Sherwin Williams Paint for my M

I am not familiar with S-W products but you can get all the information you are likely to need at their web site. They have a competitor interchange that you might like to use to verify what you told at the store regarding the PPG cross. I also recommend you get the technical data sheets (product data sheets) for each of the products you plan on using. They are available here. There is much more usage information in those sheets than on the can labels. It is also more dependable than what you might be told by the counter person. They will also provide you with the best list of the different additives you will need to properly use each product. I am not saying the counter person is wrong. However, I trust the manufacturer's written instructions more and it would make sense to verify what you are being told verbally. There usually are different reducers, depending on the actual temperature at the time of spraying so you would want to check that out also.

I never use fisheye remover. If you are careful in your cleaning and have decent quality air, you won't need it. It's a crutch that should not be necessary. It's unlikely to do any harm if you want to use it, as long as it is a recommended additive listed in the tech sheet.

If you do any significant sanding on your sheetmetal, I think you should plan on using some type of surfacer if you want a nice smooth, glossy, topcoat. I am putting together a photo-description of painting a fender on my AC-B. I have been held up in topcoating because of the weather since I do all my painting outside and it is not complete. However, it does show how I have dealt with rust pits and the use of a surfacer. If you are interested in a visual of what a surfacer can do for you, check it out here. Scroll down to the last several pictures to see what a surfacer does. Make sure you click on any thumbnail you are interested in so you can see a larger picture and read the caption.

Rod

One caution is to never put on a topcoat late in the day and leave the part outside if there is any possibility of a dew forming later in the evening. You can wind up with a total loss of gloss that way and, without using a hardener, there is probably no recovery possible except for repainting. Been there, done that. Also, if you are using a full sized gun, don't have any dirt laying around like you see in the picture showing the surfacer being applied. If you are in a dirt area, lay down a clean tarp or something or the higher air flow will kick up particles into the paint. I normally hang parts from a skyhook (raised bucket loader) to get at all sides of the part easily. The reason I did it as shown in that picture was because I was only doing one side so the part did not have to be repositioned. Plus my spotgun doesn't have a large air flow so dust pickup is minimal and it was not a topcoat.

If you are unable to prime right after cleaning, I do think you should protect the metal in some way, even if you keep it out of the rain. I suggest considering a product like the Picklex 20 to protect the metal until you can prime. But only if you are down to bare metal on the entire part. I am uncomfortable about putting acid-based products over anything but bare metal. If you have a typical situation where you have a combination of bare metal and old, sound paint, on the same part I would consider spot priming as you go - even if you don't fully complete a part in a single session. Use something like the Preval Sprayer and mix up a small amount of epoxy primer using tablespoons as a measure. You can use just the powerhead (less than $5) with the pickup tube stuck in a 3oz paper drinking cup. The only issue in doing it this way is you will get outside the time window for topcoating and when the time comes, you should scuff sand and reapply a coat of epoxy prior to continuing. The reason I selected the Picklex in this case was because I started when it was too cold to paint (in the 40's). I figured I'd get the sandblasting done while it was cold and protect the metal until it got warm enough later to prime. Well, we had a couple nice days awhile back but it didn't last long enough for me to get the topcoat on. Doesn't look like I am going to in the next several days either since the forecast looks either rainy or not getting above the low 60's.

Thanks for the kind words. I don't claim to be any expert in this stuff, but have been doing spray painting in a backyard, DIY type of operation for myself for quite a while. It really isn't hard...at least if one doesn't have the expectation of a Mercedes class show vehicle the first time out. That's simply not going to happen and anyone that thinks it will is going to get very frustrated. I think the biggest problem confronting a beginner is trying to deal with the multitude of complex (and expensive) products out there from different manufacturers, all having compatibility and safety issues to deal with and perhaps compromise on. It's a lot more complicated than a can of Rustoleum and a paintbrush. After the products can be nailed down, it's fairly easy and only requires some actual practice to yield perfectly good results. At least in my opinion.

The 3M Flowable Finishing Putty is like standard "Bondo" plastic filler except it is very smooth and has a more liquid consistency. It is a two part, polyester-based product that you mix up with a creme hardener just like you would plastic filler. After mixing up by stirring well until you get a uniform color change, you can apply it to the surface by spreading with the same flexible rubber or plastic spreader that is also used to spread plastic filler. It is called "flowable" but I don't think it really flows that much. It's not like the consistency of water or paint or anything like that. You have to spread it around in some way. You'd have to use small amounts at a time on vertical surfaces because the excess would sag and fall off before you could get it spread out. If you are familiar with the old fashioned lacquer-based spot putties that are the consistency of tooth paste, this stuff is a little runnier than that. The instructions say you can brush it on. You probably could but I haven't tried it that way. This two-part putty fills the need for something in between a body filler and a surfacer, just like the older one-part "spot" putties did. Being a two-part product, it cures by chemical reaction of the parts and not by evaporation of solvents like the one-part products. Later shrinkage is therefore less likely to be a problem. It sands like a standard plastic body filler - not quite as easily as a surfacer, so power sanding would be advisable. As I indicated in one of the pictures, 80 grit works well. Usually, one would apply a surfacer later anyway so the 80 grit scratches are not an issue, especially if done with an RO sander.

On that fender I underestimated the depth of the pits on the top areas. The surfacer didn't fill them as easily as I had hoped. After a double shot of four surfacer coats each and a lot of tedious hand sanding, I realized I should have smeared the 3M stuff over most of the fender instead of just the area shown. That would have reduced the amount of hand sanding. Pits are a real PITA to deal with. In many cases, except for the main hood areas and fenders, they are not worth bothering with unless one is a fanatic about it. Wherever a better gloss is desirable however, they have to be dealt with. Small imperfections will show, even be magnified, after the topcoat is applied.

There is a sprayable version of polyester filler that is marketed by some companies, including in the PPG OMNI line of products. I have never tried that. I don't think I could use it in my spot gun anyway since the fluid tip is already on the small side for a surfacer and I would expect it to be too small for a more heavily-bodied product like a sprayable polyester. The film build appears to be about twice that of a surfacer per coat.

Here's the link to the available 3M putties, including both the one and two-part varieties.

Rod

Ty has a good point on color matching. I am not going to criticize S-W or any other paint manufacturer but I believe that a listed cross reference from one manufacturer to another, even if within the same basic chemistry, does not guarantee the identical shade. It probably is close, but it may not be perfect, especially if you can compare them side-by-side. CNKS also has a good point that it can depend on the care the guy/gal doing the mixing (usually of several different tints) brings to the job. I recommend you buy the minimum amount of color only (no other ingredients) first to check out the shade. If it looks promising, get some of the recommended hardener and reducer and do a test sprayout to confirm your choice. This can avoid surprises later after you have invested several hundred $$$ in a variety of compatible materials only to be unhappy with the resulting shade.

When I was researching the persian orange color for my AC-B, I looked at Martin Senour (NAPA) which I understand is re-branded S-W, DuPont and PPG. In Martin Senour there were several different color formulas that were called that color for AC. The color chips I observed at the store all looked similar - and none seemed correct! I am sure there was a difference but I would have had to buy some of each to check it out before spending a lot. By contrast, PPG had only two formulas listed for that persian orange. I bought the one that I thought was correct first, only to find out it had too much red in it for a decent match. It was a later version of the same color that AC used. In my case I didn't have to go as far as a test sprayout. I could tell right away from just a paintbrush swab. Fortunately, I was only out the cost of a quart of paint ($13). The other formula turned out to be the correct one for my purpose.

I would think it unusual for a particular paint company to not have competitors in the same general area. Both DuPont and PPG have jobber locators on their websites if you want to further investigate other possibilities. You might be surprised what winds up to be in your back yard :o). I have three major competitors, all within a dozen miles. In any event, you should stick with a supplier that is reasonably close.

Frank Stalfire is a DuPont rep and if he reads this thread he'll likely have some good recommendations for you for non-iso solutions that can safely be used with a standard cartridge type respirator. In the meantime here's my thoughts on the DuPont line-up in that category:

Topcoat possibilities:

Centari Acrylic Enamel - 1K version only (the other two field mixes require iso-containing additives) the tech sheet is here. This is a very well known older AE, now in DuPont's Fleet line. It's quite pricey for what it is nowadays in comparison to other products. I've used it in the past and like it very much.

NASON Fast Dry Acrylic Enamel - A lower cost alternative to Centari. The tech sheet is here. I have never used this product so have no personal comment other than it's a non-iso product.

Surfacer possibilities:

Fill and Sand (131S) - An inexpensive, acrylic primer-surfacer (lacquer based). The tech sheet is here. I have used this product a lot in the past. It is now pretty much outdated because of the urethane products but is still a good choice for those w/o fresh air equipment.

There other non-iso (1K, so called) surfacer products in DuPont's economy NASON line but I am not familiar with their designations and have never used them.

Primer possibilities:

Definitely epoxy (although DuPont seems to always push their etch primers). There are epoxies in the Chroma System line, the Fleet line and the NASON economy line. I have never used any of them (I use a PPG product that is similar) and am not familiar with their designations. I would expect the Fleet and NASON products would be the more appropriate for the economy minded, considering the type of products that you will be putting over them. Generally, there are no isocyanates in an epoxy catalyst but I have never checked the MSDS for the DuPont epoxy products. I wouldn't expect find any there but it would be worthwhile for you to verify it.

DuPont also has an industrial line up of products that I would expect to have some non-iso solutions but I know nothing about them. If Frank doesn't get into this thread because of the S-W tiltle (:o)), I'd start a new one with his name as part of it. That way he'll be sure to see it and respond. He'll be able to point to the specific DuPont products available to you that I am not familiar with. Also since your source is 30 miles away, make sure you call ahead first about any possible product. Not all DuPont jobbers carry the entire line up of products so what you are looking for might not be readily available where you think it should be.

Be careful with the Sherwin Williams paint. MAKE SURE IT MATCHES. I painted my "M" and and in the right light it looks pink. In pictures it looks awesome, but upclose it looks pinkish. I made sure it was mixed according to the paint can and shook it well before i used it. I now have to redo the paint job that took hours to prepare. You may be able to tell what the paint looks like when you open the lid on the can after the guys at the store mix it. When I opened my paint can the color looked off and slightly pinkish, but there was a dry sample spot on the top of the lid that looked close to the color I wanted so I went with it. Big mistake.

Just thought I would let you know.