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1952 8N with Coil Seat Spring and Shock Absorber

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Alvin

07-08-1999 13:07:40




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I saw a 1952 8N for sale (SN 485434) with a coil seat spring and shock absorber. The tractor appeared to be original except for the seat spring. The owner said he is the 2nd owner (his Uncle bought it new). Does anyone know if this was a factory option on a new tractor. If it is, does this help or hurt the value of the tractor from a collector point of view?




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Larry 8N75381

07-08-1999 13:48:45




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 Re: 1952 8N with Coil Seat Spring and Shock Absorber in reply to Alvin, 07-08-1999 13:07:40  
The seat is part number 230200 which does not include the pan. It was an option, and the seat pan was used from the standard seat/spring that most tractors have. Since most N's do not have this style seat suspension, I would say it has "some" added value. BUT how much is very much up to the buyer/seller.

If the shock absorber is bad, it may be hard to find a replacement, as I'm sure FNH will not have it available.

I'm going to RANT about the term "shock absorber" in a follow-up post so those that are not intrested won't have to read it.

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Larry 8N75381

07-08-1999 14:22:07




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 Re: Re: 1952 8N with Coil Seat Spring and Shock Absorber in reply to Larry 8N75381, 07-08-1999 13:48:45  
Sorry guys but I get ANGRY - no LIVID when I hear the term "shock absorber". As a Mechanical Engineer I learned that what is called a "shock absorber" does NOT absorb shocks AT ALL!!! In fact, it actually transmits sudden movements (shock) from one side of the suspension system to the other. Technically it is a dash pot which is intended to prevent unwanted oscillations in a suspension system.

When I hear ads for one of the various "shock absorber" manufactures/installers touting how their new "shock absorber" will improve the ride of your car, I want to scream and go get someone to sue for false advertising. The unmigitated BULL hockey these people put out is SO wrong!!! Only increasing the available spring travel (same as making spring constant lower) or the car weight will "improve" the ride. Ask BG about the ride of an unloaded truck versus one that is loaded.

The "spring" is the true "shock absorber" because it moves, more or less, freely up and down. A sudden change in the position of supported end is "adsorbed" by the spring because the inertia of the supported mass at the other end resists sudden changes in it's position. The dash pot resists motion and thus tries to transmit any changes in position at one end immedately to the other.

ps sorry but I haven't time to spell chack - an' remember I ar an enginerr. :-)

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llamas

07-09-1999 04:24:31




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 Re: Re: Re: 1952 8N with Coil Seat Spring and Shock Absorber in reply to Larry 8N75381, 07-08-1999 14:22:07  
Well, as one mechanical engineer to another - I think you might be being just a little picky here. It's all in the terms.

A "shock absorber", being a damper, alters the natural frequency of the spring-mass system, and thus alters the tendency to oscillation at a particular frequency. This can have a positive effect on the ride, also the handling. Drive a car without "shock absorbers " to experience this.

The reason that a heavily loaded car (or truck) "rides" better is that the suspension system - not just the "SA"s - are tuned to an average loading. An empty car has too much damping for the mass and spring rate of the system and will ride "harder". A semi-truck, unloaded, is even worse because the system is designed for a maximum load which may be up to 4 times the mass of the system unloaded. There just ain't a good compromise that isn't very costly. An unloaded semi is tough to drive because the system is so over-damped that the handling goes very bad indeed, and a bob-tailed semi-tractor can be virtually uncontrollable under some circumstances. That's why drivers load partials right onto the axles, to try and get the sprung mass as high as possible. There's more to "ride" than just an air-cushion experience.

"Shock absorbers" do have some energy-absorbing characteristics in addition to their damping effect - the action of forcing the oil through a control orifice or orifices does consume some of the impulse energy in the form of heat. The trouble is, it's a "swings and roundabouts" game - the higher the energy absorbtion, the higher the damping effect - generally.

So I don't think it's all false advertising - shock absorbers do have some shock-absorbing function, and the name is a carry-over from the original technologies, which were frictional devices which only absorbed shock energy and had little or no damping effect at all. And I'm sure we all know how autos from the 20s and 30s handled.

llater,

llamas

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Dr Victor Weissberg

03-29-2003 00:03:15




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: 1952 8N with Coil Seat Spring and Shock Absorber in reply to llamas, 07-09-1999 04:24:31  



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bg

07-09-1999 07:08:59




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: 1952 8N with Coil Seat Spring and Shock Absorber in reply to llamas, 07-09-1999 04:24:31  
The average American can understand "Shock Absorber." He may be a bit befuddled by "Oscillation Damper."
I wonder if I can replace the front axle of my 8N with a tubular steel floating axle with McPherson struts to dampen those nasty furrow bumps?



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Nolan

07-09-1999 11:59:29




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 1952 8N with Coil Seat Spring and Shock Absorber in reply to bg, 07-09-1999 07:08:59  
You know, you probably could cobb up one of those transverse leaf front ends like the t-bucket street rods use.



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Nolan

07-09-1999 03:41:41




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 Re: Re: Re: 1952 8N with Coil Seat Spring and Shock Absorber in reply to Larry 8N75381, 07-08-1999 14:22:07  
Don't spend your whole life tripping over mouse poop. People talk about centrifugal force, and believe it's real too. Lots of folks mount sway bars on cars. So be it. Translate in your head, and don't sweat the small stuff.

Btw, dampers are capable of absorbing energy and converting it to heat. In that sense, they do absorb mechanical shocks.



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damper.........Dell (WA)

07-08-1999 15:47:42




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 Re: Re: Re: 1952 8N with Coil Seat Spring and Shock Absorber in reply to Larry 8N75381, 07-08-1999 14:22:07  
I think the British term "damper" really describes what that floating pistion in a tube full of hydraulic oil is doing. But when they start carrying on about bonnets and boots, I draw the line (grin)..... .....Dell



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Don B

07-08-1999 19:33:17




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: 1952 8N with Coil Seat Spring and Shock Absorber in reply to damper.........Dell (WA), 07-08-1999 15:47:42  
Dell, I'm surprised that you didn't know that bonnets and boots are what you wear when you are following that Oliver manure spredder mentioned in an earlier post.grin,Don



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Walt

07-08-1999 13:51:27




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 Re: Re: 1952 8N with Coil Seat Spring and Shock Absorber in reply to Larry 8N75381, 07-08-1999 13:48:45  
The Resto-ride seat was also available has an option for the N's per the 1939-1964 Tractor acessory catolog



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