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Tractor Pulling Discussion Forum

NCIATPAI BANQUET

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BUD BARENIE

11-08-2003 13:58:02




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BY THE TIME THIS HAS BEEN POSTED THE NCIATPAI
BANQUET WILL BE OVER.
FOR MY SELF 2003 WAS A REMERABLE YEAR FOR TRACTOR PULLING !!! FOR MY SECOND YEAR I LEARNED MORE ABOUT ENGINES, TRACK CONDITIONS AND THE OVERALL LEARNIG CURVE OF TRACTOR PULLING !!! IT'S AMAZING HOW YOU CAN PLAN SO MANY THINGS AND A SIMPLE LITTLE THING LIKE DIRT CHANGED EVERYTHING!!
THE REASON FOR THIS POSTING (RULE CHANGES) IN FARM STOCK I WOULD ASK THE BOARD FOR SEVERAL RULE CHANGES !
1) ELIMINATE THE 0-4500LB CLASS
2) CREATE A 4501LB-5000LB CLASS
3) CREATE A 5000LB-5501LB CLASS
LEAVE THE REST OF THE CLASSES THE SAME!!!
NEW RULES ALSO 1) FRONT WEIGHT BRACKETS FOR STOCK CLASS! WITH A STANDARD RULE FOR ALL TRACTORS (2FT EXTENSION) MAXIMIUM!
2) FARM STOCK (BORE AND STROKING!!! CAN WE REGULATE WHAT A MAN CREATES UNDER THE HOOD !!!! I DON'T THINK SO !!!!! JUST LIKE TRACTION CONTROL, I DIDN'T SEE ANY TRACTORS CHECKED THIS SUMMER !!!!! WHAT SHOULD THE RULE BOOK SAY ??
THE CLUB AS IS , VERY GOOD !!! THE SLED, THE TOUGHER THE BETTER. WHAT EVER IT TAKES TO MAKE PULLING MORE COMPETITIVE WOULD BE ALL OUR GOAL !!!


2004 SHALL BE INTERESTING ENJOY THE WINTER !!!
AND SEE ALL OF YOU NEXT YEAR !!!!
BUD BARENIE FAMILY

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BUD BARENIE

11-10-2003 07:18:52




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 Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to BUD BARENIE, 11-08-2003 13:58:02  
FAIR PULLING
I HAVE PULLED THIS YEAR AN SEEN ONE TRACTOR HAVE A HUGE ADVANTAGE OVER THE REST OF THE CLASS IN FARM STOCK! A MM-G. 440CI + AND 18.4-34 TIRES !!
I PURCHASED A MM-G TO COMPETE AGAINST THIS TRACTOR!! I AM GOING TO PETITION JERRY GRADY AND CHAD BERGER TO EITHER ELIMINATE OR ALLOW THE 18.4-34 TIRE RULING AS IT STANDS RITE NOW !!! IF IT'S ALLOWED THAN A HORSE POWER BATTLE WILL START . SO IN MY OPINION THAT TIRE SIZE SHOULD BE TERMINATED. FARM STOCK 15.5-38 LARGEST TIRE SIZE !!!! I FEEL IF FRONT BRACKET'S ARE ALLOWED THAN ALL OTHER WEIGHTS NEED TO BE ATTACHED IN STOCK LOCATION !!! HANGING CHAINS ALL OVER IS STUPID !!!TO KEEP A OUR CLUB IN THE GREAT FASHION THAT IT'S IN RIGHT NOW LET'S PAY CLOSE ATTENTION TO THE EXCEPTION'S AND FOLLOW THE RULES!!
WE ALL TRY TO HIDE SECRETS, IN FARM STOCK!! IF YOU CAN'T SEE IT !!!!! BUT IF WE MAINTAIN TIRE SIZE, A NO-STROKE LAW,(EXCEPTION-M@W STUFF)RPM'S THE CLUB WILL STAY IN A VERY COMPETETIVE FASHION AND CONTINUE TO GROW!!!!!WHEN I'VE DONE JUST ABOUT EVERY THING I CAN LEGALLY, AND CAN'T RUN DOWN A MM-G IT'S EITHER ME DRIVING WRONG OR THE OTHER TRACTOR IS BETTER AND DRIVER WAS BETTER !!!

IN THIS CASE , I'VE HAD THE MOTOR ON THE MONEY , GREAT HOOKS GOING AND I CAN'T RUN DOWN 18.4-34'S WITH 400+ CBES UNDER THE HOOD !!! I'M NOT WHINNG AT ALL. SO, I EITHER PULL THE (G) WITH 18.4-34 OR WE GET BACK TO FAIR TRACTOR PULLING FOR ALL THE CLUB !!! MY 22CENTS WORTH !!
APREACIATE ALL THE RESPONCE !!!!! 2004 WILL BE A GREAT SEASON. I KNOW THE BOARD MEMEBERS WILL MAKE THE CORRECT DECISIONS FOR ALL CLUB MEMBERS AND FUTURE CLUB GROWTH !!!!!

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A.P.

11-11-2003 02:28:02




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 Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to BUD BARENIE, 11-10-2003 07:18:52  
It actually sounds like you already have all the rules you need. I can't see a G Moline with cast center rear wheels pulling in anything lighter than the 6500# class. The larger tire size probably is less of an "advantage" than most people credit it with. Besides a Wheatland or standard tread tractor will look pretty strange on those tall skinny tires. How about an 830 JD on 15.5x38 pressed center rims in the 7500 class?

There are several reasons why they may be beating you: 1) More power. 2) A stock fast first gear. 3) A little better at reading the track. 4) A little better at driving the track. 5) A bit better at balancing the tractor.

I pull and Oliver 88 standard with factory size 15-30 (18.4x30") rear tires plus cast centers and do not do nearly as well as I would like. I also pull an 18-27 Oliver/Hart Parr in the 4500 and 5500 local antique classes and do much better on it with a set of 12.4x38" (talk about skinny) rears.

My recommenation is to keep your rules in place to try and limit the horsepower. Keep you MPH limit at whatever speed it is et at or even drop it lower.

Good luck with your rules meeting. They are always fun no matter where you go.

A.P.

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W ANGLEMYER

11-10-2003 17:58:03




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 Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to BUD BARENIE, 11-10-2003 07:18:52  
BUDD THAT TIRE SIZE IS A 1960 RULE THAT SHOULD HAVE BIN TAKEN CARE OF BUT WHEN THE SAME MAN HAS BEEN ON THE BOARD FOR 15 YEARS HE IS HARD TO GHANGE WHEN HE IS THE ONE WITH THE WESTERN TEACTOR



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ChadS

11-10-2003 22:14:40




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 Re: Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to W ANGLEMYER, 11-10-2003 17:58:03  
How true that is..



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ChadS

11-10-2003 11:03:52




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 Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to BUD BARENIE, 11-10-2003 07:18:52  
Well said. This is a political time of year. like elections,, laws are changed.. same in pulling. Voters,, take a stand and let your voice be heard. The pullers,, should be the ones who decide what they want in the class rules. If what rules there is is not what club members want,,, then petition the board of directors, and ask for a change. Remember, those questionares that was a the meeting were not vote slips,, they were comentary. Talk to the board.. pullers,,, be heard.. PS Pressed steel rims!!!! Always antagonizing,,, LOL ChadS

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dctom

11-10-2003 10:35:53




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 Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to BUD BARENIE, 11-10-2003 07:18:52  
Bud barenie: you are 100% correct on that one, we do need a rule change there for sure,but if they give us a 5000# class i am going to drop down and let him pull by himself DCTOM



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AC

11-10-2003 09:34:29




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 Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to BUD BARENIE, 11-10-2003 07:18:52  
I agree with the tire size. How can someone keep up with a tractor(s) that makes the same or more horse power but is allowed to get more of it to the ground? I understand that they weigh more, and in percentage that works against you, but it also gives the tractor more a$$ to pull a good distance, increasing box travel. It's a lot cheaper and cost efficient to limit tires than make everyone get into a HP battle. My 2 cents...

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ChadS

11-09-2003 11:29:34




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 Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to BUD BARENIE, 11-08-2003 13:58:02  
One large problems in pulling is rule enforcement. Lots of clubs have rules that are there but never enforced. As far as farm stock catagory is concerned, I think the rules could be altered a bit, but, the problem is where to start. You are right about tractors with enhanced engines. That is why, instead of having a lot of useless engine rules, like we have had in the past, we adopted a speed limit and a first gear rule. Now true, not all tractors have the same speed in first, but most could be altered with tire size, or other Factory options to keep up with the speed limits. I do like the idea of letting the farm classes run suitcase weights.. Having a 24in, limit of the front, and other custom brackets in other locations should be allowed. Not everyone who pulls, still run weights in the factory locations like we do,, If we let suitcase weights in,, other tractors will come to the pulls, thus,,, club revenues increase, and safety will be better. Why not adopt a division 2 rules, as far as the setup of the tractor is concerned??? In the past,, it was a HP game in the farmstock classes in the NCIATPA. But remember,, it is a percentage pull in our club. Sure a puller needs to have enough power to make a good pull, and be competitive. We do need to acknowledge that there is no such thing as a stock pulling tractor in our club. Unless it is local class tractor,,, We do still need a 3250-4500 class, in farmstock,,, we have to let in light tractors have the opportunity to hook to the sled. STROKERS IN FARMSTOCK,,,,, , I am not for sure what to think about a stroker engine in these tractors. I know, that if it was allowed,, I would have my stroker H in a farm class. But,,,,, Too many people would be arguing about having to pull against a modified tractor in the class. I guess we will have to wait and see what evolves in the future. I would say,, lets try not to change too many rules at once,,, The suitcase weights will change the competition level in these classes. Just my opinions,,,, ChadS

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AC

11-09-2003 20:48:02




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 Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to ChadS, 11-09-2003 11:29:34  
Y'all can look at my name and know that I am not a member, yet, but I am up here in Michigan trying to get a tractor built to run with your club. Actually, there are 3 of us, who would all be members, and become involved with the pulls. I'm putting in my two cents because I can. I don't think that strokers should be allowed in the farm stock class because of the added cost. I will have enough wrapped up in my tractor by the time I am done. The LAST thing I need to do is go out and buy a custom crank. I think that it would discourage others from competeing because if they didn't have a big money engine, they would be at a serious handicap. Even in a percentage pull, there is no replacement for displacement. If you want a mountain motor, that's why there is the modified class. Farm stock, strictly in my opinion, should be left fairly open other than the motor rules. This way, others can come over from other clubs..etc...Bud has a good point, it really is a pain to tech everyone's motor in order to ensure a level playing field. Maybe I am just still bitter because we got out of Dirt Late Model racing for close to the same reasons I see happening here. Ran a good class, affordable but fast. The track kept making subtle changes, like weight, tire and rim size, then big stuff like aluminum heads, full front tube clips. Before you could turn around, you were running a full blown late model instead of a super stock. Only cost about 3 times as much. And for what? A bunch of big boys to come in each week and clean house over the locals who used to be track champions. It really didn't bring in any more cars, just deeper pockets. Took the fun right the he!! out of it. And isn't this sport about having FUN? Hate to see it happen to NCIATPAI, its a good club. ..... ..... ..all have a good winter, hope I didn't upset anyone..You can all yell at me now!..... .AC

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W ANGLEMYER

11-09-2003 14:45:40




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 Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to ChadS, 11-09-2003 11:29:34  
CHADS I AM EOR SOME DIV. 2 HITCH SUITCASE WEIGHTS BUT STAY IN FIRST AND THEN I DONT CARE HOW MANY STROKED ENGINES THERE ARE WESTERN TRACTORS SHOULD NOT HAVE OPTION ON TIRES OTHER THEN DIV 2 STATES IN RULES RIGHT DCTOM



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ChadS

11-09-2003 17:50:02




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 Re: Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to W ANGLEMYER, 11-09-2003 14:45:40  
I am all for a div 2 setup for our farm classes. As time will pass, lots of other tractors from around the northern part of the state will probably come to more of our events. The hooks will increase and the farm stock boys will have a new challenge for competition. I Know I would be opening up a can of worms here but here is another possible rule change to talk about. We should allow pressed steel rims on farmstock tractors. Since we pull percentage, Where a pulling tractor could be more competitive if the tractor could use the weight class limits to their full advantage. Lets face it,, JD, Oliver, Massey, and others was offered with pressed steel, the farmalls did not, To me it would make sence for this type of rule change. It is only rims and weight. Another opinion,,, ChadS

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Donnie True

11-09-2003 18:58:41




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to ChadS, 11-09-2003 17:50:02  
Our club sounds about like yours. They won't let the Farmalls pull with press steel wheels, because they didn't come with them. But they won't let the red ones use our torque becaust theirs didn't come with one. This double standard stuff, I've never understood it. Our club for awhile wouldn't let you pull if you had wheelie bars on. But yet you could load your air breathers down with 150lbs full of lead. If your going to all that trouble make a weight bracket. Just a few of the off the wall stuff that goes on around here.

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dctom

11-09-2003 15:37:58




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 Re: Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to W ANGLEMYER, 11-09-2003 14:45:40  
AGREE. ANGLEIRON, ALSO NEED WEIGHT BRACKETS IN CENTER OF TRACTOR, WONT NEED SO MANY OF THOES UNMENTIONABLE 150 POUNDERS DC



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BUDD

11-09-2003 15:42:45




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to dctom, 11-09-2003 15:37:58  
All this talk about new rules! All I want is 5 more HP so I can maybe just posibly get me a jacket next year. I would even be happy with a HAT!

('';'') BUDD



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dctom

11-09-2003 16:50:44




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: NCIATPAI BANQUET in reply to BUDD, 11-09-2003 15:42:45  
hey budd; bring that over growen dandylion up here and we will slobber a little flambeau on it and maybe we can pick up 5 or 6 hp for you DC



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