ture you would always have to hold the steering wheel harder to one side or the other to keep it going stright.

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TheOldHokie

05-04-2006 17:01:35




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to FarmerDawn, 05-04-2006 13:17:04  
Wizardry ;-) It's a side effect of how the differential works and it only happens when both wheels are free to spin without load. I can't explain it but it's a fact you will observe on any vehicle with a conventional automotive differential. Grab one and it will stop - there's no real power being transmitted from one to the other.

TOH



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FarmerDawn

05-04-2006 17:47:23




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to TheOldHokie, 05-04-2006 17:01:35  
Well you just KNOW now what I have to do the next time a mechanic has my truck up on a rack, don't you!? :-)

If, during the process of restoring Arthur, I was to take apart the differential and play with it, would I be able to see why this happens? Is it that kind of "move it with your hands" mechanical thing you can figure out in that situation?



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Stickler

05-04-2006 21:55:00




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to FarmerDawn, 05-04-2006 17:47:23  
It is. When it's opened up, it is plain as day. The transmission turns the pinion gear, which turns the ring gear. That turns the carrier. there are spider gears attached to the carrier. They are in contact with the side gears which are attached to each axle. When you're going straight, the spider gears just keep the side gears turning together, but when you turn or when one wheel loses traction, the spiders move, allowing the side gears to turn at different speeds. if the differential wasn't there it would bwe very difficult to turn. ever ride an old ATC trike? They had no differential, and the best way to ride them is to lean in the turns so one rear wheel is off the ground. Otherwise you tear the splines out of the hubs pretty quick.

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FarmerDawn

05-05-2006 03:39:33




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to Stickler, 05-04-2006 21:55:00  
Thank you, Stickler! I don't understand this yet (I freely confess) but I am going to save it and study the manual and then at some point take it apart when I restore that part and figure it out. This is fascinating! Thank you again! --Dawn



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DavidO

05-05-2006 05:20:10




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to FarmerDawn, 05-05-2006 03:39:33  
Dawn,
One other little tidbit: If you are buying a vehicle (say a pick-up truck or a high performance Camero or Mustang) and the seller tells you that it has a Limited Slip (LS) rear end, you can check by jacking up under the differential to get both wheels off the ground. If turning one wheel makes them both turn in the same direction, it is LS. If one turns in one direction and the other turns in the opposite direction, it is NOT LS (Or if it is, the clutches are totally worn out). You can also count the number of turns the driveshaft makes for each full circle of the wheel and determine the gear ratio. i.e. 350, 411, 456, etc.

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FarmerDawn

05-05-2006 05:26:27




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 Re: wait wait wait... in reply to DavidO, 05-05-2006 05:20:10  
Oh wow!!! Very cool!!!

Thanks for the additional inforamtion. I had no idea about ANY of this before this discussion! What a great thread!!



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Bob

05-04-2006 11:23:13




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 Re: Clutch adjustment (different question) in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 05-04-2006 11:19:30  
No, it's because your tractor's differential is working!



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OH Boy

05-04-2006 11:23:05




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 Re: Clutch adjustment (different question) in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 05-04-2006 11:19:30  
What you are describing is completely normal. I think what they were telling you to do last week was just jack up one wheel, not both.



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