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Igniition less than perfect...

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SCgoatfarmer

06-05-2006 06:44:04




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1949 Ford 8n front mount distributor 12 volt one wire alternator.

I have been working through different problems with this site and things keep getting better with my tractor.

Finally figured out carb adjsutments this past weekend.

Let me tell you the current mystery (although I think I know the answer)...
New 12v battery, new 437 spark plugs, new resistor, new three position key switch, new 12 volt coil, new wiring harness and new one wire alternator. (The only things which arent new are the plug wires and the distributor)

Checked plug wires with volt meter. Position one and three have high resistance. They checked out at like 5 and 9 while two and four were 22 and 30. Also the spark plug covers are split and the distributor caps are also worn and have big cracks.(Hence, I think new plug wires will go along way with the tractor starting and running better)

The tractor runs good. The starting can be tricky sometimes. The coil is getting good voltage, it is between the coil and the spark plugs where the voltage is lost. Several attempts need to be made with choking before it will fire off and even then it is real unsure of itself. Also noticed that after running for a little while that the engine might start missing but then it goes away.

Now I am familiar with Dell's 4 most common ignition problems trouble shooting. However, I dont think my key switch or coil is bad. Like I said they are new but I know not all these parts when new are right. I just dont have a big enough problem with starting the tractor or running it for that matter to believe one of those components are bad. It just seems to me that those plug wires are in need of replacment very badly.

What does anyone think? Most gain to be made from new plug wires or should I focus on the distibutor (points etc?)

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Hobo,NC

06-05-2006 10:41:32




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 06-05-2006 06:44:04  
Several of the statements you have made lead me to believe you have a little water in the fuel or a fuel starvation problem, E-Zee check and at no cost, check the condition of the fuel.
"The starting can be tricky" "Several attempts need to be made with choking before it will fire off and even then it is real unsure of itself. Also noticed that after running for a little while that the engine might start missing but then it goes away". I also have a tip to elimate the fuel but gotta go turn sum wrench"izz, will git back to ya later.

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SCgoatfarmer

06-05-2006 10:44:59




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to Hobo,NC, 06-05-2006 10:41:32  
It does act like it is fuel starved.

Although, the carb rebuil dand adjustments seem to be right.

It is the intenisty of the spark at the spark plug that makes me think it is the at the wires.



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Hobo,NC

06-05-2006 11:53:05




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 06-05-2006 10:44:59  
One more time and I'm outta here, check the condition of the FUEL, check for good fuel flow and Contamination. E-Zee and cheap and 'bout the last thing one would look for. Next git ya a Propane torch and hook a hose to the end of the torch and spray sum into the filter intake and iffin it clears it up I bet it’s a fuel problem. You will haveta play with the meter’in knob to git the rite mix., Even brake clean will werk. Only repair for bad wires izz new’uns. Plug wire check
Scopes may be inaccessible from time to time, so we at "Bubba's Garage"
have come up with this here test for Ignition Output:

Hold medium wrench in one hand, Sears wrench preferred for accuracy
of test 'cause other smooth wrenches are too slick for throwin'!

With engine runnin', grab hold of the plug end of an ignition cable with the other hand
and hold on tight!

This will more than likely cause you to throw wrench! KV output is based on how far
the wrench wuz thrown!

10 feet = approx. 10,000 volts 20 feet = approx. 15,000 volts 30 feet = approx. 25,000 volts Over 30 feet = Caution! Must be one of them new
dis-is-it ignition systems, use bigger
wrench and retest.

WARNING! No side effects have been reported due to testing at this time
(although it has been known to kill chiggers after berry pickin')

Bubba Sez: Electricity will not usually hurt you, instead it is the back of
your neck going through the hood latch that really ruins your day!!

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LeeMo

06-05-2006 14:47:11




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to Hobo,NC, 06-05-2006 11:53:05  
LMAO !! I don't even wanna know how you test your home wiring !!! Thanks for the chuckles !! Bubba beez one funny dude !!



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Dell (WA)

06-05-2006 10:07:02




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 06-05-2006 06:44:04  
Goatsie..... ....CHANGE YER SPARKIE WIRES. ($10, cheap) Leaky sparkies out the minute (small) cracks in the dried out insulation lets them lazy sparkies dance on the outside of the wire instead of jumping the plug-gap. You doubt? Fire-up yer tractor on very DARK-NITE and once yer eyeballs gitt used to the dark, you will see little blue sparkie dancing ontop of yer old sparkie wires.

New copper-core sparkie wire insulation is so much better than old dried out sparkie wire insultion. DO NOT GET modern anti-radiostatic automobile sparkie wire 'cuz they have built-in resistance to electrons and your barely addequate OEM squarecan ignition coil don't have hot-enuff sparkies to overcome the resistance.

When replacing yer new COPPER-CORE sparkie wires start with the LONGEST first. Just push and install the rubber nipples AFTER you cut-to-fit.

Remember yer firing order is 1,2,4,3 CCW..... ...Dell, yer self-appointed sparkie-meister

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SCgoatfarmer

06-05-2006 10:47:44




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to Dell (WA), 06-05-2006 10:07:02  
I thought you might say that.

It is that orange spark when I check those wires that makes me think that is where I am loosing it too.

Eveything else is new and or has checked out okay.

I am a little heisitant to pull that distributor or purchase a new one yet.

Thanks for the help.



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old

06-05-2006 08:15:20




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 06-05-2006 06:44:04  
Well if you really want to know if you need new plug wires, fire the tractor up and grab each plug wire and if you get zapped you need new ones. And yes plug wires go bad and need replaced at times. BE sure to get the true wire type plug wires not the type made for cars and trucks but the true copper wire plug wires. The copper wire plug wires can be a little hard to find but any good tractor place should have them. Now days if you ask for them at an auto parts store most people will not even have a clue what your talking about.

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Bob

06-05-2006 07:19:28




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 06-05-2006 06:44:04  
How do you know it is ignition related? Carburetor problems can cause problems like you are having, too!

As Soundguy said, without knowing what scale you are using, it's impossible to interpret the readings you gave.

However, since the wires and cap are a bit tattered, it certainly is a good idea to replace them, PROVIDING you get good quality replacements.

Suppression core wires COULD give readings like that on the "K" Ohms scale, OR solid-core wires could give readings like that on the "Ohms X1" scale, and on that scale, the variations you list could simply be due to a poor connection with the meter lead due to a bit of corrosion on the high tension terminal ends, combined with the low resistance being measured.

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K.LaRue-VA

06-05-2006 07:01:48




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 06-05-2006 06:44:04  
Think you are right and already answered it yourself. (The only things which arent new are the plug wires and the distributor). Resistance on all plug wires should be the similar. These parts are cheap. But the wires can be a pain to get into the tube. I pulled my new wires in with four thin pieces of wire. Had to remove the distributor boots and reinstall them on the wires after I got them through the tube.

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souNdguy

06-05-2006 07:01:35




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 06-05-2006 06:44:04  
Ok.. lets solve one problem at a time. The numbers you read for the plug wires don't mean much unless you tell us what scale you used. In any case.. if the wires are old.. replace them. Use real metal core wires.. new boots, and get a new distribuitor cap and rotor button.. that may be the bulk of the problem right there.

Next with respect to your coils and voltages.. if you have a tisco style 12v square coil, what resistor are you using in line... it should be a 1/2 ohm resistor.. not the oem ballast resistor, and not a 8ne10306 dropping resistor..

Soundguy

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SCgoatfarmer

06-05-2006 10:50:47




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to souNdguy, 06-05-2006 07:01:35  
I am not using the ballast resisitor just a standard ford resisitor that came with the 12V conversion.

The plugs and wires thamselves do seem to be in bad shape.

I juts didnt want to have to replace the distributor (yet anyway).

I will replace the plug wires.

Thanks



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souNdguy

06-05-2006 11:31:19




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 06-05-2006 10:50:47  
It's very possible that the ignition resistor given to you is the wrong value, though it may work anyway.

This stemms from 'kit' manufacturers not having a hand 'off-the-shelf- supply of the correct value resistor to throw in the kit with the square 12v coil..

Soundguy



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bobd6

06-05-2006 06:55:16




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 Re: Igniition less than perfect... in reply to SCgoatfarmer, 06-05-2006 06:44:04  
I would definitely replace the plug wires and probably the distributor cap since they don' cost much, and the points and condenser if you haven't already replaced those.
This is just on my experience that these items are very importent to good spark and that sounds like what you need.



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