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tune-up 1655

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Tom

10-11-2003 10:09:47

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I'm going to replace the spark plugs in my 1655 gas and was wondering what brand seem to work the best. I'm also putting in and electronic ignition module and hotter coil. The tractor has 4,000 hours and is in very good shape. Thanks

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Wrenchbender

10-14-2003 15:17:34

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Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Tom, 10-11-2003 10:09:47

What kind of electronic ignition are you putting in your 1655? WB.

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Tom

10-14-2003 18:48:57

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Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Wrenchbender, 10-14-2003 15:17:34

It is a Pertronix electronic ignition kit

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Don-Wi

10-11-2003 22:22:39

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Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Tom, 10-11-2003 10:09:47

Personally, I've had horrible luck with champions, but AC Delco's have always worked great for me. Run them in both my 1600 and Massey 165. My truck has Autoloites, and they are good too. Why a hotter coil? can't you just run a hotter plug? Gap them right and you shouldn't really have any need for a hotter coil. Think my 1600's gap is .044, but not absolutley sure about that

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RWT

10-12-2003 20:27:21

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Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Don-Wi, 10-11-2003 22:22:39

I agree about the Champions. I can't seem to get them to run good in anything. I have had improvements just putting something else in.

I use AC and Autolite (just depends). I see Ollies comment and if it works, fine.

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RAB

10-12-2003 02:14:00

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Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Don-Wi, 10-11-2003 22:22:39

Don-Wi,
A hotter coil is not the same as hotter plugs. The hotter coil should increase the spark energy, the hotter splugs run at a higher temperature to help keep deposits on the plug electrode at an acceptable level (without getting so hot that you don't need a spark to ignite the mixture!).
A hotter coil will draw higher amps than a standard (shorter contact breaker life on a Ketteringham system). Hotter sparkies will have a longer and/or thinner centre electrode so the heat path to the metal of the plug (and then to the head) is reduced from that of a cooler plug.
Regards, RAB

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Don-WI

10-12-2003 20:31:52

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Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to RAB, 10-12-2003 02:14:00

Thanks for clarifying, I couldn't remember all of that from my auto class in high school a whole 2 1/2 years ago. That and everything is going to coil packs, and other forms of DIS systems so it wasn't covered much. Had a heck of an experience timing my '66 bel-air.
Donovan from Wisconsin

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Ollie

10-11-2003 12:53:40

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Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Tom, 10-11-2003 10:09:47

I've had great luck with Champion N11YC in my 1650G.

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Brad

10-11-2003 19:42:10

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Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Ollie, 10-11-2003 12:53:40

I've had good luck with AC R44XLS in those engines.

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Ollie

10-12-2003 06:40:01

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Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Brad, 10-11-2003 19:42:10

Can't imagine why you would want to use a resistor type plug with a point type ignition where the operator's manual calls for non-resistor type plugs.

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Don-Wi

10-13-2003 20:00:18

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Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Ollie, 10-12-2003 06:40:01

Don't mean to be rude, but that is also what crosses to the 1600. The resistor is only because the autoparts store doesn't stock the non-resistor plugs anymore. They are in the modern plugs so they don't interfere with automotive electronics, such as radios, etc... Otherwise you would hear a crack everytime your sparkplugs fired, which in a big v-8 truck is A LOT. I believe the plugs I was using are 45's, as they are a little hotter, and helped with the fouling problems. Hopefully once I get it back I can run stock again and not worry, but may keep some hotter plugs around. Again, only adding my experiences and don't mean to offend anyone.
Donovan from WI

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Ollie

10-14-2003 02:02:14

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Don-Wi, 10-13-2003 20:00:18

No offense taken Don. Non-resistor plugs are still available. I use them. NAPA sells them.

You cannot "cross" plugs. Spark plug manufacturers sell plugs by application. In a low-energy points system, resistor plugs overheat both the points and the coil which greatly shorten their life.

In "modern" high-energy electronic ignition systems, resistor plugs and wires are required not only for the reason you mentioned but also so that the ignition system itself works correctly and also so that the computers are not affected by stray RF signals.

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Don-WI

10-14-2003 19:47:56

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Ollie, 10-14-2003 02:02:14

I know they are still available, but my autoparts supplier doesn't stock them, NAPA is too expensive for a $1 part, and yes, you can cross them. Same as buying Napa, Hastings, Delco,etc... oil filters. Same size and application, different name and manufacturer. Champion plugs can and are cross-referenced with other brands everyday. Just because your car or truck may have came with Autolite's, Delco's, champions or other brand plugs, you say you run Bosch in them. Same applies to tractors. May have had one brand in at one point in time, but you can put in whatever plug you want, or whatever is cheapest meeting the application. That way, you can have 3 plugs, 3 manufacturers, and 3 different prices for the same application. I dont really care too much about price, I ussually avoid Champions and use AC or autolite, whichever they have in stock.
Donovan from Wisconsin

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Brad

10-12-2003 18:58:08

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Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Ollie, 10-12-2003 06:40:01

If you experiment outside the manual's suggestions, sometimes you find things work better and last longer.

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Ollie

10-13-2003 04:35:21

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Brad, 10-12-2003 18:58:08

If you knew anything about ignition systems you would not feel the need to "experiment".

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Brad

10-13-2003 15:50:52

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Ollie, 10-13-2003 04:35:21

You are right, I do not know everthing. Some people like to pretend that they do. I am not one of them. Therefore, sometimes experimenting is the best route.

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Ollie

10-14-2003 02:10:16

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Brad, 10-13-2003 15:50:52

Experimentation is useless unless you have a known starting point, change only one variable at a time, and correctly measure and interpret the results.

Changing from the required non-resistor to a resistor plug on a points type ignition shortens both points and coil life. If you had known how these systems work, you would know that to be a fact and no experiment would be necessary; the engineers have already figured it out for you!

Smart people learn from other people, that's how they get smart. Otherwise we would have a world full of people all trying to invent the wheel.

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Brad

10-14-2003 18:56:16

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Ollie, 10-14-2003 02:10:16

I'm glad you informed me how to correctly experiment, I haven't heard that since I learned it when I was about 5 years old. Real world experience teaches you that the engineers did not have it all figured out, they made it work on paper and left it to us to clean up after them. Since you seem to be very well informed, I'm sure that you know one of natures laws is "Anything that can not change will not survive" This is very true, right down to the manuals. That is why there is service bulletins, and since they stopped producing them for these tractors several years ago, It is up to real world mechanich's to keep up with them.

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ollie

10-15-2003 05:34:39

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Brad, 10-14-2003 18:56:16

A service buliten? never herd of that

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Brad

10-15-2003 05:59:10

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 16 in reply to ollie, 10-15-2003 05:34:39

Ah, looking at the screen closely, I just picked up on something. I'm sure someone else will point it out.

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Brad

10-15-2003 05:54:27

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 16 in reply to ollie, 10-15-2003 05:34:39

Grow up. But then again, if that's all you can point a finger at I guess I proved my point.

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Bob C.

10-13-2003 12:49:57

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Ollie, 10-13-2003 04:35:21

Hey Ollie, im sure Brad knows lots about ignition systems and i am real sure i do also. I wouldnt use any plug recommended in the manuals for any of my olivers.(and i got lots of em) Actually, i wont use anything but Bosch platinuim plugs.Thats the problem with those manuals you preach about so much. Sure everyone should have one, but unlike the bible, its not printed in stone. It should be used as a guidline only for comparitives to todays options. Ignition systems 40 years ago were 6 volt, positive ground systems. I dont think i need to tell you how much good that was. People use alternators with built in regulators and negetive ground systems which are far superior so why would you want to trust everything you read in a 40-50 year old outdated manual.Im sure you wont agree, but 1/2 the stuff in those manuals is just that, OUTDATED

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Ollie

10-13-2003 13:22:41

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Bob C., 10-13-2003 12:49:57

You are completely wrong! Bosch platinum plugs are large gap plugs made for electronic ignition systems ONLY and can never be used with point based (small gap) ignition systems. Check the Bosch catalog; yeh I know, it's a manual!

People who attempt to bend the ground electrode to get around the gap restriction either drop the ground electode into the cylinder ($$$) or destroy the insulator and them blame the plug. This is covered in the manual!

BTW, I use Bosch single-electrode platinums in my trucks and cars with electronic ignition systems. Bosch sells plugs BY APPLICATION and I use exactly what they recommend, in the manual!

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Bob C.

10-13-2003 16:07:58

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Ollie, 10-13-2003 13:22:41

Well guess what ollie, i aint wrong. Any good running oliver should have a msd6a box installed and bosch platinuim plus four plugs have no electrode, so gaping a plug is not an issue. If you use them in your trucks and car, why not put them in your olivers too. I spent hours going through books and found perfect matches with the champion plug recommeded for 880s& 1600-50s. Through experimenting with new ideas and innovations, a good oliver can be made to run just as good as the new tractors.Herb Morrell and the guys got 62 horse power out of a 199 cubic inch xo-121, and im zeroing in on 120 horse power out of a 283 cubic inch motor using their ideas AND todays technology, and im not finding much of either in one of your manuals

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Ollie

10-14-2003 02:11:57

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Bob C., 10-13-2003 16:07:58

"Any good running oliver should have a msd6a box installed..."

HA! HA! HA!

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Bob

10-14-2003 07:07:45

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 16 in reply to Ollie, 10-14-2003 02:11:57

you just keep workin on gaping those bosch plus four plugs Ollie, that otta keep ya occupied!! HA HA HA

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Jason

10-13-2003 13:01:49

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Bob C., 10-13-2003 12:49:57

This is why Ollie thinks he knows it all, he is using 30 - 50 year old information, thus he has no real world experience.

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Gentle Ben

10-14-2003 08:25:06

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Jason, 10-13-2003 13:01:49

Always nice to see Jason weigh in on these discussions. I have never seen him give any real information, but he yells very well.

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Ollie

10-13-2003 13:24:06

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Jason, 10-13-2003 13:01:49

I've forgot more about this subject than you will ever know. Grow up sonny boy!

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Jack

10-14-2003 14:21:55

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Ollie, 10-13-2003 13:24:06

Ollie it sounds like you have forgot about everything to me

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Jason for oliver

10-13-2003 16:50:24

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 1655 in reply to Ollie, 10-13-2003 13:24:06

Ollie grow up, you dont know $hit. Anyone that has ever worked or owned an oliver can see through your bull$hit. You keep reading those out dated manuals, cause thats as close as you can come to knowing anything about Olivers.

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Ollie

10-14-2003 02:14:03

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-up 16 in reply to Jason for oliver, 10-13-2003 16:50:24

Your mommy must be proud. She raised a foul-mouth idiot. Tell her the next time you see her. It will make her happy.

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Again ,know it all OLLIE

10-14-2003 15:47:03

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: tune-u in reply to Ollie, 10-14-2003 02:14:03

Just ask Ollie if he doesnt know, he will tell you to get a manual. its obivious he has never worked on an oliver tractor.

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