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Antique Tractor Paint and Bodywork

Am I doing something wrong?

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JayWalt

10-03-2006 20:36:19




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I got some bps primer and paint and used as directed, thoroughly cleaned the surface. I didnt want to spend the $10 on the hardener when i did a few parts because they were cast and figured, it would be ok. I do plan on using the hardener when i do the tin. My question is, the paint has dried for more then 4 days and I can scrape it off with my fingernail? I sure as heck cant do that with my car, heh. Does hardener really make a difference like that? Would I still be able to scratch it off if I used hardener?
If I'm not doing anything wrong, then I'm contacting valspar to complain...

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souNdguy

10-04-2006 19:07:53




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 Re: Am I doing something wrong? in reply to JayWalt, 10-03-2006 20:36:19  
I've painted quite a few tractors with BPS.. and only 1 without the hardner. All the hardened ones pretty much cured 'overnight'. The un-catylized ones took longer.. however.. it almost sounds like your metal prep was not complete. Did you paint over primer? over old paint? metal? How / what did you do for surface prep.

Even on my JD-B which was non hardened.. it did not 'fingernail' peel unless I was really trying to gouge out a section.

I also agree with the thickness...if it's too thick, and unhardened.. then yes.. i expect it to be soft and peel easilly for a bit of time.. etc.

Soundguy

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JayWalt

10-04-2006 21:29:32




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 Re: Am I doing something wrong? in reply to souNdguy, 10-04-2006 19:07:53  
I painted my new control valves which are cast. I cleaned them with a scouring pad and paint thinner, then I used this cleanr my friend gave me I think PPG makes it, to clean the valve the rest of the way. I applied BPS primer and after 24 hours I applied the paint. Used a brush for both, no thick coats, multiple thinner coats. Its just like the paint is too soft. I dont recall if I could scratch down to bare metal or not...

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souNdguy

10-05-2006 05:07:47




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 Re: Am I doing something wrong? in reply to JayWalt, 10-04-2006 21:29:32  
Hmm.. not sure what happened. I also use the BPS primer. Perhaps your coats were't cured well??

Soundguy



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Daniel H.

10-04-2006 13:51:51




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 Re: Am I doing something wrong? in reply to JayWalt, 10-03-2006 20:36:19  
The BPS is "Best Paint Sold", usually from Tractor Supply Company. It is made by Valspar. It is a regular enamel and can be used without the hardener. Recently TSC started carrying the hardener for it. Something that hasn't been mentioned is that the hardener is dangerous to breathe and you should not use a charcoal mask with it and think you are safe. I know many have gotten away with it as have I, but at the time I didn't know any better, so I was lucky. You really need supplied air to use the hardener. That is one thing I wish these companies would make clear when they put this stuff on the shelf of a store like TSC. Who, using a $30.00 gallon of paint on one tractor, wants to spend $300 + on supplied air?

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CNKS

10-04-2006 06:15:45




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 Re: Am I doing something wrong? in reply to JayWalt, 10-03-2006 20:36:19  
Unless it's urethane, the only answer I have is that you applied it too thick. Alkyd enamels/acrylic enamels do not require catalyst, although they cure faster with one; urethanes must have a catalyst. If it peels off easily with your fingernail, something is wrong. But uncatalysed enamel takes several months to cure/harden completely. It will be somewhat soft until it cures. Until that time it can be removed fairly easily. I have noticed that on newer paint following the decades old factory paint. Stripper (methylene chloride) curls and removes the newer (could be several years old at that time) almost immediately. The factory paint underneath takes a couple of more applications. Partially because the old paint was not properly sanded before applying the newer paint.

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JayWalt

10-04-2006 06:38:45




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 Re: Am I doing something wrong? in reply to CNKS, 10-04-2006 06:15:45  
Thanks dude, Thats exactly what dad said about taking oer a month to properly harden without a catylyst. I will probably get some hardener before I paint again. Only thing I dont like about hardener is if u mix up a batch, you only have 8 hours to use it. Anyone try putting any leftovers in the freezer like they do with paintbrushes to keep them from drying?



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CNKS

10-04-2006 17:05:12




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 Re: Am I doing something wrong? in reply to JayWalt, 10-04-2006 06:38:45  
As stated above, don't use hardener without supplied air. Refrigeration may slow it down some, but I wouldn't count on it. I only mix enough for the particular job I'm doing at the time, usually never more than an hour. Then I mix more.



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MHCorey

10-03-2006 21:28:22




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 Re: Am I doing something wrong? in reply to JayWalt, 10-03-2006 20:36:19  
depending on the type of paint you used.. if you didnt use a catalyst (hardener) then its like applying bondo(body filler) without hardener, completely pointless..the catalyst etches the paint to the surface.. without catalyst the color pigments are just lying on the surface... that is definately your problem...



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CNKS

10-04-2006 06:06:36




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 Re: Am I doing something wrong? in reply to MHCorey, 10-03-2006 21:28:22  
A catalyst doesn't really etch the paint to the surface, it makes the paint flow out better and cure faster. The etching is done by sanding prior to application, then preferably using a primer, then the paint bonds to the primer. Body shops use an etch primer on bare metal because sanding takes time and time is money. The synthetic enamel BPS paint sold in most tractor stores does not require catalyst. If it happens to be a urethane, then it will not cure without catalyst. Valspar does make urethanes.

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JayWalt

10-03-2006 21:08:52




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 Re: Am I doing something wrong? in reply to JayWalt, 10-03-2006 20:36:19  
The label doenst mention anything about hardeners, but it is available in the same section at TSC.



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B-maniac

10-03-2006 21:03:09




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 Re: Am I doing something wrong? in reply to JayWalt, 10-03-2006 20:36:19  
I am not familiar with that particular line of products,but,most paint products that I am familiar with that call for a catylist,will not dry/cure without it. To my knowlege,synthetic enamel and acrylic enamel are the only two that you can spray with or without catylist. Acrylic urethanes and poly-urethanes NEED the catylist. Did it say in the instructions that catylist was optional? Usually if it calls for it,it needs it. Answer to your question,YES,catylist DOES really make that much difference in a product that calls for it! The key is, does it call for it???

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