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Ford 9N, 2N & 8N Discussion Forum

Take all advise with a grain of salt

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Josh498n

05-25-2006 16:13:26

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After being told it's not "Chur carb" I know have wasted over $40 bucks on a coil, ign switch , points and condenser only to find out that it was a "DIRTY CARB", a simple cleanig by a friend "FIXED" all my running problems, I just mowed for 3 hours and my 8n didn't miss a beat.
Oh well, live and learn.

Josh

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Idahojan

05-27-2006 09:40:48

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Hi Dan,

Have to disagree on the "advise is worth what you pay for it" comment, seen to many "consultants" who charge $1500+ a day, not even know what they're jabberin' about.

And yet for the most part, me the idiot backyard mechanic, has been able to work on my 9N, 2N and my Oliver ONLY because of the awesome advise dished for free here.

Hmmm, by my calcs, free advise is good...ya, run it through a filter to refine to the REALLY good stuff...but that would just be common sense...

Y'all are great!

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Dachshund

05-27-2006 05:47:28

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

I have found that there is good and bad advice given on this board and others, sometimes what works on one machine won't work on others. Sometimes, the education level, or paperwork a person possesses, does not equate to knowledge. I just tend to skip over replies from people on that list.

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Colin King

05-26-2006 09:06:30

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Dear Josh,

My college education put me back $120k, and I darned well know that my professors were not always right. After graduation, I didn"t go back and "rip em a new one" "cause I found an example where their interpretation of Socrates was "wrong."

This here is tractor college, and it costs what you make it cost. If you fail to study for the exam, you fail the test, my friend. The professors here are some of the best I"ve ever met, and they give generously, with humor and respect. But the onus is on you to ask intelligent questions and provide as much information so that your professors can respond with their vast amount of knowledge.

I hope you have fun with your tractor this summer!

Colin, MN

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Chad OH

05-26-2006 12:01:02

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Colin King, 05-26-2006 09:06:30

Nicely put Colin.
Good advice.

Have a great holiday weekend.

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monomechanical

05-26-2006 09:37:51

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Whaddya mean by Socractes? (slightly off topic) in reply to Colin King, 05-26-2006 09:06:30

Colin: Good point, but remember, interpretations of Socrates depend on what you mean by "Socrates." Do you mean the historical Athenian philosopher, teacher of Plato and Xenophon, the ethical dialectian? Or do you mean the dialogical creation of Plato, interested in metaphysics and epistemology? In Dell's dialect, Ya cain't just go throwin names around on this here forum, unless yer reel specific!

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dan hill

05-26-2006 15:25:04

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Re: Whaddya mean by Socractes? (slightly off topi in reply to monomechanical, 05-26-2006 09:37:51

This wont start your tractor.

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monomechanical

05-26-2006 15:46:12

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Re: Whaddya mean by Socractes? (slightly off topi in reply to dan hill, 05-26-2006 15:25:04

Indeed: it's O.T. If you're having trouble starting your tractor, clean yur carb.

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Colin King

05-26-2006 10:13:58

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Re: Whaddya mean by Socractes? (slightly off topi in reply to monomechanical, 05-26-2006 09:37:51

Haha, well spoken Monomechanical. It could be an either or situation, couldn't it? Very little historical information is available on Socrates, so gaps have to be filled. Thus interpretation plays a large role. Much of what we know of Socrates is from Plato. As you point out, Plato was using Socrates as an illustrative character in his dialogs, and that too leaves much open to interpretation on many levels (literary, historical, socio-political, etc). But yes, I did indeed intend Socrates to be read as Plato's character "Socrates." ;-)

Thanks for keeping me on the straight and narrow.

Colin

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redbanksdog

05-26-2006 07:30:04

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

I have been looking at this board for about three years it is one of the best.Any advice I see that I might need down the road,I print out and stick it in with my FO-4 Manual.All of yall keep up the great advice. Yall have a nice day

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WV8N

05-26-2006 07:01:53

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Can't beleive you would criticize anyone on this board. This is the greatest forum I have ever been associated with. Not only for tractors but any other isssue we may have. Anytime I need help or advise ( other than marriage counseling) this is the go to place. The info you got was correct based on the information you gave out. Some people don't appreciate anything. Be sure to shut the door when you leave.

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David in Mo

05-26-2006 05:59:36

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Truth is, for any complex machine, like a car or tractor, the weak link is going to be the electrical system. I was taught this in several Engineering Schools for mutliple graduate degrees and in route to earn my Aircraft Mechanics (A & P)license. So the advise you received was correct.

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Chad OH

05-26-2006 05:16:47

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Hope the beginning post doesn't discourage anyone from helping us out in the future!
Keep the advice coming, you guys have certainly saved me from extended down time!

Plus some are great humor, I'm particularly fond of any reply that begins with the name 'uh...Dell (WA).' They can usually apply to one of my rookie 8N questions :0)

Thanks again to all who post here for your wisdom and support.

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8N'r

05-26-2006 05:15:41

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

I will take all the advise I can get---if it wasn't for all this info that is freely given, freely stored in the archives, and openly cussed and discussed on this board, I am sure I would have ended up with my N tractor being something less than what I expected---and probably a big disappointment instead of one of my "prize" possessions. Keep the info coming guys and gals---my folders are only "half full"----Tim

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Ron/PA

05-26-2006 04:08:55

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I'm amazed in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

I just went back and looked at your original post, and here's what I see. You posted a problem, gave little or no information, asked about testing the coil, and rebuilding the carb. It appears that rather than doing the diagnostic run time and spark tests, which would have answered your questions, you chose to throw money at it, replacing parts. Had you posted the results of those tests, you might have gotten a lot more precise advice. Eventually someone might have even told you to pull the plug on the carb. Since it appears a simple cleaning did the trick, I know that the process for that has been posted on here a bunch of times. You might have taken the initiative to search the archives for that info. Having spent my whole life actually working with these N's I still won't try to diagnose a problem long distance, and for those that do, I'm amazed at their accuracy, and the amount of information they dispense to keep repair costs to a minimum. Josh, I'm sure you'll live, but I have some serious doubts that you have or will learn.
Ron

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hvw

05-26-2006 03:40:53

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Yet another escapee from the John Deere board. Even the monkey won't touch this one.

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ozark mike

05-26-2006 01:59:00

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Josh, most all of the time that you ask for help you get many different veiws..some good , some not so....sometimes someone that has never seen a tractor before last week and bought one has become an overnight expert, in their mind..

now for the upside,,,there are a lot of people on here that know what they are talking about....i will name three Soundguy, Dell and Dan...now there are one .hell of a bunch more, time and text will not permit me to name all...

you most likely needed what you put in anyway, and if you didn't, save what you took out..
and as Dell said, you got by .damn cheap..
so lick your wounds and live with it....
you will get along alot better here if you lose the attitude..... .this is only advice, take it or take it with your grain of salt.....
"that is more than i've said in all the time you people have known me".....mike

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FarmerDawn

05-26-2006 04:59:24

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to ozark mike, 05-26-2006 01:59:00

"that is more than i've said in all the time you people have known me".....mike"

Nice to have you chime in, Mike!! :-)

Dawn

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uh . . . Dell (WA)

05-25-2006 22:24:43

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Josh..... ...wow, $40 for a $150 tune-up. Most tune-up mechanics wouldn't even know to replace the ignition switch. (a great source of unknown runtime issues, but we know) And you did-itt yerself. Congratulations.

Heres the deal, from years of experience, most running issues are NOT the carb. Yet thats the first thing neubies grab-fer them handy-dandy tweek'em screws on the side of the carb.

Now ask yer friend, what would have been his first thing to "fixx"? Given yer runtime issues? Bettcha ain't gonnna be clean yer carb first, that is ALWAYS the LAST thing a real engine tune-up mechanic touches. WHY? 'cuz he knows iff'n ignition ain't right, then all the carb twiddlin' ain't gonnna fixx the sparkies problem..... .....respectfully, Dell

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Boley

05-25-2006 22:10:30

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Pretty tacky comment Josh.I've found people here to be generous with their knowledge and time responding to questions to help others.Boley

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dave guest

05-25-2006 21:51:13

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Best mechanic I ever knew Jack Leeming would never attempt to diagnose anything in the 40 years I have known him by phone or mail. He said simply, "bring it over. Let me talk to your motor and then I tell you whats going on." Never saw one disappointed customer. Gotta get your hands dirty to learn tractors. You don't yell at yourself too hard either.

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souNdguy

05-25-2006 21:49:33

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Here is the 5th and 6th line from my reply to your message:

(Next time your engine quits, pull a plug wire (and check for spark.
(Might also help if you give us some basic (info..

Guess you didn't do this test then.. ??? nor did you follow up with the results of the test to get further help.

If you need some memory refreshing.. here is the full text of my message: ( amazingly, I evenmention that a carb kit may be all you need to get you going... how about that... and yet you complain about bad advice????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ??

The best shadtree mechanic for testing a coil, is to install it on a tractor with a good strong battery, clean connections, proper wireing, and good points, and then kick her over and see if the plugs fire.
Past that.. On the bench you can test continuity.. and not much more.

Next time your engine quits, pull a plug wire and check for spark.

Might also help if you give us some basic info.. most of our mind reading skills are either very weak, or exhausted from having to guess what tractor year, distribuitor type, and what electricl system people run, about 20 times a day.
Do you have a service manual? there is a nice exploded parts diagram in the FO-4 manual.. that and a 'full' tisco carb kit should get you going.. has everything but the float..

Soundguy

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souNdguy

05-25-2006 21:37:16

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

As others said...if you don't like the advice.. learn to fix your tractor yourself.

Also.. if you paid 40$ for the few parts you mentioned.. you got ripped.. bad. I can get those parts for 28$ from a store shelf, and a tad cheaper if i order them online or use 'similar' parts.

Lots of problems mimic others... carb isues can look like spark issues.. that's why you have to do some of your own diagnostics. If you pull your plug wire and have a brilliant blue snappy spark.. then you -KNOW- or -should know- that it is not your spark.. that leaves, fuel, air, and compression. You can guess compression with your thumb.. .. you can guess air with the palm of your hand.. what's that leave? fuel.. which comes thru what? your carb.

No rocket science here.. just takes common sense and a little hands on work.

None of us have the benefit of being able to touch your tractor and look at it... we rely on you to at least bring us your observations so that we can make suggestions. if your spark was good, you should have said so, when you got the advice to change out the coil..

Soundguy

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Dixon

05-25-2006 22:22:20

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to souNdguy, 05-25-2006 21:37:16

Hey sound guy it takes both sides of the page to write a book I'm on your side and to heck with the other.Keep up the good and honest work.

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souNdguy

05-26-2006 10:34:21

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Dixon, 05-25-2006 22:22:20

Since we are having to do long distance diagnostics, it is very helpfull for the other party to provide as much info as possible, especially the results from diagnostic tests.. and deffinately before new parts are purchased.

Soundguy

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Bryan in WI

05-25-2006 19:43:17

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

It is just advice, this isn't the Oracle at Delphi.

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chris cogburn

05-26-2006 07:55:14

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Bryan in WI, 05-25-2006 19:43:17

Leave it to some smarty-pants to throw in a Greek mythology reference. Bravo!

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Bob Harvey

05-25-2006 19:12:41

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Healthy attitude, not all advice is good. There is a quote by some guy (1600 A.D.) that the best advice , is that, that it is taken.....my brane hertz.

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OH Boy

05-25-2006 18:53:52

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Josh, the guys gave you good advice on what things to check, the problem is you didn't CHECK them before you started throwing parts at it without testing the old ones first.

You have to gain a better personal understanding of how the fuel system and ignition system (and their individual parts) work or you will never be able to diagnose these kinds of problems.

Forty bucks is a cheap lesson about that in my opinion. Not trying to beat you up, I have been there and done that too on occasion.

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GAJIM

05-25-2006 17:58:19

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

I've been a fairly regular participant of this board for about 2 years. I have brought problems to the board and received completely accurate diagnoses and advice to correct the problem. I've even been known to respond to other's issues. In everything I have ever read on this board, every response to a question or issue has been genuine and straight forward. Thanks to all who post on the board. My '52 8N would not be the same wothout you. GA Jim

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Ga Jack

05-25-2006 17:57:09

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Oh, by the way did your friend show YOU how to fix YOUR dirty carb the next time YOU have trouble with it? Good luck. jackie

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Ga Jack

05-25-2006 17:47:36

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Well, with all the new parts installed your tractor should be running fine for quite a while. Now aren't you glad you changed those items out?
Plus you have spares as backups. Good luck. jackie

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Mike S

05-25-2006 17:46:42

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Re: Take all advice with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Live and learn, indeed. We all do it and will continue to do it.

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monomechanical

05-25-2006 17:40:47

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Though you deny it, there is no reason for anyone to believe that the problem was not due to the items identified by others. Dead serious: why should we think it was not the items you say you wasted money purchasing? At any rate, forty bucks for all the items you list, is very inexpensive. You just eliminated a dozen future electrical problems by replacing the items on which you say you wasted your money.

("Advice" is spelled with a c.)

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we're not allowed...

05-25-2006 19:56:50

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to monomechanical, 05-25-2006 17:40:47

to make corrections about each others writing/spelling/punctuation habits. This place would be on the short road to perdition if we did.
Winston Churchill once admitted that in most of his personal letters he purposely mispelled a word or punctuated something incorrectly. He did it to put his reader at ease. He wanted them to be undaunted by their own writing skills or lack thereof. He wanted their return letters to be real. Such is the beauty of this little corner of nowhere. Where so often brilliance shows through the crudest literary skills. It took me a while too. To learn that it's about these tractors after all.
Of course, if they start mispelling your name and calling you Monomaniacal you'll have every reason to complain. grin
Jerry
aka Ultradog MN

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murn-ga

05-25-2006 17:25:02

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Josh, free advice is for you to consider that this could be the problem. Hard to correctly pin point the problem long distance, especialy with a few details. You have lived and learned and now you know you have to walk up to the batters box by yourself and you will never forget this lesson learned.

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Bruce (VA)

05-25-2006 17:09:33

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Interesting. "My 8N still quits after running awhile". Two folks asked for more info to help you find the problem, but do offer suggestions anyway. You don't respond, throw money at the problem, and now you complain about getting bad advice? Sorry, no sympathy here. Next time, just tell us if it is a 6v or 12v, front or side distributor, then describe exactly what it's doing. Telling the doctor you don't feel well really doesn't give him much to go on does it?

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here's the post you are t

05-25-2006 16:59:00

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Let the board decide

click

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Jerry/MT

05-25-2006 17:13:01

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to here's the post you are t, 05-25-2006 16:59:00

There were more posts than these on your problem because I wrote one up, as did several other folks and mine is not in this list. If I remember correctly you posted in several forums.

In my opinion, you got some good advise (to test and analyze the test results) and YOU choose to change parts, always an expensive proposition. Your money, your choice.

And there's nothing really to decide. Respectfully, in the real world if YOU don't like the service, YOU chose another provider. I'm sorry you feel like you got a bad deal, and I hope it doen't turn you away from these forums.

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Jerry/MT

05-25-2006 16:54:04

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt.....liste in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

We didn't tell you that it wasn't the carb. What we told you was to eliminate the other possibilities before you spent a lot of money. A simple check of the spark(fat, bluish spark) would have told you the ignition system was OK and not to put any money in it. Apparently you just changed it out ( "...wasted over $40...") instead of checking it and now your complaining about "bad advice".
Glad you have it running, though.

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ozak mike

05-26-2006 02:21:56

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt.....liste in reply to Jerry/MT, 05-25-2006 16:54:04

Jerry/MT,,,, in Joshs defence,, Dell (WA) 05-24-2006 09:53:45
172.194.166.21
552875

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Re: Testing coil in reply to Josh498n, 05-24-2006 04:00:16 "Josh..... ...you really don't give us enuff "clues" so we can help you as to why yer engine quits (hint: ainchur carb) 'cuz there are 4-common runtime issues with N-Engines."..... ....

so someone did tell him it wasn't his carb..mike

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Jerry/MT

05-26-2006 11:32:29

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt.....liste in reply to ozak mike, 05-26-2006 02:21:56

That may be true, but but if you review ALL the responses, especially the ones in other forums (he apparently "went shopping" for someone to tell him it was the carburetor), you'll find quite a few that recommended diagnostics first. I replied twice after he continued to insist it was his carb without performing any diagnotics. I told how to check the ignition system quickly to eliminate that as a problem.(the old "pull a plug wire.....").I'm not trying to make him out as a bad guy but a lot of us really try to help people out and it's irritating to have someone who doesn't even attempt to use the advice, complaining because he had a bad out come.

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Dan

05-25-2006 16:35:20

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Josh498n, 05-25-2006 16:13:26

Good advice! Just remember, advice is all worth the price you pay for it. However - I have found that most of the time the advice given here is dead on.

Live and learn indded.

Dan

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gahorN

05-26-2006 23:09:43

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Re: Take all advise with a grain of salt in reply to Dan, 05-25-2006 16:35:20

Jerry (aka Underdog)... re: Winston Churchill ---
That deliberate "misspelling" he claimed to have performed in his personal correspondence was always more than just "one" or "two" words. He misspelled LOTS of words in virtually ALL his personal writings. Examples: Colour, humour, analyse, criticise, memorise, centre, theatre, encyclopaedia, manoever, cheque, arguement, judgement, defence, licence, plough, tyre, draught, programme, learnt,... not to mention completely different words for some useage such as: flashlight = torch, baby carriage = pram, corn = maize, eraser = rubber, gasoline = petrol, kerosene = paraffin, truck = lorry, pharmacist = chemist, pharmacy = apothecary, josh = joke, josh498n = idiot (grin)

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