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Ford 9N, 2N & 8N Discussion Forum
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BOB DELL et al / cold starting

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ronfrancistroncatty

10-17-2007 11:44:30




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Anybody have a cure for the fact that eventhough I have converted to 12 volt with electronic ignition (pertronix) my 9N still is a pain to start when its cool and damp let alone cold..... ..If its above 70 no problem ..... ....and runs good otherwise..... ...any suggestion out there beside putting a heated blanket on her..... ...




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RP-40-9n

10-17-2007 21:52:26




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to ronfrancistroncatty, 10-17-2007 11:44:30  
cool damp weather equals,key word damp, equals bad or missing gaskets in distributor and coil letting in moisture from dew, shorting out system.



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Bruce (VA)

10-17-2007 15:21:08




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 He Only Wants a Response from Bob or Dell in reply to ronfrancistroncatty, 10-17-2007 11:44:30  
Don't bother him w/ your advice; as he told me, below, his problem is not spark or fuel. He wants to hear from Bob or Dell so I do not see any need to take up his time any further.



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Dean

10-17-2007 15:02:25




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to ronfrancistroncatty, 10-17-2007 11:44:30  
Have you changed your plug wires?

Hard starting when damp is a classic symptom of old plug wires with broken down insulation.

If you have changed them, are they copper core or TVRS? Copper core is much preferred.

If the plug wires are not suspect, the engine cranks properly (proper RPM) and the choke is functional, it's time for a compression test.

Dean



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Ed in ON Canada

10-17-2007 13:46:12




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to TXRussell, 10-17-2007 11:44:30  
Could be air leak around the carb? When it's running, spray some WD40 around the carb and see if the revs go up. If they do, the WD40 is getting sucked in through the place leaking air.
Could be the felt packings around the choke and/or the throttle shafts.



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JFPJR

10-17-2007 13:16:34




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to ronfrancistroncatty, 10-17-2007 11:44:30  
Is your choke working? Mine always needs a good choke when it is cool out.
Recheck point gap and connections. How do your plugs look?



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Bruce (VA)

10-17-2007 12:33:03




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to ronfrancistroncatty, 10-17-2007 11:44:30  
6v or 12v, front or side distributor, EI or points....it does not matter at this early stage of problem resolution.

It's either spark or fuel. Good analysis, huh?

Next time it does this, check quickly for spark then fuel. Get an old plug, open the gap to 3/16, ground it to a rust & paint free spot on the head, turn the key on & crank the engine. You have three possibilities: no spark, weak and/or intermittent yellow spark, or a bright blue spark. What is it? Next, check for fuel. Remove the bolt in the bottom of the carb; as long as the fuel is turned on, you should see gas flowing out of the carb.

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Ron Tron

10-17-2007 12:37:30




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to Bruce (VA), 10-17-2007 12:33:03  
it ain't spark and it ain't fuel..... ....if it was it wouldn't only have a problem in the cold..... .....perhaps its the plug wires..... ...where the BOB and or DELL we I need them..... ..... .....



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BillM (OH)

10-17-2007 22:01:21




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to Ron Tron, 10-17-2007 12:37:30  
You can't rule out spark - the colder it gets, the more the starter robs the ignition to turn the engine over (with thicker oil), and the worse the spark gets. Your ignition system is not performing as it should. Next up would be compression - if you have a problem with cold start and it's a low compression issue, the slower the engine turns, the lower the compression will be.



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soundguy

10-17-2007 17:52:10




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to Ron Tron, 10-17-2007 12:37:30  
Spark, timing, fuel, air and compression.

Air is probably ok to nix.

you are nixing fuel and spark ( i'm still thinking about these 2 till proven otherwise ).

that leaves compression and timing. i already mentioned a comp test. but doubt comp would come up enough warm to be an issue.. nor do I think you have a valve clearance issue.

that leaves timing... did you dink with the timing?

soundguy

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Bruce (VA)

10-17-2007 15:17:58




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to Ron Tron, 10-17-2007 12:37:30  
Well excuse me for responding. Maybe you should just email Dell & Bob directly if you only want their input & that way all the rest of us here who are trying to help you want waste your time.



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Ben Rivard

10-17-2007 13:42:37




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to Ron Tron, 10-17-2007 12:37:30  
I'm not trying to be contradictory but completely ruling out ignition & fuel is a pretty big step. Sometimes cooler/cold temps simply expose/irritate the underlying issues that would not be clearly visible at warmer temps. My 8n was just fine durring the summer months but became quite stubborn the cooler it got last fall, after a thourough ingnition (cleaned all conections adjusted all specs) and fuel system maintainence session it once again starts reliably no matter what the temp. Good luck!, I know how frustrating it can be when they aren't cooperative! I always make sure the clutch is disengaged while starting in cooler weather, removing that drag can be a big help in getting that cold motor to spin fast enough. once again, best of luck!

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soundguy

10-17-2007 12:10:01




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to ronfrancistroncatty, 10-17-2007 11:44:30  
Check spark.. if it ain't spark, check fuel and compression. both of those can be related issues... She start ok with a whif of ether?

Soundguy



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Danny in CO

10-17-2007 12:01:49




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to ronfrancistroncatty, 10-17-2007 11:44:30  
Ron,

My 48 8N was hard to start in cold weather also. I converted to 12 volts and rewired at the same time. What I found was bad connections on the ground cable. Also, my battery cables were too small. Make sure all of your connections are "clean, bright, and tight".

Now my N starts in all weather.

Good luck,
Danny



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Ron Tron

10-17-2007 12:05:38




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to Danny in CO, 10-17-2007 12:01:49  
not a ground problem..... ..I have cables as big as your third member..... ..... No it has always been hard to start in cool damp weather even before I converted to 12 volt and electronic ignition



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old

10-17-2007 14:19:22




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to Ron Tron, 10-17-2007 12:05:38  
Hows the cap and rotor?? If either one has a hair line crack in it they can/will cause a problem like that. Also bad plug wires will cause that problem because of a bleed off of spark from cracks in the insulation on the wires. If its a side mount distubutor an easy way to check the cap is start it up and gap the cap. If its bad it will knock you for a loop

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Danny in CO

10-17-2007 13:52:35




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 Re: BOB DELL et al / cold starting in reply to Ron Tron, 10-17-2007 12:05:38  
My bet is still on the electrical side. Are you using the original 6 volt coil or a 12 volt coil? If you are using a 6 volt coil, what is the voltage at the top of the coil with the points CLOSED? It needs to be about 3.5 volts. If it is much lower than 3.5, it will be hard to start, worse the colder it gets. You can have bad/dirty connections along the path from the battery to the top of the coil. Try jumping around the ignition switch when it is cold and see if that helps.

Good luck,
Danny

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